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Forums - Gaming - Why do 99% of videogames pander to white (especially American) audiences?

Pristine20 said:
Kasz216 said:
Pristine20 said:
Kasz216 said:
Pristine20 said:
Ajax said:

Look at Ruy for exmple. He is a Japanese dude, the story says. But why the hell doesn't he have Japanese eyes then? If only he would have that, he would have looked a lot more Japanese, but even Ryu looks more South European or Persian than Japanese now, at least most versions of Ryu do. But for example in the SF II V anime he looks a lot more Japanese though. Also in anime's you often have that hybrid Japanese/European look.

What the Japanese also have are those boy/girl characters, like Kuja from FFIX, where you almost can't make up whether that guy is a guy or a girl. But there is also a reason for that I think, cause the more pretty a guy and a girl get in regard of our standards for beauty, the more they look like each other. Pretty people seem to look like each other, up to a certain extend of course, regardless of whether they are men or women. And of course the Japanese artists take that to the absurd. lol

Japanese culture is beyond my comprehension at this point but one thing I can say is that their artists sure love to draw white people. Its surprising though because most of the arguements of having whites as the standard of beaty arise from european conquests of other nations and imposition of their culture on them.

However, Japan has never been ruled by anyone else but themselves yet they seem to have fallen prey to the same effect to a higher degree if I may add. Its seems that even westerners are more open to making games with real Asian-looking characters than the Japanese themselves because I just remembered Heavenly Sword lol. Also, the game: Mirror's Edge has an Asian female as the lead. She's pure Asian (probably Japanese) not the hybrid they create.

 

That's because a lot of white nerds find asian women hot.

Thats true though. I guess the real test is to see an Asian male lead.

Whats funny is that even when they finally use an Asian lead, they're still pandering to a white audience lol.


I wouldn't say pandering. I'd say that most videogame designers are in fact white nerds... and they make characters they find hot because they find them hot.

I think that's why there are a lot of white "default" main characters... designers don't really think about it. When race isn't important they just design a charater without thinking about a race. That character comes out white, because they are white.

Think of your imaginiary friend when you were a kid... he was the same color as you right? You didn't really think about it cause race didn't really matter... so it set to "default".

Well there's that and the fact that you can't really win as a white designer making a character of another race. Either you get accused of making a "person of a certain race who just acts white" or you get accused of playing into stereotypes. It can be a lose/lose situation.

It's easier with women, because women are well horrible rejected and objectified no matter what race they are. So long as they are hot... people aren't really going to notice.

Or with side characters... because then they are playing side characters that are really out of view half the time. I mean no one is really going to complain about the cool nearly silent black guy who shows up occasionally to bail you out... for example.

 

This is a pretty good counterarguement. However, it doesn't explain why the devs have no problem with a black lead when the game is called "True Crime" or "Grand Theft Auto". They could have also used thier imaginary friends as leads in such games no?

With that said, I don't think the lead characters are as random as you think. Some granted may be random but the vast majority aren't! You really think all those blond hair, blue eyed JRPG leads came at random?

 

With Grand Theft Auto that was Grand Theft Auto 3... but was really like Grand Theft Auto 6.  They likely figured they just needed to change it up.  I mean otherwise he would of been the main character way back in GTA1.

As for the Japanese.  That's just a difference in how the creation process works culturally.

The writer often comes up with the ideas and characters... with some vauge "ideas" of what the characters should look like... and then hand it over to their artists who then come up with the looks almost all themselves based on what the main character's personality traits are and what the artists themselves liek to draw.

While here... in the US.  When the character is more set by the creator. 

In Japan the "Character Designer" plays a more important role.



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DTG said:
Yes I find it discriminating and even offensive that all war games seem to be based on the US perspective. I'm sure there would be quite a market in Europe, Asia and obviously the Middle East that would enjoy playing a War game from Iraqi perspective or that of the Russians.


If someone would really like to play a game from the russians perspective in any conflict they really must have the blinders on when it comes to history.

The USSR was worse then the Nazis during WW2.

While there have been plenty of british World War 2 games as well.

A French Underground game might not be bad... but that's still white guys.

Besides which... Russians are basically white.

America is the easiest country to portray in a WW2 game because the US came in right around the time things started to break.  Otherwise you have to start in the "middle" of yoru selected nationalities campaign.  Or get your asses kicked for the first few missions.



Pristine20 said:

This is a pretty good counterarguement. However, it doesn't explain why the devs have no problem with a black lead when the game is called "True Crime" or "Grand Theft Auto". They could have also used thier imaginary friends as leads in such games no?

With that said, I don't think the lead characters are as random as you think. Some granted may be random but the vast majority aren't! You really think all those blond hair, blue eyed JRPG leads came at random?

 

True Crime was based in a predominantly black neighborhood, if I remember right.

Secondly, every Grand Theft Auto (or the majority of them) have various races as both the hero, and bad guy. GTA:SA's PC was black, IV was Eastern European, VC was italian (atleast it seemed like it), and so on. Many games that take place in some sort of reality use "context" for realism...

 



Back from the dead, I'm afraid.

Kasz216 said:
DTG said:
Yes I find it discriminating and even offensive that all war games seem to be based on the US perspective. I'm sure there would be quite a market in Europe, Asia and obviously the Middle East that would enjoy playing a War game from Iraqi perspective or that of the Russians.


If someone would really like to play a game from the russians perspective in any conflict they really must have the blinders on when it comes to history.

The USSR was worse then the Nazis during WW2.

 

I think most of the world looks at the US right now with such contempt that they find it comparable to most "evil" regimes of the past.

 

That said, the US did a lot of dirty things during the Cold War not just Russia.



DTG said:
Kasz216 said:
DTG said:
Yes I find it discriminating and even offensive that all war games seem to be based on the US perspective. I'm sure there would be quite a market in Europe, Asia and obviously the Middle East that would enjoy playing a War game from Iraqi perspective or that of the Russians.


If someone would really like to play a game from the russians perspective in any conflict they really must have the blinders on when it comes to history.

The USSR was worse then the Nazis during WW2.

 

I think most of the world looks at the US right now with such contempt that they find it comparable to most "evil" regimes of the past.

 

That said, the US did a lot of dirty things during the Cold War not just Russia.


Did the US kill millions of it's own people?

I think you vastly overestimate the negativity towards the US... that it's seen as bad as Stalin's russia or Hitler's Germany.

If you think anything America has done remotely comes anywhere near the genocidal practicings of those two countries...

man you need some perspective.



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Kasz216 said:
DTG said:
Kasz216 said:
DTG said:
Yes I find it discriminating and even offensive that all war games seem to be based on the US perspective. I'm sure there would be quite a market in Europe, Asia and obviously the Middle East that would enjoy playing a War game from Iraqi perspective or that of the Russians.


If someone would really like to play a game from the russians perspective in any conflict they really must have the blinders on when it comes to history.

The USSR was worse then the Nazis during WW2.

 

I think most of the world looks at the US right now with such contempt that they find it comparable to most "evil" regimes of the past.

 

That said, the US did a lot of dirty things during the Cold War not just Russia.


Did the US kill millions of it's own people?

I think you vastly overestimate the negativity towards the US... that it's seen as bad as Stalin's russia or Hitler's Germany.

 

People see the US as exerting it's dominance and control through economic, cultural, politicaL and military means. It doesn't need to kill vast amounts of people to be a totalitarian regime in this day and age. The common term "imperialist" when applied to the US sums it up quite well. The US is controlling and expansionist but it does so through economy and culture and it's political weight rather than guns (though Iraq is an example of the US becoming more aggressive in expanding it's influence)



DTG said:

I think most of the world looks at the US right now with such contempt that they find it comparable to most "evil" regimes of the past. 

That said, the US did a lot of dirty things during the Cold War not just Russia.

 

 And most of the world is idiotic, then. You can't compare what the US has done with the likes of Pol Pot, Hitler, Stalin, Mao, and Hirohito with any sort of rationale' . Has the US done a lot of wrong? Absolutely. But to compare alleged human rights violations that mount in the hundreds, or even thousands vs. the rape, murder, torture of MILLIONs of people is just insane.



Back from the dead, I'm afraid.

DTG said:
Kasz216 said:
DTG said:
Kasz216 said:
DTG said:
Yes I find it discriminating and even offensive that all war games seem to be based on the US perspective. I'm sure there would be quite a market in Europe, Asia and obviously the Middle East that would enjoy playing a War game from Iraqi perspective or that of the Russians.


If someone would really like to play a game from the russians perspective in any conflict they really must have the blinders on when it comes to history.

The USSR was worse then the Nazis during WW2.

 

I think most of the world looks at the US right now with such contempt that they find it comparable to most "evil" regimes of the past.

 

That said, the US did a lot of dirty things during the Cold War not just Russia.


Did the US kill millions of it's own people?

I think you vastly overestimate the negativity towards the US... that it's seen as bad as Stalin's russia or Hitler's Germany.

 

People see the US as exerting it's dominance and control through economic, cultural, politicaL and military means. It doesn't need to kill vast amounts of people to be a totalitarian regime in this day and age. The common term "imperialist" when applied to the US sums it up quite well. The US is controlling and expansionist but it does so through economy and culture and it's political weight rather than guns (though Iraq is an example of the US becoming more aggressive in expanding it's influence)

Riiight.... cause because US culture is popular throughout the world.... the US still has a pretty powerful (though by no means controlling) economy...

It's as bad as Nazi Germany and Communist Russia who systematically killed millions of their own people.

The US can't get anything done. No country can this day in age. The invasion of Iraq actually is a sign of that... because the UN couldn't even get a few inspectors in to a few buildings of a poor nation that was universally despised.

Heck. America isn't even anywhere near as bad as Colonization era Europe when it comes to this stuff.  Yet colonization europe is still looked on quite fondly by a lot of people.



Of course mrstickball; we had already concluded that; but now we are looking at 'anime' that's not so focused on Western sales.


The two most obvious characteristics of the Japanese (and other North-East-Asians) are their eyes and their smooth, always falling down black hair. And it's exactly those two features they turn upside down many times in their ways of art. Striking, big eyes, and up standing hair, in many forms; and I actually love it. And maybe it's not only because of European influence, but it's really their 'fantasy', cause we can not test, what kind of artstyle they would have developed if they would never have come in contact with other people. So maybe Europeans THINK the Japanese draw characters somewhat like them, because of them, but it might be just the way some Japanese artist see 'the altered Japanese'.


But, there are of course many forms of anime, and if you only look at anime-style we, outside japan, see on average; than you might get a wrong picture of the whole anime arts. There are countless Japanese characteristics things in it, and only 1 shot of an anime, just a still picture, is easily recognizable as being anime. I must give the Japanese a lot of credit for having made such a big and beautiful fantasy world of manga and anime, unlike any other country has. Superman stops trains, en breaks down buildings, Goku destroys moons and can break down the galaxy. It's genius.



But what about the women? Let's talk games. For FF7, 8, 9 and 10 we can say, that those girls actually all had dark hair (Tifa, Rinoa, Garnet, Yuna). And I tell you, one of the things that makes FFVII so stand out in the series, is that it's the only true anime FF. The FF's before it couldn't be like that because of at least hardware limitations. And the ones after it, just didn't have the anime style it has. Midgar is like Neo-Tokyo, racing with your bike reminicent of Akira. Shinra, The Turks, with their Chinese leader Tseng (Tseng seems Chinese to me), the crazy Hojo and the lovely Yuffie and her ninja family. And from Wall Market to Gold Saucer, it's one big anime, and the characters in battle are easily the best Nomura-san has given us. And don't forget the mature humor FFVII had. Never saw it back since.



''Hadouken!''

DTG said:

People see the US as exerting it's dominance and control through economic, cultural, politicaL and military means. It doesn't need to kill vast amounts of people to be a totalitarian regime in this day and age. The common term "imperialist" when applied to the US sums it up quite well. The US is controlling and expansionist but it does so through economy and culture and it's political weight rather than guns (though Iraq is an example of the US becoming more aggressive in expanding it's influence)

.....And how is China, or Europe doing that any differently? Both are exerting their dominance in their own spheres of influence as well.

But again, to compare an "imperialist" United States with historical nations that killed and brutalized millions of people is quite a stretch, no?

 



Back from the dead, I'm afraid.