To those McCain (aka McBushWarrr) supporters who say "socialism" to every idea suggested to make US economy better.

That is utterly non-sense since we already are a "Socialist" country because we HAVE to pay Taxes.

That is any country where People by Law have to pay Taxes is a "Socialist" country, where the wealth of the people is "distributed" to pay the Army, to pay the Senators, to pay for highways, to build Dams, etc. etc. toward running a better society. That is we do not pay Taxes to the Federal government, to States, etc. on a voluntary basis, we pay it at the threat of going to Jail at the point of literal Gun. So we already are a "Socialist" country because Government tells us that it is our obligation to pay Taxes and we have no right to say No. So we pay a whopping 30 to 40% of our Income in the many forms of Taxes that we pay: pay roll Taxes, Property Taxes, Sales Taxes, etc. etc. - aka our wealth is "distributed" to the Government who then distributes it for hopefully best causes.

So you see the right-wingers, whether Republicans or Democrats, but certainly more so the Republican, have been playing the Ultimate Con job on the American people for too long, that is:
** Paying Taxes is Capitalism
** But getting something for our Taxes, such as Universal health care, Universal education, etc. as Europeans get, that is "Socialism".

Which is indeed the Ultimate Con Job, the Ultimate theft because when you pay 30 to 40% of your income and get just about nothing for it, then that is indeed a Grand theft.

So the question is not that we are going to become "Socialist" if we implement a few social services,
because we already are a "Socialist" country because we HAVE to pay Taxes, because a good part of our wealth is distributed by IRS.

So the questions are:
1- How progressive should be our Taxes?
2- What should happen to our Taxes?

And in regard to question # 2, the questions then become:

1- Should it be wasted on unnecessary Wars, such as Iraq War, a country 10,000 Miles from us that did us NO harm

2- Should it be wasted on a Gargantuan Military budget, considering that US Military budget is larger than the Military budget of all countries on planet Earth combined while US GDP now is not even 20% of world GDP anymore

3- Should it be wasted on Big corporations and the Super rich

OR - Should our Taxes be invested in our people and country., in such ways as:

1- Offering American people with Universal health care, so Americans do not go bankrupt over something as basic
as health care, which they do now at the rate of about 2Mill per year while ZERO Europeans go bankrupt every year due to health care costs since they have universal health care. More about this subject here:
http://www.anoox.com/blog/uhc

2- Offering American people with Universal education so that every one who qualifies, grade wise, can go for higher education, up to PHD, for free, so that they know when they come out of college they are not facing $200,000 in debt or they have impoverished their parents for that amount and as a result not go for higher education. Why? Because ultimately nothing makes a country stronger and wealthier than a highly educated population. OTN, most Europeans have Universal education.

3- Building (Gas Free) fast and reliable public Transportation, as for example they have the TGV in France
and great Metro/Tram system in almost all European countries. Thus connecting almost every European
city with another, allowing its people to travel from almost any point to another via the (Gas Free, electric powered) and generally Government subsided public Transportation system.

And many other examples of ways that our Taxes can be spent/invested in the American people and cities rather than wasted on Unnecessary Wars and a Gargantuan Military, as a result of which our economy will do well again as is the case in Europe, as evident by Euro that is much more valuable than US Dollar, as evident by NO French banks having failed, as evident by ZERO French person having gone bankrupt last year due to health care costs, etc.etc. because European countries spend much more of their Taxes on their people and cities.

http://www.anoox.com/news/show_selected_article.php?article=32867

Thanks for the post, the only worthwhile read so far today. Remember, income tax didn't even exist in America until it was needed to pay war debts. How things have changed so much and yet people still know so little.

i agree...

im hardly going to read something that starts with a comment like that.

Arguing what socialism means is essentially arguing over semantics. Generally, though, socialism is seen as the left wing of the political spectrum, you need a lot more than a military, police force and dams to be on the left wing.

Well I think you have misinterpreted the political system that would actually be referred to as socialism.

Although, on a side note, I do agree with the hypocrisy that is present in US politics. Universal healthcare = communism, I spend lots of time laughing listening to many US political opinions aired in Canada.

Socialism is technically not a political system; a socio-economic system is an apt description. There are political systems that focus on implementing socialism, but most modern nations combine socialism and capitalism to varying degress. That is the case with the US. There are some instances of socialism in the US. For example, the Tennessee Valley Authority, Amtrak, and the postal system. What this means is the US is not socialistic but mixed. Also, there are ways to achieve universal health care and education without actually using socialism. The goals may be "socialistic," but the means to achieving them is not. I agree the War was a both a waste and a mistake-similar to most interventionist wars. The defense budget should be trimmed in certain areas, but it is not as gargantuan (as percentage of GDP) as you make it seem.

America like almost every country in the world is a mixed economy. It integrates socialism with capitalism. Like pretty much every country does to varying degrees. Things fluctuate with time and needs.

I try avoid to pay taxes, black market is where you need to be

 You missed out on a good thread then.