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Forums - Microsoft - And then there was (Xbox) One - How Xbox plans to change Television forever

Jereel Hunter on 05 June 2013
OdinHades said:
No matter what Microsoft does, they will get crushed by Google. Google will win this TV race just with their low prices. You can get Android Boxes for your TV already for like 50 - 100 €. So even if Microsoft does this or that better, combining every video service on the planet and whatnot, they can't compete. Windows Phone also does some things better than Android but they have no chance in hell. And the fact that all the TV features are only available in the US at launch doesn't exactly feel like they have it all fixed with content providers. Besides, surely you need Xbox Live Gold for all that. so another subscription you won't have to pay with Android.

Just don't fuck with Android. Seriously. If you ask me, it's another useless approach of Microsoft to play with the big boys. They just don't like the fact that they are not the biggest player in this day and age. They really need to get their shit together, especially Windows, as it's their main business and heavily struggling right now. They sure do sit on a lot of money, but if they keep up with their business strategies, throwing out money out of the window like there's no tomorrow, that money will decrease.

I might be horribly wrong, but I just don't see Microsoft having an edge in any way when it comes to TV. It's hard to sell people some additional box for watching TV to begin with and they wanna try just that with a console that will cost maybe 499 €. You can get a new TV for that! We'll have to wait and see, but I don't see a revolution coming.

you think a $100 Android box is going to be close to the capabilities of the Xbox One? It's not. And the Xbox one will already sell 25+ million over the next 5 years in the US based on it's gaming capabilities alone. It's not like this is a new device that needs to sell purely on it's merits as a TV player.

And do you know about the companies you're talking about? Microsoft wants to play with the "big boys"? You do realize Microsoft has more revenue and profit than Google right? Microsoft is one of the primary "big boys". Maybe not in television (yet), but they have the resources to change that... rapidly. People said similar things about them in the console business a few years ago, and guess what? It's Sony's bottom line that paid for Microsoft's entrance into the console market - MS succeeded where many said they'd fail.

Don't count them out just yet.

P.S. What does being able to get a new TV for that price have to do with anything? You need content to play on that TV, or it's useless.



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Jereel Hunter on 05 June 2013
Osc89 said:
disolitude said:
Osc89 said:

Yes, but this is what everyone is doing. You have Apple, Google, Sony and Intel on top of many others. And Apple and Sony have far stronger ties to the industry so odds are they will be the first to crack it.

Even Nintendo tried with TVii, but it hasn't really made any waves.


For starters lets clarify what "everyone" is doing.  

The companies you listed are mostly attempting to bring their versions of IP based set top boxes, some of which combine some cable content aspects. IPTV is only part of the story and really isn't what is being discussed here.

None of the companies you listed have devices or technology that is able to combine all types of content(linear, digital, IP, PVR...) in to a seamless experience that is taylored to individual viewers and their viewing habbits. Its really not something that Apple, Sony and Intel can do very well because they do not have the means to collect and target user data in a manner Microsoft and Google can (google and google ID,  bing and Microsoft account). How is apple going to scan the internet and find the video I want to watch and seamlessly start playing? They can't... They require users to launch apps, and search tmenselves on different apps and buckets of content.

The main roadblock in development of Television is that companies that own content want it to be consumed in the means that benefits them the most and can't find common ground. Comcast wants you to pay them 60 bucks and get their set top box, Youtube wants you to create an account and comment on videos, netflix wants you to pay monthly fee as well and connect with their app.

Xbox One is striving to be this common ground. Combine cable, combine digital subscription, combine IPTV...watch anything...but not worry about who owns it, where its coming from, which app has it, and what channel its on.


I'm not sure why you think the rest aren't trying to be this common ground. Google has Google TV. Sony has the PS3, as well as smart tvs. Both of these companies have already combined everything. Apple is also heavily rumoured to be producing something along these lines, and is probably best positioned as it has the strongest ties and content because of iTunes.

The only difference between what everyone is offering is how seamless the experience is. And that takes a long time and a lot of deals. Google TV tried to do exactly what Microsoft is trying now and they still haven't got everybody on board 3 years later, so their unified search is still patchy and missing providers. Why will Microsoft manage to do this instantly? They have started latest, have the fewest ties and the least experience.

Well, Microsoft is hardly doing this "instantly." things have been moving in this direction for a while. MS is better positioned than you might think - Apple may have iTunes, and Google may have google TV, but neither of them have a lot of boxes in people's living rooms, yet. Microsoft is adding this capability to a product they are already guaranteed of selling tens of millions of. They're simply expanding the capabilities of their system, and increasing their potential customers. I'd say the PS4 is their biggest potential competitor, even in this market, due to it's ability to also attract people who want to buy 1 device for all entertainment needs.



Adinnieken on 05 June 2013
Nem said:

A purchase is not a one-dimensional decision process. If i remove those factors the Xbox one will have more TV features, but then it wouldnt be a games console i was buying now would it? And the fact that these will probably require a gold subscription seems very relevant, since you would have to pay an additional fee to have acess to all these features.

I just cant see how the Xbox one would have better value because of these features, unless it wasnt a games console or if you were planning to buy a set up box anyways.

So to you a feature beyond the basic set of features that you ask for aren't an added value.  Gotcha.

So from your perspective, every gaming console should be the Yugo of consoles?  Don't add features and value beyond meeting the basic needs that gamers want or ask for.   



SvennoJ on 05 June 2013
Adinnieken said:
SvennoJ said:
 

Do you not see that that is no advantageous at all to a lot of people. I don't want to also pay for xbox live, netflix, hulu, per episode, per movie, etc, or watch commercials again. The only thing I want is for my cable box to stop showing program times for shows on channels I'm not subscribed to, not offer up a whole bunch more options I don't have access to.

Cable already does it all. Kids watch their cartoons on demand (no commercials in the kids streams luckily), my wife and I use the dvr to watch the stuff we want. We both fast forward through a lot of stuff just for the interesting bits. Tv or just the amp is usually on as background noise as well since it also has radio channels. At night it's on with some boring rerun or something to fall asleep with.

Xbox one as a cable box replacement/enhancement is pretty pointless unless it has multi room DVR capabilities. For a single person living by himself with selective viewing, iptv is probably cheaper then cable. It's a lot less interesting for families.

I don't disagree with your point.  For some people, the Guide on the Xbox One and the capabilities it has for enhancing the TV viewing experience won't be a selling point.  That's fine.  It doesn't detract from the capabilities of the Xbox One.  It's an additional feature on top of it's core feature, which is playing games.

Sure, I'll be using it for games mainly (if they drop the online drm or when sub $15 steam sales happen)

I kind of feel the Xbox One is build for the optimal experience of One user. When we're watching something together popping up crap is intrusive to the other viewers. Plus putting all stuff in one box is not great when someone wants to play a game in one room while the other wants to watch tv in the other.

It can be great for people that already know what they want to watch and are looking for the content. My wife and I are not that actively engaged in tv watching though. A menu with what's available atm, and a dvr that automatically records a couple of things is plenty. No worries about bandwidth, going over monthly limits, whether a show is worth the admission price, what quality it's at, or has to be watched withing 48 hours. 

I can see how it might become the way we watch tv in the future. First we'll need faster internet without bandwidth caps, then an affordable box for every room, and consistent quality, availability and pricing accross the board. A long way to go yet.
Anyway I'm glad for the competition as it indirectly makes my cable service better too. I can now program my 2 dvrs over the web, on demand has greatly improved and they've finally got some fire to improve their interface.



Osc89 on 05 June 2013
Jereel Hunter said:
Osc89 said:
I'm not sure why you think the rest aren't trying to be this common ground. Google has Google TV. Sony has the PS3, as well as smart tvs. Both of these companies have already combined everything. Apple is also heavily rumoured to be producing something along these lines, and is probably best positioned as it has the strongest ties and content because of iTunes.

The only difference between what everyone is offering is how seamless the experience is. And that takes a long time and a lot of deals. Google TV tried to do exactly what Microsoft is trying now and they still haven't got everybody on board 3 years later, so their unified search is still patchy and missing providers. Why will Microsoft manage to do this instantly? They have started latest, have the fewest ties and the least experience.

Well, Microsoft is hardly doing this "instantly." things have been moving in this direction for a while. MS is better positioned than you might think - Apple may have iTunes, and Google may have google TV, but neither of them have a lot of boxes in people's living rooms, yet. Microsoft is adding this capability to a product they are already guaranteed of selling tens of millions of. They're simply expanding the capabilities of their system, and increasing their potential customers. I'd say the PS4 is their biggest potential competitor, even in this market, due to it's ability to also attract people who want to buy 1 device for all entertainment needs.


By instantly I was referring to the unified search. Pretty much anyone can have a Netflix app on their device. But for Netflix to give database access from outside the app requires them to make a separate deal. And they won't be keen, as they don't want their content to be seen combined (and on par) with their competitors. The same applies to every other streaming company.

Without unified search, the XB1 will do what the PS360 can already do, but with voice control.



PSN: Osc89

NNID: Oscar89

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disolitude on 05 June 2013
Osc89 said:
Jereel Hunter said:
Osc89 said:
I'm not sure why you think the rest aren't trying to be this common ground. Google has Google TV. Sony has the PS3, as well as smart tvs. Both of these companies have already combined everything. Apple is also heavily rumoured to be producing something along these lines, and is probably best positioned as it has the strongest ties and content because of iTunes.

The only difference between what everyone is offering is how seamless the experience is. And that takes a long time and a lot of deals. Google TV tried to do exactly what Microsoft is trying now and they still haven't got everybody on board 3 years later, so their unified search is still patchy and missing providers. Why will Microsoft manage to do this instantly? They have started latest, have the fewest ties and the least experience.

Well, Microsoft is hardly doing this "instantly." things have been moving in this direction for a while. MS is better positioned than you might think - Apple may have iTunes, and Google may have google TV, but neither of them have a lot of boxes in people's living rooms, yet. Microsoft is adding this capability to a product they are already guaranteed of selling tens of millions of. They're simply expanding the capabilities of their system, and increasing their potential customers. I'd say the PS4 is their biggest potential competitor, even in this market, due to it's ability to also attract people who want to buy 1 device for all entertainment needs.


By instantly I was referring to the unified search. Pretty much anyone can have a Netflix app on their device. But for Netflix to give database access from outside the app requires them to make a separate deal. And they won't be keen, as they don't want their content to be seen combined (and on par) with their competitors. The same applies to every other streaming company.

Without unified search, the XB1 will do what the PS360 can already do, but with voice control.

Check out the video at 2:12... Unified search will exist in Windows 8.1



Osc89 on 05 June 2013
disolitude said:
Osc89 said:
By instantly I was referring to the unified search. Pretty much anyone can have a Netflix app on their device. But for Netflix to give database access from outside the app requires them to make a separate deal. And they won't be keen, as they don't want their content to be seen combined (and on par) with their competitors. The same applies to every other streaming company.

Without unified search, the XB1 will do what the PS360 can already do, but with voice control.

Check out the video at 2:12... Unified search will exist in Windows 8.1


It looks like they are grabbing information from Wikipedia and YouTube. It's not the same as having access to the Netflix database.



PSN: Osc89

NNID: Oscar89

disolitude on 05 June 2013
Osc89 said:
disolitude said:
Osc89 said:
By instantly I was referring to the unified search. Pretty much anyone can have a Netflix app on their device. But for Netflix to give database access from outside the app requires them to make a separate deal. And they won't be keen, as they don't want their content to be seen combined (and on par) with their competitors. The same applies to every other streaming company.

Without unified search, the XB1 will do what the PS360 can already do, but with voice control.

Check out the video at 2:12... Unified search will exist in Windows 8.1

 


It looks like they are grabbing information from Wikipedia and YouTube. It's not the same as having access to the Netflix database.

Correct but this really wouldn't be the challenging aspect for something like this...

Windows 8 already has the ability to search Netflix outside of Netflix library. Swipe from right to bring charms, select search, type movie title, and tap netflix. You are not searching netflix through netflix but through Win 8 universal search.



Adinnieken on 05 June 2013
SvennoJ said:

Sure, I'll be using it for games mainly (if they drop the online drm or when sub $15 steam sales happen)

I kind of feel the Xbox One is build for the optimal experience of One user. When we're watching something together popping up crap is intrusive to the other viewers. Plus putting all stuff in one box is not great when someone wants to play a game in one room while the other wants to watch tv in the other.

It can be great for people that already know what they want to watch and are looking for the content. My wife and I are not that actively engaged in tv watching though. A menu with what's available atm, and a dvr that automatically records a couple of things is plenty. No worries about bandwidth, going over monthly limits, whether a show is worth the admission price, what quality it's at, or has to be watched withing 48 hours. 

I can see how it might become the way we watch tv in the future. First we'll need faster internet without bandwidth caps, then an affordable box for every room, and consistent quality, availability and pricing accross the board. A long way to go yet.
Anyway I'm glad for the competition as it indirectly makes my cable service better too. I can now program my 2 dvrs over the web, on demand has greatly improved and they've finally got some fire to improve their interface.

Why?  The way you watch TV now would/could still be the same way you watch TV with the Xbox One.  The only difference is that Xbox One will provide whatever existing service you have with voice and motion controls.  So, you can be watching TV on one channel and switch to another just by saying it.  In addition though, it'll offer you suggestions based on what everyone else is currently watching.  So if everyone is watching Game of Thrones, then it may suggest you watch it.

With Xbox One you'll have access to your console with SmartGlass, but your TV services that you're already subscribed to would still be accessed via the existing apps you already have.

Xbox One isn't going to provide IPTV service.  I just said in the long-term I believe that is the direction Microsoft really intends to head.  I think we're a long way away from that point.



yo_john117 on 05 June 2013
disolitude said:
Osc89 said:

By instantly I was referring to the unified search. Pretty much anyone can have a Netflix app on their device. But for Netflix to give database access from outside the app requires them to make a separate deal. And they won't be keen, as they don't want their content to be seen combined (and on par) with their competitors. The same applies to every other streaming company.

Without unified search, the XB1 will do what the PS360 can already do, but with voice control.

Check out the video at 2:12... Unified search will exist in Windows 8.1

Wow, looks like Windows 8 (especially on tablets) is getting a serious overhaul. They're fixing and adding all the things that I felt could be improved.

Is there any news for when it comes out?