yes there is a god, and his name is MIYAMOTO!!!!!!!!!!!
yes there is a god, and his name is MIYAMOTO!!!!!!!!!!!
| Game_boy said: If a god made the universe, that god must have had the entire universe in its mind first, making such a god more complicated, and therefore more improbable to create, than the universe itself. If a god is more improbable than the universe, then we can do away with the god explanation (for we must always choose the simplest explanation that fits the evidence) and come to the conclusion that the universe was a random event, likely a vacuum fluctuation. So I don't believe in a creation god, and don't require such a being for any other purpose, so I don't believe in a god. Also, if there is a god, it would be very disappointed with the amount of pointless killing done in its name. Religion is either destructive or isolating and neither is good for society. |
What? God doesn't exist because you can't comprehend his complexity? Well that's all i wanted to say to you.
I just can't believe that this thread is back from he dead... But what i said before in this thread i won't have a problem saying again (some people won't read the other pages in the thread because of some mental incapability, or laziness).
First understand what i call the Universe: When i say Universe i mean everything, there is no possibility of multiple Universes or anything, the Universe is all of matter space and time, it is every dimension and every thought, or dream of a beings mind. The Universe is everything, even beyond what we can think of.
Now with that, i dispel the big bang theory. The Universe cannot expand because it can only be expanding into itself, which would be impossible. The whole thought of the universe getting bigger and smaller and confining into a mass of energy to me is foolish. It is a plausible theory i can give you that, but i don't believe it. I don't believe all matter, space and time can be "destroyed" or "created" through Universal means and constricted into a mass of extreme energy and then release again. But if that is true then the Universe just is. It just exists and it has no beggining and has no end. It is outside of time and within it all the same time. It is infinate and "all powerful". But if that can be true, why can't god be true like that? Is it unreasonable and impossible while all the same it can be true for the Universe?
Or, the universe could have a beggining, and that beggining has another beggining and so on for infinity. This leaves us with nothing, nothing scientific or spiritual. We could go on forever looking for a scientific or spiritual answer to life and never find it. I refuse to believe in this because i'm a Christian and i know God exists, but if this were true, and i mean proven 110% true then i would go on a mass killing spree because that would be cool.
And lastly we can say the Univese was created by something that cannot be created. How or by what? There are many theories, but i hold Christianity as truth.
So we can either give up finding the meaning of life and the creation, or we can accept that it was created by some god-like being, or we can give the universe god-like qualities. These are the choices we as intelectual human beings are givin due to the limits of the Universe and our primitive minds. We just have to pick one. After that we are left in another layer of choices filled with, which are another bunch of other subdivisions. Eventually we are left with one being true and the others being completely wrong, false, or partially true. And with that we either have a consequence of our choice or we just wither away and return to the dust of the earth, returing to the Universe.
Because we have all these choices lead me to believe that God exists (well at least one reason). But no matter what we believe one can't deny that one way or another we were given free will, a "common" sense and much more things unique to humans and our world/universe. Some can give out this scientific probability, but i believe in God show my Christian Faith.
*** I don't think people get it. Believing in a God and understanding him is way more complex and hard than believing in things that we can scientifically prove. Some people simply believe God did that, just like some people simply believe that water vapor condenses under cool temperatures and forms rain, but there is so much more to the answer that that. God isn't "the simple answer" it's people who want to be simple. God is the incomprehensible answer that no one wants to believe in because they can't find ways to test it using human logic. Meh... believe what you want, just think about why. ***

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No I don't believe there is one. Heck, I wouldn't be able to live in the USA full of Christians. And the reason I don't believe is because the idea is ridiculous. Do we believe in pink fire breathing dragons? No. This is no different. Show me proof and I'll believe.
Atheists say it's not logical to believe in God. I don't get the logic in NOT believing in God. Say even that there is a 99.9% chance god doesn't exist.
If given the choice between chooising something that has a 1 in 10,000 chance of happening that will net you a million dollars
or
a 9,999% chance of something happening and you get nothing.
Which is the logical choice? You can be 100% sure god doesn't exist if you want to be. But i've always lived by the motto that "Only fools deal in absolutes."
Me, i believe in the Christian God of some sort. Not really in the bible however as it's been translated and retranslated since it was created by a bunch of romans by choosing between different holy texts... and burning or locking away the ones they didn't choose. That seemed more about making Christianity more palatable to the Roman rulers.
Either way, i'm going to believe in a creator and do the best i can in that... and if he's happy with me cool, if he's not i'll apologize. If he doesn't exist, I'll never know. So who cares?

Also Physics and Quantum Physics may not imply a god, they don't imply there isn't a god either.
The way time works is a tricky thing thanks to space-time.
Based on our original thoughts of time we thought "When did time start?." It had to have started at some point. Time could not be infinite. If it was infinite, with no start and no ending how would we have ever gotten to this point of you reading this. There would be Infinite time before this point. So it would take you an Infinite amount of time to reach this point... so you never would. The same could be said for any point in time.
So what do we know of time? We know now it's variable. That there is no time when things travel at the speed of light or time stands still. Things can only travel at the speed of light when they have no mass. Still though variable it does still exist... so if there has always mass there has always been time.
Therefore at some point in time Mass did not exist. Which there is plenty of stuff that defies the Laws of Conservation of mass but none that I know of that involves the creation of mass. Just of mass being less then it should be.
So if god exists he likely doesn't have any mass. A massless being uneffected by time, or better able to perceive it through use of more dimensions then we could is about as plausable as any other explination of how mass is created until we find out how mass is created. Be it massless god or something else unknown.
Either that or time does not exist how we believe and really is infinite and each moment is the "Middle" of time... in which case time really isn't time and we'll all always exist as all time really happens simlataniously it's just we can't perceive it as such. Which even of itself still does not disprove god.

| Kayanator said: No I don't believe there is one. Heck, I wouldn't be able to live in the USA full of Christians. And the reason I don't believe is because the idea is ridiculous. Do we believe in pink fire breathing dragons? No. This is no different. Show me proof and I'll believe. |
Actually. If you don't believe in god you should believe in Pink fire breathing dragons. In an infinite existance they've likely existed at some point before now as well as just about everything else you can think of. Except for god I guess. ![]()

Where did I ever imply infinite existence? We know how old the universe and earth approximately are. God has nothing to do with it.
| footbag said: "Taking into account all the different variables that would have to just right for life, distance from sun etc" If there are an infinate number of stars in our universe, and only one in a billion have planets rotating around them. And of the stars that have planets rotating around them, if only one in a billion have the right variables for life. And of the planets that have the right variables for life, if only one in a billion actually have life. Then there are still an infinate number of planets with life within our universe. |
"Infinate number of stars"? Where are you from the 1600's? There is most definitly a finite number of stars. I'd suggest "A Brief History of Time" for some basic physics.
It's a really easy to understand physics book written by Stephen Hawking. Guy has a pretty good sense of humor... i guess considering his situation he'd need tone to not go insane.

| Darc Requiem said: I believe there is something out there. I don't buy the Big Bang Theory, yet I don't know put much stock in a book that has been translated an uncountable number of times into several different languages. I have seen a few things not explainable by science. I don't believe in organized religion to be honest. I think religion causes more deaths than even the love of money. |
Translations have actually proven quite accurate. When the actual Dead Sea Scrolls (mostly Jeremiah) were discovered, scholars compared current translations (reliable ones, not stupid ones) and found that there were only a few differences which were generally gramatical phrasing (i.e. I have a brown dog vs. I have a dog that is brown) and no differences in any actual content/purpose. I, being a Christian, obviously believe this is because God wouldn't let his message to mankind be obscurred and vandalized, but it's feasible even from an objective perspective. Think about it, the people translating and copying this text were extremely devout and were no doubt beyond meticulous in their task.
On topic, I believe in God. Science has only confirmed that idea (rather than make it less believable). As you come to understand how complex even simple things are, I don't see how there's any other conclusion than intelligent design. Plus, there's the whole issue of where did everything come from. Even if you believe the Big Bang, where did the matter involved in it come from. No matter which way you look at it, in order to end the chain of where things come from, you have to end at something that has no beginning.
Oh, and about the "murdering in the name of God," so what? If someone kills a man in your name (i.e. I'm doing this for tarheel91!), does it mean you condone it? Of course not. Just because someone says they're killing in the name of God doesn't mean he's received God's approval. Oh, and not all religions lack a satisfying answer for why suffering persists if a loving God exists. People assume mainstream Christian is the only Christian. -_-;

| Kayanator said: Where did I ever imply infinite existence? We know how old the universe and earth approximately are. God has nothing to do with it. |
By saying there is no god you imply infinite existance. From a scientific standpoint anyway. Those that don't believe in a God believe in an infinite existance of the universe. Or atleast those that believe so out of science as opposed to just not wanting to believe in God.
Once again I suggest "A Brief History of time" followed up by some more Stephen Hawking reading.
As he puts it. "The Boundary condition of the universe is that it has no boundary." The Universe would be self-contained and not anything outside itself. IT would neither be created or destroyed. It would just be."
It's all due to "Imaginiary Time". Really if your going to be an atheist "A Brief History of Time" is a must read so you know what you are believing in as opposed to worrying only about what you don't believe in.
Personally I believe in Physics, Quantum Physics and God.
It should be noted however that even Stephen Hawking doesn't believe there is definitly no god. Just that if god exists he works in a very logical way and is arbitrary about it just making stuff appear.
