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Forums - General - FBI Official Involved in Torture Interrogations Says They Did Not Work

Tyrannical said:

akuma587 said:

Nicely put.  I don't think sleep deprivation and starvation are inherently wrong as long as they are done reasonably.  If we are keeping someone up for a week straight, that's way too much.  If we aren't feeding them for days at a time, that is too much.

I don't understand how people can complain about big government but have no problem with the government doing all kinds of unspeakable things in backrooms in our country.  Big government that can throw you in a box and take away the key is the type of big government you should genuinely be afraid of.  You may not agree when the government grows in size, but at least it isn't going to strap you do a wooden horse and do all kinds of unspeakable things to you while playing re-runs of Green Acres. 

 

What an interesting insight into your psyche. I honestly think you may eventually come around to my way of thinking, as much as it abhors you now. As you grow older, you’ll lose some heart and gain some brain. Unless Winston Churchill was a liar.

No, just a drunk.

 



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ssj12 said:
akuma587 said:
MrBubbles said:
sometimes morality is irrelevant. when you work to save lives, you do whats effective.

So why not just nuke the Middle East and get it over with?  That would be the most effective.

 

 

because there is an art to warfare.

is your comment for or against nuking?  because im not sure if the middle east would look nice as a glass sculpture.

 



"I like my steaks how i like my women.  Bloody and all over my face"

"Its like sex, but with a winner!"

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Torture has only one purpose, to force people into confessing to things that that they didn't do!  I find it very interesting that the Bush administration started with the torturing when they needed to find a link (which didn't exist) between Iraq and Al Quaeda.



Switch: SW-5066-1525-5130

XBL: GratuitousFREEK

People would do well to remember that our government was created to serve our people not rule our people, government does not give us power or protection but rather we are the ones who give it power, we are the ones that should protect it

When our nation was formed, it was not to be another ruling class….we had just fought a war to get out from under that yoke. No our founding father wanted to create a system of government that would be by the people and for the people….look at that statement do you see for the people come first?

Doing things like this only goes to underhand our very fabric of government b/c we don’t give the people the power to have control, but rather the government the power and control

To much has been given to the government for our own protection, right now anyone of us may be declared an “enemy combatant” and hauled away from our friends, family, and loved one for no reason other then the government wants it that way, and there is nothing you can do about it. Me personally, I find that scary. And I feel for these people that have to go thru that guilty and innocent b/c no matter what law we break they will never get justice b/c we are acting in the name of justice.

The truly scary thing is many people don’t care anymore, they have become so wrapped up in false information, lies, and motives of revenge that they don’t care who they hurt, cheat, and lie to, as long as they get hurt, cheat, and lie. That is not only sad for our nation, that is sad for the world. Make no mistake we are the single most powerful nation in the world, if you will we are the beacon that burns the brightness but, no longer do we burn for the world to bring light to darkness….no we are now burning b/c of the world. The very fuel we want to provide for the world, democracy, free trade, civil liberties, free speech of ideals and beliefs are being hacked to pieces and used as fuel for or fire of blind justice, blind revenge.

So go on Try. And others keep believing that in order “save” America you need to use that fuel. Keep taking our foundations and reducing them to ash, but I ask you what will you have when everything you have hoped to protect you have destroyed?



 

akuma587 said:
Remind me to blow my brains out if I ever become more like you, Tyrannical.

 

 

Haha, Change what you can, accept what you can not.

I am not as heartless, cruel, or immoral as you think. I merely accept what can and can not be changed.

I really wish your naive view of the world was correct. But we don’t live in fantasy land and we often have to make tough decisions to survive. Perhaps you could familiarize yourself with some history? Any place or time will do before 1900.

 



Yet, today, America's leaders are reenacting every folly that brought these great powers [Russia, Germany, and Japan] to ruin -- from arrogance and hubris, to assertions of global hegemony, to imperial overstretch, to trumpeting new 'crusades,' to handing out war guarantees to regions and countries where Americans have never fought before. We are piling up the kind of commitments that produced the greatest disasters of the twentieth century.
 — Pat Buchanan – A Republic, Not an Empire

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I'd rather live in my fantasy world than your fantasy world where torture is morally acceptable. That sounds like a pretty shitty world.



We had two bags of grass, seventy-five pellets of mescaline, five sheets of high-powered blotter acid, a salt shaker half full of cocaine, a whole galaxy of multi-colored uppers, downers, screamers, laughers…Also a quart of tequila, a quart of rum, a case of beer, a pint of raw ether and two dozen amyls.  The only thing that really worried me was the ether.  There is nothing in the world more helpless and irresponsible and depraved than a man in the depths of an ether binge. –Raoul Duke

It is hard to shed anything but crocodile tears over White House speechwriter Patrick Buchanan's tragic analysis of the Nixon debacle. "It's like Sisyphus," he said. "We rolled the rock all the way up the mountain...and it rolled right back down on us...."  Neither Sisyphus nor the commander of the Light Brigade nor Pat Buchanan had the time or any real inclination to question what they were doing...a martyr, to the bitter end, to a "flawed" cause and a narrow, atavistic concept of conservative politics that has done more damage to itself and the country in less than six years than its liberal enemies could have done in two or three decades. -Hunter S. Thompson

akuma587 said:
I'd rather live in my fantasy world than your fantasy world where torture is morally acceptable. That sounds like a pretty shitty world.

 

 

I only wish we had a choice to actually live in fantasy land. I so wish it was possible. But alas, in the real world we have to make tough choices to survive.

Your morality isn't as absolute as you think. I really do think you’ll come around to my way of thinking. But it may take you a while to accept it.

 

 



Yet, today, America's leaders are reenacting every folly that brought these great powers [Russia, Germany, and Japan] to ruin -- from arrogance and hubris, to assertions of global hegemony, to imperial overstretch, to trumpeting new 'crusades,' to handing out war guarantees to regions and countries where Americans have never fought before. We are piling up the kind of commitments that produced the greatest disasters of the twentieth century.
 — Pat Buchanan – A Republic, Not an Empire

There was a reason for why the men and women of this land died...to create this country based a few principles of freedom, justice etc.


People like Tyrannical decided to accept what a few scared politicians decided to do as the only way one can protect themselves from something they do not understand. They forget, however, that before this country was made, there were people who thought the Revolution will not succeed. They forget a time when it was normal for soldiers to kick them out of their homes and use for barracks, when they could be tortured without any rights and assumed guilty before innocent, a time when there was rampant taxation w/o representation, etc.

They forget that it used to be a naive thought that there could be a nation based on the principles of justice and freedom.

And now? People spit on their sacrifices and graves because they got scared and wanted the easy way out? Pathetic...just pathetic.



Explanation of sig:

I am a Pakistani.....my name is Dan....how hard is that? (Don't ask about the 101...apparantely there are more of me out there....)

If we had a world full of people as tolerant as pakidan the world would be a nicer place to live.



Yet, today, America's leaders are reenacting every folly that brought these great powers [Russia, Germany, and Japan] to ruin -- from arrogance and hubris, to assertions of global hegemony, to imperial overstretch, to trumpeting new 'crusades,' to handing out war guarantees to regions and countries where Americans have never fought before. We are piling up the kind of commitments that produced the greatest disasters of the twentieth century.
 — Pat Buchanan – A Republic, Not an Empire

The Constitution protects everyone, both the good and the bad people. If anything, the evidence strongly suggests that they went out of their way when writing the Constitution to protect bad people.  I think that Tyrannical is far more naive than they were.



We had two bags of grass, seventy-five pellets of mescaline, five sheets of high-powered blotter acid, a salt shaker half full of cocaine, a whole galaxy of multi-colored uppers, downers, screamers, laughers…Also a quart of tequila, a quart of rum, a case of beer, a pint of raw ether and two dozen amyls.  The only thing that really worried me was the ether.  There is nothing in the world more helpless and irresponsible and depraved than a man in the depths of an ether binge. –Raoul Duke

It is hard to shed anything but crocodile tears over White House speechwriter Patrick Buchanan's tragic analysis of the Nixon debacle. "It's like Sisyphus," he said. "We rolled the rock all the way up the mountain...and it rolled right back down on us...."  Neither Sisyphus nor the commander of the Light Brigade nor Pat Buchanan had the time or any real inclination to question what they were doing...a martyr, to the bitter end, to a "flawed" cause and a narrow, atavistic concept of conservative politics that has done more damage to itself and the country in less than six years than its liberal enemies could have done in two or three decades. -Hunter S. Thompson