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Forums - General - PoliCHARTZ - Thread of U.S. Politics & the Presidential Election

halogamer1989 said:
As long as the taxes are low and yes, adjustment is always needed to prevent bubbles and the like--you see how the housing market turned out with the help from the CRA, right...

Well, I'm pretty sure we disagree on the appropriate tax burden, but the question is whether capital gains ought to be taxed at about the same rate as income.  It looks like we do agree on that.

(That is NOT what I meant by "adjusting for inflation", but sure, why not roll with it.) 

Hmm, a short search turned up a dissenting point of view ... http://bigpicture.typepad.com/comments/2008/10/misunderstandin.html

The CRA is not remotely one of the proximate causes of the current credit crunch, Housing collapse,and mortgage debacle. As I detailed in Barron's, there is plenty of things to be angry at D.C. about -- but this ain't one of them.

If you were to ask me to reveal the prime causative factor for the Housing boom, I would point you to Fed Chairman Greenspan taking rates to 1%, and then leaving them there for a year. The prime factor in the bust was nonfeasance on the Fed's part in supervising bank lending, allowing banks to give money to people who couldn't possibly pay it back.

The root legislative cause of the credit crisis was excessive deregulation. From exempting derivatives from regulation (2000 Commodities Futures Modernization Act) to failing to adequately oversee ratings agencies that slapped a triple AAA on junk paper, the pendulum swung too far away from reasonable oversight. By taking the refs off of the field and erroneously expecting market participants could self-regulate, the powers that be in DC gave the players on Wall Street enough rope to hang themselves with -- which they promptly did.


So I would say the proper remedy would be to reregulate the market. 

P.S.  By the way, you apparently don't dispute my characterization of the USA PATRIOT Act?  If so, I'm glad to see we at least agree on that.

P.P.S.  Just out of curiosity, how exactly did you come to the conclusion that a piece of legislation passed in 1977 suddenly caused the housing market to explode and then collapse 30 years later? 



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I do not agree with you on the USPA. It is necessary to avoid future 9/11s and detect homegrown terrorists and infiltrator cells like Hellbollah, etc (relevant in case of an Iranian-US and/or Israeli conflict, believe me)

I am the Jack Bauer of VGC and I would torture the hell out of a terrorist to get any answers to save American lives.



But torture doesn't work. Ask John McCain. He was tortured and started lying to stop the torture. We used to torture women until they told us whether they were witches or not. Turns out they were ALL WITCHES. Then we conclusively proved that everybody will make up bullshit under duress to live. Torture doesn't and can't work ever and is a crime against humanity.



halogamer1989 said:
As long as the taxes are low and yes, adjustment is always needed to prevent bubbles and the like--you see how the housing market turned out with the help from the CRA, right...

And did you see how America turned out under Bush? Oh, that's right, you like it this way. You want four more years of the same. The people that want a return to fiscal conservatism are voting for democrats this year.

Fun talking points are fun.



But what about the fact that torture produces unreliable information?
But what about the fact that it DEVASTATES the moral authority that the United States had for so long?
--and what about the corresponding loss of respect and stature for the US globally?
But what about the fact that some of the people being tortured will be innocent?

But what about the rest of the USA PATRIOT Act, like the parts that have been ruled in violation of the Fourth Amendment?

But what about the rest of my post?



Tag (courtesy of fkusumot): "Please feel free -- nay, I encourage you -- to offer rebuttal."
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My advice to fanboys: Brag about stuff that's true, not about stuff that's false. Predict stuff that's likely, not stuff that's unlikely. You will be happier, and we will be happier.

"Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not his own facts." - Sen. Pat Moynihan
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
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The Ghost of RubangB said:
But torture doesn't work. Ask John McCain. He was tortured and started lying to stop the torture.

Sorry Rubang, YOU CAN'T ASK JOHN MCCAIN THAT.

Why?

BECAUSE JOHN MCCAIN WILL NOT ADMIT THAT HE WAS TORTURED NOW!

He says it was Intensive Interrogation. But he does say that it broke him. He cried like a baby under Intensive Interrogation!

That was all it took to break him, some Intensive Interrogation!

And this is who some people want as the next POTUS? A man who is so weak that he broke under mere Intensive Interrogation? No, I don't think so my friends.

And in case you're wondering, my friends, he's lying now. He was tortured. And now he's lying about it. A classic flip-flopper. This is a man who left his honor behind in pursuit of the presidency. This is a decent man who left his honor behind like a bad habit, just like he abandonded his first wife for a thieving, pill-popping drug addict heiress. This is a man of character and principle and dignity who has left all of that behind and sold himself out to big money, special interests, neocons and the radical right-wing of the Republican Party. My friends, that's why I'm sure he'll win the election. That and because Sarah Palin is the future of the Republican Party. God bless her.



After contemplating torture, it's outcomes and it's uses, I'm left with only one thing to say

THERE. ARE. FOUR! LIGHTS!



I'm a mod, come to me if there's mod'n to do. 

Chrizum is the best thing to happen to the internet, Period.

Serves me right for challenging his sales predictions!

Bet with dsisister44: Red Steel 2 will sell 1 million within it's first 365 days of sales.

You guys should really ask yourself this: if a suitcase nuke was planted in a major US city but the location was not known and a terrorist in holding had even a slight clue as to where and what time it was going to go off, would you not do everything you could to save American lives?



halogamer1989 said:
You guys should really ask yourself this: if a suitcase nuke was planted in a major US city but the location was not known and a terrorist in holding had even a slight clue as to where and what time it was going to go off, would you not do everything you could to save American lives?

You should ask yourself this. Or wait, did you?

It sounds to me like you would be perfectly willing to kill one innocent Canadian to save two American lives. Right? That's how it works in your world?



fkusumot said:
The Ghost of RubangB said:
But torture doesn't work. Ask John McCain. He was tortured and started lying to stop the torture.

Sorry Rubang, YOU CAN'T ASK JOHN MCCAIN THAT.

Why?

BECAUSE JOHN MCCAIN WILL NOT ADMIT THAT HE WAS TORTURED NOW!

He says it was Intensive Interrogation. But he does say that it broke him. He cried like a baby under Intensive Interrogation!

That was all it took to break him, some Intensive Interrogation!

And this is who some people want as the next POTUS? A man who is so weak that he broke under mere Intensive Interrogation? No, I don't think so my friends.

And in case you're wondering, my friends, he's lying now. He was tortured. And now he's lying about it. A classic flip-flopper. This is a man who left his honor behind in pursuit of the presidency. This is a decent man who left his honor behind like a bad habit, just like he abandonded his first wife for a thieving, pill-popping drug addict heiress. This is a man of character and principle and dignity who has left all of that behind and sold himself out to big money, special interests, neocons and the radical right-wing of the Republican Party. My friends, that's why I'm sure he'll win the election. That and because Sarah Palin is the future of the Republican Party. God bless her.

Wow.  I knew he flip-flopped on torture but I didn't know he was trying to change history and claim he was merely intensively interrogated.  That's just foreplay.

Luckily I will never vote for anybody who's ever cried like a baby uner any circumstances.