Kyros said: This is a smart move all around if you ask me. No it isn't and no it won't happen. They will use a CELL successor. Nintendo was able to succeed with last-gen technology by completely changing the target group. Unlike Sony finds some revolutionary new input device/whatever. They do not have the luxury and still need to compete on the high end with Microsoft. We shouldn't forget that the HD market is as big as the Wii market and it sells far more games at higher prices. So Sony would be stupid to concede this to MS. Using an upgraded CELL could be just as backwards compatible.

 

I think that will be a non-factor, next generation. If you believe in some of the other rumors flooding around graphics WON'T be an issue next-gen. You're looking at the CURRENT market not the future. If all systems go HD next gen, POOF no "HD market".

Unsure if anyone heard the latest news:

http://pc.watch.impress.co.jp/docs/2.../kaigai469.htm

Goto Hiroshige has received PSX4 spec info from Japanese developer sources who received preliminary spec from SCEI for developer feedback(whom Goto refuses to name due to NDA).

- SCEI has sent rough PSX4 spec to 3rd party developers for feed back. Based on the description, PSX4 is a Wii-tized PSX3, no more than 2X as powerful.
- SCEI wants to beat Xbox 3 to launch. 2011 is the deadline, or sooner.
- SCEI pulled all its engineers from IBM Texas, and there is no new CELL architecture being developed. PSX4 will use same CELL architecture with improvements.
- SCEI will dump XDR and use standard JEDEC memory type(GDDR3/DDR3) for main memory.

@Mrstickball Link is not found?

Let me rephrase this. The games that compete with each other on technical perfection, graphical excellence and other processing power needing tasks like physics etc. The classic gaming market. (Assassin's, Gears, Halo, Resistance, Uncharted ...)
Currently this coincides pretty much with the HD gaming market. Next gen all consoles will be HD but there will still be a competition for the best looks/most impressive physics, best lighting ... like there is currently between MS and Sony.

Don't believe a single word of it.

mrstickball said: Unsure if anyone heard the latest news: http://pc.watch.impress.co.jp/docs/2.../kaigai469.htm Goto Hiroshige has received PSX4 spec info from Japanese developer sources who received preliminary spec from SCEI for developer feedback(whom Goto refuses to name due to NDA). - SCEI has sent rough PSX4 spec to 3rd party developers for feed back. Based on the description, PSX4 is a Wii-tized PSX3, no more than 2X as powerful. - SCEI wants to beat Xbox 3 to launch. 2011 is the deadline, or sooner. - SCEI pulled all its engineers from IBM Texas, and there is no new CELL architecture being developed. PSX4 will use same CELL architecture with improvements. - SCEI will dump XDR and use standard JEDEC memory type(GDDR3/DDR3) for main memory.

Well none of these actually look feasible. They are just illogical. Besides going back to DDR RAM for cost purposes, you telling me that SONY one of the leading innovators in technology isn't developing and improving the CELL architecture? And they want to launch by 2011 really just kills the credibility. And only two times more powerful than PS3? This just isn't within the business statement and objectives of SONY.

I for one am confident this is all false speculation comparable to the speculation that caused the crash of the financial sector accredited to the sub-prime crisis.

 

Using the SAME chip, simply shrunk, would be a mistake, even Wii, that doesn't rely on brute force, has more than double computing power respect to GC.
Shrunk version of first Cell will be released anyway along PS3 life, to lower costs.
But as SPE's are still underused, while most agree that that lonely general purpose PPE single core could be at its limits in some cases, and memory is too little too for some possible uses, Sony could put on PS4 a new Cell with little more SPE's, maybe 2-4 more, and double or quadruple that single PPE and put at least 2GB main RAM.
This would (almost) quadruple computing power only where needed, saving a lot of money, given the large number of items involved. And given IT evolution, it would be even more feasible and cheap, considering that in 4 years even a quadrupling of the total number of transistors would result in a CPU costing less than the current one now. Heat produced would be lower and its dissipation easier too.
What I'd give for for sure is that Sony won't try again to have a performance and feature gap so large to force itself to have a PS4 launch price as high as PS3's one.

goddog said: artical is claiming it will be the same chip, not same family but same chip, (die shrunk being the only change as that is already happening in current units) its not just basesed on the cell, its the same cell as in the ps3 is what they are saying, I had thought they would advance the cell a bit. also the mention of going back to standard ram ddr series, is interesting, it seems they want to keep cost down.

I hate to tell you this, bro, but that would make it a... *drumroll* PS3, albeit a cheaper version to make.  We see those every 6 months already, about.  Does the first 80GB model qualify as the "PS4" and then the new 40/80GB are the "PS5"?  Is the "PS6" around the corner?  No.

I think you're misreading the article.  It mentions more cores, and increased performance (albeit minor, relative to gains of the PS3 over the PS2, for example) -- that's not the same Cell, now is it?  Even the title says "based on".

 

 

mrstickball said: Unsure if anyone heard the latest news: http://pc.watch.impress.co.jp/docs/2.../kaigai469.htm Goto Hiroshige has received PSX4 spec info from Japanese developer sources who received preliminary spec from SCEI for developer feedback(whom Goto refuses to name due to NDA). - SCEI has sent rough PSX4 spec to 3rd party developers for feed back. Based on the descripti on, PSX4 is a Wii-tized PSX3, no more than 2X as powerful. - SCEI wants to beat Xbox 3 to launch. 2011 is the deadline, or sooner. - SCEI pulled all its engineers from IBM Texas, and there is no new CELL architecture being developed. PSX4 will use same CELL architecture with improvements. - SCEI will dump XDR and use standard JEDEC memory type(GDDR3/DDR3) for main memory.

 

The memory thing might be true, but the "pulling engineers" thing is only related to Sony selling its portion of Cell research to the other partners -- the Cell is being worked on by Toshiba and IBM, and my source is umm... lets just say its a lot more reliable than yours is, even if the link weren't busted.

Also, 2011 is BS as far as rolling off the production line goes.  A prototype might exist by then, but you wouldn't see said machine on store shelves until at least late 2012 or later.

 

Kyros said: If all systems go HD next gen, POOF no "HD market". Let me rephrase this. The games that compete with each other on technical perfection, graphical excellence and other processing power needing tasks like physics etc. The classic gaming market. (Assassin's, Gears, Halo, Resistance, Uncharted ...) Currently this coincides pretty much with the HD gaming market. Next gen all consoles will be HD but there will still be a competition for the best looks/most impressive physics, best lighting ... like there is currently between MS and Sony.

 

I agree, but that is also why I think that next gen MS/Sony can get away with slight spec upgrades. Remember the Wii has more potential for improved hardware next gen BECAUSE it's not HD right now.

 

@ everyone...is it a BAD thing if Sony only gives the PS4 a slight bump, over the PS3? Only thing this will show is that Nintendo was right in their business model, but it won't change the type of company that Sony is.

 

...Matter of fact I think the next gen races will be more interesting as it will be more about games and gameplay versus graphics.

 

@Mrstickball, thanks for the update. =)