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Forums - Gaming Discussion - Memory Bandwith!!!

darendt on 05 January 2009

Before proceeding, we need to explain a little of the unique manner in which the PS3’s much-admired, phenomenally powerful Cell processor works. Essentially, it contains eight mini-processors called Synergistic Processor Units (SPUs), six of which can be given tasks to perform at any given time. Lemarchand continues: “It’s code that runs on SPUs, and it’s to do with things like animation compression, generalised compression and rendering optimisations. These guys are really old-school programmers: guys who are always looking to shave another cycle off an operation. And part of the skill of developing for the PlayStation 3 is getting the GPU to farm jobs out to the six SPUs – seeing which SPUs are idling and can take up some of the slack in a frame-to-frame kind of way.”

http://threespeech.com/blog/2008/08/naughty-dogs-richard-lemarchand-co-lead-game-designer-of-uncharted-talks-trophies-edge-cells-and-studios/

 

The above is a nice excert from an interview with Naughty dog.

http://www.us.playstation.com/uncharted/

This link is to a video from the devoloper detailing how the game streams a crapload of data at a time.Click on technology then Tech dive.

 

For the people that say this game isnt one of the best looking games to date, show me a game that has as much detail as this game. The shadows form each individual leaf as the wind blows, or from different angles, the fluidity of the water, the character animations and textures for environment.



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selnor on 05 January 2009
darendt said:
selnor said:
MikeB said:
@ selnor

No way they stated they maxed out the PS3, running into some bottlenecks for which workarounds exist is not the same as maxing out the hardware. Memory usage is always a moving target, code optimisations, streaming, procedural synthesis (Cell rules at this) vs pre-baked asset memory footprints, etc all effect memory usage.

Look up how much memory the Neo Geo had compared to PCs of its time and then compare the games. Or before that compare 80s and early nineties games for the older entry model Amiga 500 vs games for top PCs with tons more memory to rely on of the time.

Why do people never read articles properly? M8 there is more than 20 articles about the problems of RFG on PS3. From different sites.

Quote from Sean Kennedy

"Kennedy even stressed how hard Red Faction: Guerilla is pushing the current-gen technology and then says that the lack of memory on PlayStation3 causes a additional headache."

“I mean, to be honest, we are pushing the Xbox 360 and PlayStation3 to the limits,” he says. “I mean, not only has it been a balancing act making destruction work with the gameplay and making it all come together in a cohesive way that’s fun, but it’s been a balancing act getting the game to run on the systems.”

"The games Associate Producer Sean Kennedy has just admitted to CVG that the extra help was needed to bring the PlayStation3 version up to speed with the Xbox 360 version"

Notice they needed help just to get it up to speed with the 360 version. Also notice it says pushing the 360 AND PS3 to the limits???????????

http://www.gamercenteronline.net/2008/11/01/volition-we-struggled-with-ps3-red-faction

http://www.videogaming247.com/2008/10/31/volition-we-struggled-with-ps3-red-faction

http://www.ps3news.com/story/title/volition-we-struggled-with-playstation-3-red-faction

http://www.destructoid.com/ps3-development-of-red-faction-didn-t-go-so-smoothly-109816.phtml

 I have said before anyone who thinks the PS3 is more powerful than the 360 lives in LALA Sony land. It's pure bonkers. And constantly games prove that. Never once have I seen the PS3 outperform my 360. And thats after completing MGS4 and Uncharted on a 1080P HD television. Courtesy of Lavaskajunkie.

 

So it sounds to me like they are developing first on the 360. If that is the case, it makes it much harder to get it running on the PS3 due its need for optimization.

 

What strikes me from the comment though is that they may have needed a little extra help to get it running on the PS3, but it was done. So really, according to all the 360 people who say the 360 has double the memory the PS3 has, they were able to due it on the PS3 with half the resources. So they maxed out the 360 with 512MB and were able to achieve the same with only 256MB? Seems to me the PS3 muct be doing something right.

 

That last statment just wreakes or blatant fanboyism. MGS4 and Uncharted both PWN any game the 360 has out today. Every game on the PS3 PWNS the 360 in terms of audio as well. Most are THX certified games and run in true 5+.1 audio. Maybe you need to check the settings on your PS3. I would bet you are just like the hundreds of people I have had to adjust the settings for for HD output. I have even done this for Wii and 360 owners. Most of these people were complaining about the BD movies looking like DVD movies and the games not looking that good. They all had very nice TVs and were hooked up with either HDMI or Component. A quick trip to the settings menu and there jaws dropped.

To me it's the other way around. I think it's complete fanboyism to not accept that the 360 currently wins on graphics. But again thats why we have opinions. Gears 2 for me easily beats Uncharted and MGS4. Act 2 - 5 are gobsmacking. More texture detail, more stuff onscreen at once, and more scale. As I posted above Kingdom Under Fire 2 is the best visual game in development, followed by Alan Wake and Heavy Rain.

I hate to say me and my mates know how to get the best from our setups. 2 of us used to work in the TV industry and 1 currently works @ Panasonic shop. (Panasonic the best TV's money can buy).

 



darendt on 05 January 2009

http://www.naughtydog.com/corporate/press/GDC%202008/UnchartedTechGDC2008.pdf

Here is a very good PDF from Naughty Dog explaining in very good detail what parts of the PS3 are used for what, how the memory is split up and used and what tools they are using.

 

Yeah, I repair TVs for a living. Panasonic is a very good TV, but I would not say itsthe best. Pioneer Elite still holds that award. Deeper blacks than anyone.



selnor on 05 January 2009

I couldnt care less how the 360 or PS3 is used. Visually there is nothing in Uncharted and MGS4 that beat Gear 2 to me. Gears 2 imo is a step up from those games.

Also this is why I think Gears 2 is the best looking game.

The moment at 3:10 is the single most gobsmacking moment this gen.



darendt on 05 January 2009
selnor said:

I couldnt care less how the 360 or PS3 is used. Visually there is nothing in Uncharted and MGS4 that beat Gear 2 to me. Gears 2 imo is a step up from those games.

Also this is why I think Gears 2 is the best looking game.

The moment at 3:10 is the single most gobsmacking moment this gen.

 

Your reply says it all, you dont care about detail. That is why 360 fans are up in arms and giddy about inferior GFX. You look at a shiney character and good textures on 1 rock and say OMFG those GFX are insane. There is so much more going on in real time in a game like Uncharted than most other games. The detail is staggering.

 

 

For the OP, the link below should answer your question. XDR is the future, not DDRx



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selnor on 05 January 2009
darendt said:
selnor said:

I couldnt care less how the 360 or PS3 is used. Visually there is nothing in Uncharted and MGS4 that beat Gear 2 to me. Gears 2 imo is a step up from those games.

Also this is why I think Gears 2 is the best looking game.

The moment at 3:10 is the single most gobsmacking moment this gen.

 

Your reply says it all, you dont care about detail. That is why 360 fans are up in arms and giddy about inferior GFX. You look at a shiney character and good textures on 1 rock and say OMFG those GFX are insane. There is so much more going on in real time in a game like Uncharted than most other games. The detail is staggering.

 

 

For the OP, the link below should answer your question. XDR is the future, not DDRx

I have fully played Uncharted. Gears 2 at some points has double the onscreen action of any part of Uncharted. Anyone who has played the to will vouch that.

Also WTF? Gears 2 is praised constantly for it's intricate attention to detail. With even PS3 fans on this very site saying the textures are more detailed than MGS4 and Uncharted. If you havent finished Gears 2 dont comment. The game goes absolutely mental. And how you can watch the video above and talk about detail (the first time you see the cave, the scale, EVERY texture, and the water (oh the water) it's like I said the first time Ive had to blink. I expect KZ2 will top it, but by the end of 2009 Alan Wake, Heavy Rain and KUF 2 will own KZ2. Your statement about 360 is blind fanboyism and laughable.

Notice I mention 2 PS3 exclusive that I'm looking forward to in graphics? At least I'm not blind when games on 360 look better.