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Forums - General - why do people hate sarah Palin?

HappySqurriel said:
Sansui said:

One thing neither party does very well is justify and explain spending. To me, Republicans tend to marginalize any spending other than defense spending.  Yet tax and spend anyway (hello Mr. Bush 1 and 2).  Democrats slip in small programs because they get shut down by the Republicans on anything big, and then get demonized for this.

And yet many of these programs are not about increasing the size of our government (sometimes that is a side effect yes), but about improving our infrastructure.  Ensuring our work force is healthy and happy and can actually get to work (roads and public transportation).  Encuring our upcoming work force, our children, are educated and have the means to take advantage of the opportunities before them. 

A republican would look at a young girl, and then slash any spending on access to birth control for her.   When she becomes a young unwed mother, they slash spending on programs that would give her any kind of support to raise her child and support that child's health.  When that child is in a public school system, they slash spending on a program that would give that child the tools it needs in today's age to succeed.  When that child is a high school dropout, a young girl herself, she repeats the same mistakes her mother made.

The way I see it?  A lot of democratic spending is to provide solutions for problems created by Republicans.  Now, I know I'm overemphasizing that and myself marginalizing a lot of business practices that I think the Dems are wrong on, but I think it's a fair point.

Not all government spending is bad.  It's just like a business investing during a downturn instead of cutting expenses - when things look up again, they're in a much better position to take advantage of the market than the companies that wildly cut spending and jobs just to please their shareholders.

 


Please stop using your own personal stereotypes to make generalizations about other people.

There are a lot of conservative minded people reject all government spending which doesn't have measureable results ... For the most part, no social programs have been designed in a way where you can actually measure the results of the spending.

I could ask you to do the same in your other posts.  "Liberals" have been generalized and stereotyped repeatedly in this thread by you and others, yet you don't seem to mind that at all.

And as far as metrics for spending on social programs? .... mmk, I'm afraid our defense and national security programs have not been designed in such a way where we can measure the results of our spending there.  I mean, sure... we're still a sovereign nation, which is good.  But lets look over in Iraq and oh yes... yes that looks to be quite a problem for our economy!  And no sign of victory in sight!  Yes, yes... if only there were a way to gauge the success of that war in relation to the spending. Hrm...

 



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Sansui said:

I could ask you to do the same in your other posts.  "Liberals" have been generalized and stereotyped repeatedly in this thread by you and others, yet you don't seem to mind that at all.

And as far as metrics for spending on social programs? .... mmk, I'm afraid our defense and national security programs have not been designed in such a way where we can measure the results of our spending there.  I mean, sure... we're still a sovereign nation, which is good.  But lets look over in Iraq and oh yes... yes that looks to be quite a problem for our economy!  And no sign of victory in sight!  Yes, yes... if only there were a way to gauge the success of that war in relation to the spending. Hrm...

 

 

So where did I make generalizations about "Liberals"?



Sansui said:

One thing neither party does very well is justify and explain spending. To me, Republicans tend to marginalize any spending other than defense spending.  Yet tax and spend anyway (hello Mr. Bush 1 and 2).  Democrats slip in small programs because they get shut down by the Republicans on anything big, and then get demonized for this.

And yet many of these programs are not about increasing the size of our government (sometimes that is a side effect yes), but about improving our infrastructure.  Ensuring our work force is healthy and happy and can actually get to work (roads and public transportation).  Encuring our upcoming work force, our children, are educated and have the means to take advantage of the opportunities before them. 

A republican would look at a young girl, and then slash any spending on access to birth control for her.   When she becomes a young unwed mother, they slash spending on programs that would give her any kind of support to raise her child and support that child's health.  When that child is in a public school system, they slash spending on a program that would give that child the tools it needs in today's age to succeed.  When that child is a high school dropout, a young girl herself, she repeats the same mistakes her mother made.

The way I see it?  A lot of democratic spending is to provide solutions for problems created by Republicans.  Now, I know I'm overemphasizing that and myself marginalizing a lot of business practices that I think the Dems are wrong on, but I think it's a fair point.

Not all government spending is bad.  It's just like a business investing during a downturn instead of cutting expenses - when things look up again, they're in a much better position to take advantage of the market than the companies that wildly cut spending and jobs just to please their shareholders.

Defense spending serves many purposes. It provides high-quality jobs and keeps America at the forefront of technology through its innovations. It, of course, also provides defense of the nation. It's a bad comparison to social programs, which provide little or no tangible benefit to the economy and often heavily detract from it. Of course, this is excluding wars, but that's a different subject altogether.

Your second paragraph all boils down to opinion. Where you see a government institution, I often see the possibility of a lightly regulated private institution doing the same work for less. It's not always possible to contract work to privateers but in many cases, real savings could be found if you removed the "government tax" overhead. It's a difference in principles and I'll leave it at that.

No offense but I don't feel the third paragraph is worth responding to. All of those problems could be fixed with a better education system, which is held back from making progress by those bastards in the Teacher's Union and the education infrastructure at large. Don't get me started on them.

Your fourth paragraph is related to the third.

No, not all government spending is bad. People fall down and need help getting back up. How much help is where our opinions are sure to differ. Also, comparing business to government is downright wrong. In most cases, if a business fails, they are acquired or go under and are supplanted by a more efficient model. If a government system fails, they generally throw more money at it in hopes of the ship righting itself. There is little or no benefit for a government employee to work harder or save money. They simply don't give a shit and are virtually assured a long-lasting job provided they don't do anything insanely stupid like rape a farm animal.




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HappySqurriel said:
Sansui said:

I could ask you to do the same in your other posts.  "Liberals" have been generalized and stereotyped repeatedly in this thread by you and others, yet you don't seem to mind that at all.

And as far as metrics for spending on social programs? .... mmk, I'm afraid our defense and national security programs have not been designed in such a way where we can measure the results of our spending there.  I mean, sure... we're still a sovereign nation, which is good.  But lets look over in Iraq and oh yes... yes that looks to be quite a problem for our economy!  And no sign of victory in sight!  Yes, yes... if only there were a way to gauge the success of that war in relation to the spending. Hrm...

 

 

So where did I make generalizations about "Liberals"?

 

 Actually you are right, I apologize.  I mixed you up with someone else. 



I really don't mind the attacks anymore. Most normal people are already offended as to how the democrats are treating her. Expect there to be some backlash.

You see, If the demecrats actually though she was as shitty as they say she is, then they would just lets her make a fool of herself in the debates. obviously they know who they are up against and are trying their best to destroy BEFORE she has a chance to prove herself. Because they know once she has exosure Americans will fall in love with her down to earth approach.

Also, for those who say she did a terrible Job as gov... stfu. You don't get a 80-90% aproval rating if you are working for the good of the people.



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rocketpig said:

Defense spending serves many purposes. It provides high-quality jobs and keeps America at the forefront of technology through its innovations. It, of course, also provides defense of the nation. It's a bad comparison to social programs, which provide little or no tangible benefit to the economy and often heavily detract from it. Of course, this is excluding wars, but that's a different subject altogether.

Your second paragraph all boils down to opinion. Where you see a government institution, I often see the possibility of a lightly regulated private institution doing the same work for less. It's not always possible to contract work to privateers but in many cases, real savings could be found if you removed the "government tax" overhead. It's a difference in principles and I'll leave it at that.

No offense but I don't feel the third paragraph is worth responding to. All of those problems could be fixed with a better education system, which is held back from making progress by those bastards in the Teacher's Union and the education infrastructure at large. Don't get me started on them.

Your fourth paragraph is related to the third.

No, not all government spending is bad. People fall down and need help getting back up. How much help is where our opinions are sure to differ. Also, comparing business to government is downright wrong. In most cases, if a business fails, they are acquired or go under and are supplanted by a more efficient model. If a government system fails, they generally throw more money at it in hopes of the ship righting itself. There is little or no benefit for a government employee to work harder or save money. They simply don't give a shit and are virtually assured a long-lasting job provided they don't do anything insanely stupid like rape a farm animal.

 

Regarding defense spending, these days it seems more like offense spending.  I'm all for us spending what's necessary to defend ourselves, but it's not like you can pretend to not understand why many of us would want to move as far away from Bush's foreign policy and "defense" expenditure as we possibly can.

I will agree that it's a difference in principles as well.  Not much to say there.

And I take no offense that you won't respond to that paragraph :)

You are right that there are some problems with government employment.  There are little to no incentives to work harder or save on expenses and there really should be.  I don't know why we can't turn government jobs into more dynamic positions with performance and savings incentives (wait, yes I do... because our leadership sucks, both Dem and Repub).   That is the one best argument I feel you have for private institutions to handle what should be government jobs, and an area that really needs to be changed.  Maybe I'm optimistic in believing that one day we'll get it right.

 



bigjon said:
I really don't mind the attacks anymore. Most normal people are already offended as to how the democrats are treating her. Expect there to be some backlash.

You see, If the demecrats actually though she was as shitty as they say she is, then they would just lets her make a fool of herself in the debates. obviously they know who they are up against and are trying their best to destroy BEFORE she has a chance to prove herself. Because they know once she has exosure Americans will fall in love with her down to earth approach.

Also, for those who say she did a terrible Job as gov... stfu. You don't get a 80-90% aproval rating if you are working for the good of the people.

So if we were using Metacritic then Sarah Palin would be like "Call of Duty 4" and George Bush would be like "Looney Tunes: Acme Arsenal"?



Absolutely, it seems like we're trying to police the world for no good reason. Communism is all but dead. It's time to shift ideals and bring things back home. I understand the need to protect stable oil assets, but a lot of that has to do with liberals fighting domestic oil production, which has dropped significantly in the past 20 years. If the US was able to start drilling again and get alternative energy sources (nuclear, anyone?) up and running in the next decade, there's no good reason to keep so many troops all over the world. Having strategic bases in certain countries will always but useful but much of that can be cut way back if we weren't so (unnecessarily) reliant on other countries' commodities markets.

Make this country more independent and many of these defense problems simply go away.




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fkusumot said:
bigjon said:
I really don't mind the attacks anymore. Most normal people are already offended as to how the democrats are treating her. Expect there to be some backlash.

You see, If the demecrats actually though she was as shitty as they say she is, then they would just lets her make a fool of herself in the debates. obviously they know who they are up against and are trying their best to destroy BEFORE she has a chance to prove herself. Because they know once she has exosure Americans will fall in love with her down to earth approach.

Also, for those who say she did a terrible Job as gov... stfu. You don't get a 80-90% aproval rating if you are working for the good of the people.

So if we were using Metacritic then Sarah Palin would be like "Call of Duty 4" and George Bush would be like "Looney Tunes: Acme Arsenal"?

Nah, Bush is more like Ninjabread Man.

My favorite game.

 




Or check out my new webcomic: http://selfcentent.com/

bigjon said:

You don't get a 80-90% aproval rating if you are working for the good of the people.

Tell me about it, Saddam Hussien had a 99% approval rating.  joke