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Forums - General - Terrorist Organization Hamas prepared to chat with Obama

Hey, I hate the Religious Right, so obviously I hate America in its entirety. And obviously America could and never has done anything with the same level of organization as Hamas does in brainwashing its children. Ideological manipulation is something that is strictly forbidden in America, or something.



We had two bags of grass, seventy-five pellets of mescaline, five sheets of high-powered blotter acid, a salt shaker half full of cocaine, a whole galaxy of multi-colored uppers, downers, screamers, laughers…Also a quart of tequila, a quart of rum, a case of beer, a pint of raw ether and two dozen amyls.  The only thing that really worried me was the ether.  There is nothing in the world more helpless and irresponsible and depraved than a man in the depths of an ether binge. –Raoul Duke

It is hard to shed anything but crocodile tears over White House speechwriter Patrick Buchanan's tragic analysis of the Nixon debacle. "It's like Sisyphus," he said. "We rolled the rock all the way up the mountain...and it rolled right back down on us...."  Neither Sisyphus nor the commander of the Light Brigade nor Pat Buchanan had the time or any real inclination to question what they were doing...a martyr, to the bitter end, to a "flawed" cause and a narrow, atavistic concept of conservative politics that has done more damage to itself and the country in less than six years than its liberal enemies could have done in two or three decades. -Hunter S. Thompson

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Good... although I would prefer the US took no side in the Israel/Palestine conflict.



akuma587 said:
Hey, I hate the Religious Right, so obviously I hate America in its entirety. And obviously America could and never has done anything with the same level of organization as Hamas does in brainwashing its children. Ideological manipulation is something that is strictly forbidden in America, or something.

See what I mean.

The first line is sarcasm against my post. The rest is proving my point.



TheRealMafoo said:
akuma587 said:
Hey, I hate the Religious Right, so obviously I hate America in its entirety. And obviously America could and never has done anything with the same level of organization as Hamas does in brainwashing its children. Ideological manipulation is something that is strictly forbidden in America, or something.

See what I mean.

The first line is sarcasm against my post. The rest is proving my point.

Hamas's actions are equally deplorable.  Brainwashing children into religious or political zealots is just about the most despicable thing a person could do, and I think any group that practices it is just plain despicable. 

I just think it is strange how we act like radical religious indoctrination is something that only happens in the Middle East.

 



We had two bags of grass, seventy-five pellets of mescaline, five sheets of high-powered blotter acid, a salt shaker half full of cocaine, a whole galaxy of multi-colored uppers, downers, screamers, laughers…Also a quart of tequila, a quart of rum, a case of beer, a pint of raw ether and two dozen amyls.  The only thing that really worried me was the ether.  There is nothing in the world more helpless and irresponsible and depraved than a man in the depths of an ether binge. –Raoul Duke

It is hard to shed anything but crocodile tears over White House speechwriter Patrick Buchanan's tragic analysis of the Nixon debacle. "It's like Sisyphus," he said. "We rolled the rock all the way up the mountain...and it rolled right back down on us...."  Neither Sisyphus nor the commander of the Light Brigade nor Pat Buchanan had the time or any real inclination to question what they were doing...a martyr, to the bitter end, to a "flawed" cause and a narrow, atavistic concept of conservative politics that has done more damage to itself and the country in less than six years than its liberal enemies could have done in two or three decades. -Hunter S. Thompson

akuma587 said:
TheRealMafoo said:
akuma587 said:
Hey, I hate the Religious Right, so obviously I hate America in its entirety. And obviously America could and never has done anything with the same level of organization as Hamas does in brainwashing its children. Ideological manipulation is something that is strictly forbidden in America, or something.

See what I mean.

The first line is sarcasm against my post. The rest is proving my point.

Hamas's actions are equally deplorable.  Brainwashing children into religious or political zealots is just about the most despicable thing a person could do, and I think any group that practices it is just plain despicable. 

I just think it is strange how we act like radical religious indoctrination is something that only happens in the Middle East.

 

Wow...

I am glad you think Hamas is at least as bad as us.

Steven, where are you now? Why have you let these comments go untouched? Do you also think the US and Hamas are equally bad?



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I never said equally bad. Religious radicals in this country at least don't encourage violence (usually) as Hamas does. That is the worst thing that terrorist organizations do, convincing young people to fight their battles for them in the name of religion.



We had two bags of grass, seventy-five pellets of mescaline, five sheets of high-powered blotter acid, a salt shaker half full of cocaine, a whole galaxy of multi-colored uppers, downers, screamers, laughers…Also a quart of tequila, a quart of rum, a case of beer, a pint of raw ether and two dozen amyls.  The only thing that really worried me was the ether.  There is nothing in the world more helpless and irresponsible and depraved than a man in the depths of an ether binge. –Raoul Duke

It is hard to shed anything but crocodile tears over White House speechwriter Patrick Buchanan's tragic analysis of the Nixon debacle. "It's like Sisyphus," he said. "We rolled the rock all the way up the mountain...and it rolled right back down on us...."  Neither Sisyphus nor the commander of the Light Brigade nor Pat Buchanan had the time or any real inclination to question what they were doing...a martyr, to the bitter end, to a "flawed" cause and a narrow, atavistic concept of conservative politics that has done more damage to itself and the country in less than six years than its liberal enemies could have done in two or three decades. -Hunter S. Thompson

I saw "Jesus Camp," and it was an interesting film. I must say, however, that I do not believe the churches presented there are a true representation of "evangelicals." I grew up in an evangelical church and traveled to many other evangelical churches, and I never experienced situations similar to what was in that film.



Jackson50 said:
I saw "Jesus Camp," and it was an interesting film. I must say, however, that I do not believe the churches presented there are a true representation of "evangelicals." I grew up in an evangelical church and traveled to many other evangelical churches, and I never experienced situations similar to what was in that film.

Oh no, absolutely.  They are a minority within a minority.  But you would be surprised how many evangelicals saw that movie and were proud of what they saw.  Notably, some evangelicals were embarassed by what they saw as well.

I grew up in a town where there actually are people who are like this, so the movie definitely struck a cord with me.

 



We had two bags of grass, seventy-five pellets of mescaline, five sheets of high-powered blotter acid, a salt shaker half full of cocaine, a whole galaxy of multi-colored uppers, downers, screamers, laughers…Also a quart of tequila, a quart of rum, a case of beer, a pint of raw ether and two dozen amyls.  The only thing that really worried me was the ether.  There is nothing in the world more helpless and irresponsible and depraved than a man in the depths of an ether binge. –Raoul Duke

It is hard to shed anything but crocodile tears over White House speechwriter Patrick Buchanan's tragic analysis of the Nixon debacle. "It's like Sisyphus," he said. "We rolled the rock all the way up the mountain...and it rolled right back down on us...."  Neither Sisyphus nor the commander of the Light Brigade nor Pat Buchanan had the time or any real inclination to question what they were doing...a martyr, to the bitter end, to a "flawed" cause and a narrow, atavistic concept of conservative politics that has done more damage to itself and the country in less than six years than its liberal enemies could have done in two or three decades. -Hunter S. Thompson

akuma587 said:
Jackson50 said:
I saw "Jesus Camp," and it was an interesting film. I must say, however, that I do not believe the churches presented there are a true representation of "evangelicals." I grew up in an evangelical church and traveled to many other evangelical churches, and I never experienced situations similar to what was in that film.

Oh no, absolutely.  They are a minority within a minority.  But you would be surprised how many evangelicals saw that movie and were proud of what they saw.  Notably, some evangelicals were embarassed by what they saw as well.

I grew up in a town where there actually are people who are like this, so the movie definitely struck a cord with me.

 

Yes, and it is unfortunate. I find it ironic, however, that their practice of glossolalia is theologically incorrect. Anyways, I should not derail this thread any more than I have.

 



Jackson50 said:
Esmoreit said:
I'd say screw protocol, and let's talk despite past occurances and opinions. Especially the latter can only be elaborated upon and perhaps changed through direct talk.

I mean, no one has ever tried it really with Hamas... let's try it now that they are open to it. They've announced a ceasefire so use this hopefull opportunity to drag some additional prospects out of it. Any progress in that region is a welcome one.

It would set a bad precedent if we opened dialogue with Hamas, a terrorist group, before it met certain requirements. Besides, before the Palestinian-Israeli conflict can be resolved, we must solve the Fatah-Hamas conflict. That is why Hamas' decision to skip the reconciliation meetings in Egypt was disheartening. Hopefully, Hamas decides to abandon its policy of violence and accept its position as a responsible political entity. 

 

This is kinda like a "what came first: chicken or egg?" story but I'd say that to solve the Hamas/fatah conflict Obama/ the Americans (actually, not just the Americans but also representatives of from the EU, Russias perhaps, etc) need to speak with Hamas.

Can we then assume that they will cease hostilities before the end of Barracks term? I don't think so. There's a constant spiral of violence there. I mean, after a ceasefire some local hamas supporter out of anger or whatever decides to go rogue and fire a few rocket on Israelian ground. Israel responds by blazing through a few refugee camps which instigates anger amongst Hamas who retaliates in full.

On the other hand, during a ceasefire Israel at times takes the liberty to invade the westbank for instance to block tunnels after which Hamas responds with rocketfire (this was a few days ago by the way.)

The world cannot expect any of both sides to stop on their own before peacetalks are underway. So I'd say, don't knock it before trying it. Just go in there, while rockets are flying to both sides of the border for all I care and get talking. See if it leads anywhere and perhaps we can build upon those talks to set fair precedents then.

 



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