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Forums - Sony - My altered view of MGS4 now that I've beaten it.

windbane on 22 June 2008
Ail said:
Astrodust said:
Ail said:
There's more than 5 hours of gameplay.
I finished the game in 26 hours so personally I had 18 hours of gameplay if you count around 8 hours of cut scenes.

Now I am on my seond play through in hard mode ( Big Boss hard) and skipping every cut scenes and with no continue. I am closing on 3 hours and still in Act2

You can beat the game in 4-5 hours but you need to be a real pro ( required for the hardest emblem).

 

 You must be terrible at video games. My roommate beat the game on the second hardest difficulty and the final play time was 18.5 hours. He actually finished the game at 17 hours but after the final cutscenes and credits the clock stood at 18.5. So I guess there is a 90 minute cutscene. Check your save time after the final boss and then the time after all the credits are done. 90 minutes ouch. He is a PS3 fan and even he said he only played for about 7 hours including dying and restarting. I really don't know if throwing in a mediocre multiplayer gives this game a 10.

I beat the game in that difficulty no alert, no kill, no recovery item,  no cut scenes in 7 hours.( save time, more like 14 hours play time because a few sequences are darn hard with only the tranq and no recovery item ( bike chase in Act 3, stupid vamp fight, screaming mantis..)

I just choose to take my time on the first play through, you miss a lot of stuff if you rush through the first time ( like having the beauties play super model for your camera). 


Props to you for getting through with no alerts and no recovery items. I like how there are so many fun challenges to attempt. This game is the only one I've finished twice back to back ever, and I'm playing through again on Extreme. I'm not sure I'd ever try for a Big Boss Emblem, though...



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Pete_Beast on 22 June 2008

substence version? explain? :/



windbane on 22 June 2008
hanafuda said:
Onimusha12 said:

The game seems to be the victim of questionable story telling that tries to avoid calling attention to its shortcommings by being awkward, disjointed and superifcially "artsy". This is not to bash the game or say that it is a bad game, but MGS games have always been indicative of questionable story telling balanced with redeeming elements. However the heavy dependence of this particular instalment of the series on story telling through such as lengthy and numerous cut scenes greatly offsets this equilibrium resulting in a game that is just begging to draw attention to its inadequacies and subtle awkwardness.

Snip

ALL MGS games have a heavy dependence on story telling through lengthy and numerous cut scenes.

You just wrote a whole lot, without actually having a point.

Inadequate, and subtle awkwardness?

 

 

 


Indeed, and "superficially 'artsy.'"



shio on 22 June 2008
windbane said:
sieanr said:
DTG said:
rocketpig said:
Oh, cut-scene based games can tell a good story. That wasn't my point. My point that any cut-scene heavy game is avoiding the strengths of the medium and instead trying to turn it into a more familiar medium with more limitations, like movies.

 

Why must every aspect of a mans work embrace the "strength" of a medium? Do many books not contain pictures in them? Do many movies not contain written references in them? Wy should a game limit itself to a particular style when it can blend several together - namely movies and games? The gameplay is still there however the story is presented as a movie blending two mediums in a stroke of a genius, something most artists wish to achieve.

 

You've argued this before and people have proven you wrong.

 

How many movies spend half the time with only text on screen, using it to communicate almost the entire story?

 

MGS4 does a terrible job of blending movies and games together. There are plenty of games that do an excellent job of blending a cinematic experience with gameplay, but I guess you haven't played them.

 

No game provides an interactive movie experience like MGS, but I'd like to see your list of games that blend cinematics and gameplay better, sieanr.

I hate to argue with rocketpig in every MGS thread, but he seems to complain about it in every thread, so...

A game does not have to be pure gameplay.  I think that's obvious by now.  MGS chooses to use an interactive movie style, and it does it very well.  I enjoyed the long cutscenes.  Clearly those are not for everyone.  You don't enjoy the story, so of course you are going to say that.  Anyone that enjoys the story probably doesn't mind too much.

And again...you can skip the freaking cutscenes.

 

Deus Ex: it has better story, storytelling, writing, interactivity and it is indeed cinematic. Far superior to any MGS game.

Oh and people don't want to experience movies, they want games.

 



http://i48.tinypic.com/120qaon.jpg
SeriousWB on 22 June 2008
Plaupius said:
alpha_dk said:
DTG said:
rocketpig said:
 

 

 

So now anything that DOESN'T explain it to you in long, drawn out terms doesn't count?  That hardly makes sense.

Tell me; what do you think of the following short story (in it's entirety)

For sale: baby shoes, never worn
(By Hemingway)

Now tell me: What is the point of the story?  What is a potential backstory, and why should you (and I do, at least) feel sad upon reading it?

Because most people would be able to answer all of the above questions, and that is only from 6 words.

Contrast that to a longer method, which would be something like this (spoiler'd because it is obviously only my interpretation of the piece, which is obviously not encompassing nearly as much as the original did.  This was done on purpose, because that's basically what DTG is saying is 'good' writing):

A pair of parents are going to have a baby.  They have been trying for ages, and are ecstatic when they are successful.  They buy everything they can for their child-to-be, from clothes to a room to everything else a young child would need.  Months pass, and eventually the mother-to-be goes into labor.  After hours of work, the child is stillborn.

I know which I consider better writing; and I see every reason why Hemingway's version should not only be able to be compared to my version, but should also be able to be declared unambiguously better.  Would you care to explain?

That's a great example, another one that I really like is this story by Augusto Monterroso:

"When he woke up, the dinosaur was still there."

Sure, it's not as deep in meaning as Hemingway, but it's funny :)

Wow I totally missed this thread.  I haven't played MGS4, but those short stories are fantastic, could anyone direct me to more of the sort? Thanks.

 



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windbane on 22 June 2008
shio said:
windbane said:
sieanr said:
DTG said:
rocketpig said:
Oh, cut-scene based games can tell a good story. That wasn't my point. My point that any cut-scene heavy game is avoiding the strengths of the medium and instead trying to turn it into a more familiar medium with more limitations, like movies.

 

Why must every aspect of a mans work embrace the "strength" of a medium? Do many books not contain pictures in them? Do many movies not contain written references in them? Wy should a game limit itself to a particular style when it can blend several together - namely movies and games? The gameplay is still there however the story is presented as a movie blending two mediums in a stroke of a genius, something most artists wish to achieve.

 

You've argued this before and people have proven you wrong.

 

How many movies spend half the time with only text on screen, using it to communicate almost the entire story?

 

MGS4 does a terrible job of blending movies and games together. There are plenty of games that do an excellent job of blending a cinematic experience with gameplay, but I guess you haven't played them.

 

No game provides an interactive movie experience like MGS, but I'd like to see your list of games that blend cinematics and gameplay better, sieanr.

I hate to argue with rocketpig in every MGS thread, but he seems to complain about it in every thread, so...

A game does not have to be pure gameplay.  I think that's obvious by now.  MGS chooses to use an interactive movie style, and it does it very well.  I enjoyed the long cutscenes.  Clearly those are not for everyone.  You don't enjoy the story, so of course you are going to say that.  Anyone that enjoys the story probably doesn't mind too much.

And again...you can skip the freaking cutscenes.

 

Deus Ex: it has better story, storytelling, writing, interactivity and it is indeed cinematic. Far superior to any MGS game.

Oh and people don't want to experience movies, they want games.

 


Good game, but I disagree that it's better. At least you gave me one, which is all I asked for. I don't care what you call it, I want more experiences like MGS.



TheGza on 22 June 2008

How did the ending of this game make anyone cry?

I love the MGS series and thought this was a great game, but to me it had a pretty weak ending.



there's no diversity because we're burning in the melting pot

 

ion-storm on 22 June 2008

I cried at a part in the end cutscene :(

It may not be everyones taste, but I love Metal Gear stories.



Yes

Ssyn on 22 June 2008

My god you all should continue repeating yourselves for 10 more pages...



Impulsivity on 22 June 2008

   If some of you really really really want non cinematic stealth based gameplay they've made it, it's called Splinter Cell.  If you want a trite story, very few cutscenes and tried and true spy dialogue there's your game! Go play it!  They've made 7 by now.

   MGS4 is NOT Splinter Cell nor should it be; it has a denser story and a lot more cinematic devices that compliment involved stealth action which rewards patience and creativity over brute force. (particularly on the high difficulty levels where you can't mow down 50 soldiers with your gun) In short it has everything a great game of its type should have and more.  If you prefer to keep your games and novels separate have at it, but don't act as though anyone who doesn't appreciate your taste in media or your preachy tone is somehow inferior to you and your "developed" tastes.  I enjoyed Metal Gear Solid 4 far more then slogging through The Old Man and the Sea thank you very much and I in no way feel ashamed of that fact nor should I be made to.

    On that note I would like to point out at this juncture that most people who apotheosize certain works of well known fiction as a means of deriding other peoples enjoyment are pretentious pricks.  They act as if reading Hemingway in some way makes you a superior form of human, which it most certainly does not.  What defines people of distinction is not how they draw upon popular ideals of classical superiority that have been written by others, often others long dead.  The measure of a man is his own ideas rather the quality of the ideas they've shanghaied from others possessing greater mental prowess then their own.  Reading Hemingway or watching Apocalypse Now in no way makes you superior unless you have something to add outside of your consumption of certain "high forms" of art.  Unless you can achieve distinction with your own original ideas keep your opinions about the worth of others in regards to their tastes to yourself.  You know who you are in this discussion.

 

Cheers




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