i'm so late to the party but Sonys game division has not been taking loses as of late, and ninty has nothing to do with
Sony cutting power.

at this point for Sony, it's about profit and strategy, and with the specutated RAM of 8-16, PS4 will likely not need all that power, and Blu-ray will still be the driving force behind the graphic's for PS4.

where did i say that has to be sold at a lost? i was kidding but seriously? who want cheap weak HW? i know casuals want... but not me... if sony want to be a part of the gaming industry, as MS and nintendo, they must please the gamers first, the casuals later. gamers spend more money on HW and games... people that spend lots of money on games are what will drive sony, MS or nintendo to a big fail? my guess is no... 300$? i hope not... to be a little better for media and public opinion, go for 449 (low SKU and a better for 499) that is a break even and work from there... that price is not for everyone, you might say, in true, nothing is... even bottled water is expensive for someone... there is no way sony, MS and nintendo can please everyone. i personally prefer the higher instead of the middle ground.

You do realize the irony in what you posted here? Sony didn't focus on casuals and are now in financial chaos, MS didn't focus on them until Kinect and only started making money until the latter, Nintendo catered to the casuals and are printing cash. The market has shifted, you need both groups but the casuals now out weigh everyone else because you can still make loads of money on them due to the sales they generate, a broad approach is now the market standard.

They arnt' in "financial chaos" as you put because of their gaming division, That was turned around a long time again. If anything it was because they had their hands in to many Pies and it has shown that they've have servery stopped the bleeding and is looking like they will turn things around. All while making investments to secure their financial future.  Got to love people that think they know it all.

Yet I didn't say the it's all down to their gaming division and anyone can see the context is down to the gaming side of things we were speaking of and even then their gaming division hardly pulled in the cash to offset the losses the gaming side of Sony has been hammered with which means that focusing solely on the avid gamers is not the way to go like some think. The bleeding has stopped but the damage is still their to be repaired finances don't just recover over night why do you Kaz made comments about sorting this huge mess out, last I checked BR in the PS3 was also an investment for the future when PS3 launched and that certainly helped with finances didn't it so that doesn't really mean anything to us at the moment. Ironic that you yourself have acted like you know it all, got to love people who want to one up everyone.

About the Wii thing - that's just what I think. The Wii was not a competition for the PS360, it created its own market. If you wanted the full gaming experience this gen you had to buy a (PS3 OR X-box 360) AND a Wii. That's why I don't think you can so easily put it in the same basket.

@the bolded part - as I wrote, that's the situation in my country, Poland. It's the 6th biggest economy in the EU with 40 million people (more than Canada), so it's quite a big country, and each of the 3 companies had a totally different approach to this market. Sony had the best approach. They gave us the console, free working PSN, translated all their exclusives into Polish hiring famous movie stars from our country - really high quality stuff! Their approach was perfect. Then you have MS. They gave us the console with one free month of Live included... but there was no Live in Poland. They finally graced us with Live on 10th of November 2010, with the suggested price of $80 per year... Obviously they didn't care to translate games for the same amount of time. Still, Nintendo was even worse. There was no Nintendo Poland, they didn't even ship and distribute the consoles here on their own. Instead a company from Austria was resposible for this market. And it couldn't care less... We had no service, no campaigns... nothing. If I select Poland in my Wii settings I can't play online, cause it's blocked... Obviously no games are translated. What is the result? The PS3 is the most dominant console, X-box is in the second place, mostly because people used to buy it to play pirated games, since there was no risk of getting an online ban anyway, lol ;) And the Wii and DS are totally non-existent! I don't know a single person who ownes one of these. In many game stores they don't even sell games for Nintendo consoles, you have to buy them online or go to the biggest chain stores to see a few random games on a shelf. 2 months ago I went to a service with my DSi and the guy was so excited when I gave him my console, cause he said it's the first time ever that he gets to work on a DS!! And he had more than 20 PSPs  on the table next to him that he was working on...

What does this mean? That in Europe you get what you deserve! Even such sure winners like Wii and DS got obliterated from this market. The company that gave the best offer dominated the market, but when MS finally started to care by giving us Live, starting to organise Game Days and releasing games in Polish they started to pick up and now they really are present on the market. Obviously they are still far behind Sony, but they are present.

This is why I believe that in Europe, and actually in Europe only, the best offer wins. In Japan it's going to be Nintendo and Sony. In US it's going to be X-box and maybe Nintendo, if the Wii U still is that much different from the MS product (which I doubt). Europe is a zone that anyone can take, you just have to be the best. It's not Sonyland. It's just that Sony's offer is by far the best.

what irony? sony didn't focus on casuals and that isn't by far, their biggest mistake this gen (they did some, and i can't see this one being a mistake, more of a business orientation)... i think the biggest mistake was on nintendo part relying specially on casuals that bought the console, cool because was profitable from day 1, but those people bought how many games? 47 like myself? i doubt that... wii was a trend and the road wii U is walking is the proof that wii was a short term success and that keeping above in this business is all about the gamers... bring more people into gaming is key also but they have to lure them in for the long run... in MS case, Live Gold is key in their success and the last time i check it, gamers pay for that, hardly any kinect casuals pay for that. if sony can avoid the mistakes (specially sell with at a lost) this gen and keep the high quality HW (along side with the good things they have), they will be fine in this industry...

The irony is that the casuals are actually generating money, they may not buy you CODS and such but look at the sales of Nintendo's first party games and how long they sell for. Sony have enough first party to keep the avid group happy and should instead look for a more broad approach, Wii was a short term success yet has lasted 6 years against two HD consoles when generations before lasted only 5, the U is coming at a perfectly scheduled time as the next gen is overdue at the moment. MS have even identfied the importance of the casual group to the market and business, they may not play the games we do but it doesn't mean they're less relevant in fact with the way the market has shifted they're probably more relevant then any of us, Nintendo have been propelled to market leader and made a tonne of money with minimal third party support and lasted 6 years against superior tech.

All this while two competitors have fought over the avid group and lost money, that in itself speaks for itself in how avid gamers compare to casuals, we're more here to keep third parties a float now not platform holders, I seriously wouldn't blame Sony for going a more conservative approach as unlike what some people think I doubt the casuals are just going to vanish and hold more relevance then people would like to believe.

Not focusing on casuals wasn't a mistake they made this gen as it was near impossible to predict the market shift unless you're Gamespot doing an April Fools but it would be a mistake to dismiss casuals in the next gen.

Did I read this correctly? The PS4 chip will cost about $1billion to make compared to the $400million of the Cell?
SoC is a CPU +  GPU right? Is that high price for this? I heard SoC are less expensive in the long-run. 

Why do you have the UK listed in your profile if you live in Poland?

And the reason why Sony has such a presence there over Nintendo is because Sony is a huge global consumer electronics, music and movie giant.   If all they sold were video games, like Nintendo, you'd have the same problem.  Same with MS being a huge corporation over Nintendo.

Nintendo - 5,000 employees.
Sony - 160,000 employees.

I'm not trying to use this as an excuse for the situation, only to provide the context for why the situation is the way it is.  A lot of gamers tend to forget just how big of a difference these 2 companies are.