Exactly what don't you believe? That's exactly what American taxation is like.

I'll give you an example from my actual work stub:

Income Earned: $5,025

• Federal Income Taxes: $598
• Medicare: $70
• Social Security: $301
• State Income Taxes: $122

That's 21.7% + State Sales Tax (7.0% where I live, on all purchases) on whatever I buy, which equals out to about 28.7%. I make $30,000/yr on salary, so I am certainly in the lower section of taxation. In my case, every 4th paycheck goes to the government for FIT, Medicare, SS, and SIT alone. If you are on welfare, or the like, you keep your money, and do not get taxed on it.

Now, in my case:

• I will never use medicare (I have private health insurance through my company)
• I will never withdrawl from Social Security (virtually useless. Will put about 1/2 what is taken out in SS into a 401k or other investment and make far, far more)
• I was never publically schooled. I was home schooled, and my education cost under $500/yr

Yet I pay for them. Crazy world with crazy taxes. I think that some of the people arguing on these forums about taxation have never paid taxes, and realized how their money gets spent. Americans constantly argue about minimum/living wages, but fail to realize that a large part of what could be living wages are taken out via taxation, and not due to minimum standards.

Why are you so willing to assume that, 100% of the time, that the person cannot help their predicament?

I'll give you a little life-tip: People aren't created equal. But people also do not put equal effort into their life or lifestyle. If a man decides to not work out of laziness, should you provide food for him? If a man smokes, uses heavy drugs, and develops complications from that, should you pay extra (while living healthy yourself) to ensure the sick man that lived poorly is taken care of?

If you live smartly, invest your money wisely, and have a good job because your motivated, should someone forcefully take from you to give to someone that lives stupidly, blows their money on useless goods, has no job 'just cuz'? I don't see life that way. That's why there are some like Mafoo, and myself that believe that all men are created equal, but not everyone puts the same effort into their life and lifestyle, and should not expect to recieve the same reward. If a man works hard, gets promotions - should he not benefit from it? Shouldn't a person that lives dangerously be punished by the reprocussions of his bad actions?

Well, although I'm not sure about you paying over 35% in taxes, it's certainly conceivable. But I am completely sure that you are wrong about the lowest 30% not paying any taxes, unless you are only talking about income taxes and not payroll taxes or any other taxes -- which is pretty meaningless for such a discussion IMO.

Exactly what don't you believe? That's exactly what American taxation is like.

I'll give you an example from my actual work stub:

Income Earned: $5,025

• Federal Income Taxes: $598
• Medicare: $70
• Social Security: $301
• State Income Taxes: $122

That's 21.7% + State Sales Tax (7.0% where I live, on all purchases) on whatever I buy, which equals out to about 28.7%. I make $30,000/yr on salary, so I am certainly in the lower section of taxation. In my case, every 4th paycheck goes to the government for FIT, Medicare, SS, and SIT alone. If you are on welfare, or the like, you keep your money, and do not get taxed on it.

Now, in my case:

• I will never use medicare (I have private health insurance through my company)
• I will never withdrawl from Social Security (virtually useless. Will put about 1/2 what is taken out in SS into a 401k or other investment and make far, far more)
• I was never publically schooled. I was home schooled, and my education cost under $500/yr

Yet I pay for them. Crazy world with crazy taxes. I think that some of the people arguing on these forums about taxation have never paid taxes, and realized how their money gets spent. Americans constantly argue about minimum/living wages, but fail to realize that a large part of what could be living wages are taken out via taxation, and not due to minimum standards.

how can you be trusted to give them that money? what if most people dont give that money? you then have poverty and your workforce shrinks, now instead of a 25 farmers, 5 of which are less able, you have 20 farmers, less work can be done

I could respond to some of the things you have said, but I don't have to.  You are complaining that despite relatively low income you pay a lot in taxes.  He is complaining (in this exchange) that people with low income DON'T pay taxes.

Many do not.

What does a human deserve? Everything possible, even if it makes those around him get far less than their capable of? 

If you really believed in that 'humans deserve everything' stuff, I think you should take every dime you earn, and send it to Africa/South Asia to ensure that they get what you believe every human needs.

So you put trust in government, but not the people. I put trust in the people, not the government.

If you really believed in that 'humans deserve everything' stuff, I think you should take every dime you earn, and send it to Africa/South Asia to ensure that they get what you believe every human needs.

What is your effective tax rate after deductions and everything?

I like the idea of not being taxed for things you don't use. For example: I haven't had certain treatments for cancer, so any money that ends up going for research shouldn't be my tax dollars. I don't have kids, why pay taxes for local schools? I don't really care about being invaded so I don't want money going to arms services. I have a gun so I don't want police. I walk everywhere, so I don't need to pay for roads. < I like the idea of every individual selecting what they don't want to pay for because they personally won't need it. That's the kind of society I could get behind.  

I've paid taxes. I owed California 600 bucks a couple years ago, I guess they didn't take out enough (I paid taxes, am I now more qualified to debate something or have an opinion? Oh boy!)