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Forums - General Discussion - Interesting (or perhaps, silly) Philosophical Question

"You" or your consciousnesses would wake up in your own body, but unless marked with a marker, the outer world wouldn't be able to tell the difference between the two.

I was wondering to myself about teleportation once, about how the information that travels through the internet is just a copy of the original, but an outside observer can't tell the difference either way. If humans learned how to teleport, there would always be a small suspicion that the people who come out through the other side would simply be copies of the original people and no one would ever be able to tell the difference... furthermore, that would mean that the original person (or their consciousnesses) was destroyed o_0



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Oh, I remember this question from the course of philosophy in my university last year.. But the case was about teleportation to Mars (after teleportation your "original" body stays on Earth and your exact "copy" appears on Mars at the same time, somehow like in John Carter). Too bad I don't remember its full interpretation. The main question is who exactly are you and what is the meaning of "you" and difference between "you" and your "copy". Maybe it's time to refresh some memories..




 

@wfz

That is a very good question, and it comes in two different flavor. Either you are referring to a profound hibernation, or a state of complete suspension. In the prior your brain would still be functional even if it were running at a very slow rate. While in the later all the matter in your body has ceased activity entirely. So for the first one there isn't any real conflict. A deep sleep being in no real sense any different from regular sleep.

However in the second case I would postulate that there would be a profound impact, because to put matter all the way down to a state of near motionlessness. You would have to bleed the energy out of the system. That can not be stopped. Your mind would simply bleed away via forces of quantum tunneling. Best case scenario would be upon reanimation is your brain spends a considerable amount of time misfiring as the previous inputs would have been lost. Worse case scenario is its impossible for a mind to emerge from a cold start. You would never be able to function. Your brain would never reassert itself in a controlled manner. Which would obviously kill the person.

People just aren't designed to be completely shut down. Doing so would probably be extremely dangerous, and it is hard to see justifying such as experiment. Besides it wouldn't be like living forever. It would be like being dead, because you would become nonliving matter, and with no energy in the system there would be no potential. It is hard to imagine that a mind can run around inside of a rock. Which is exactly what you would become.



miz1q2w3e said:
"You" or your consciousnesses would wake up in your own body, but unless marked with a marker, the outer world wouldn't be able to tell the difference between the two.

I was wondering to myself about teleportation once, about how the information that travels through the internet is just a copy of the original, but an outside observer can't tell the difference either way. If humans learned how to teleport, there would always be a small suspicion that the people who come out through the other side would simply be copies of the original people and no one would ever be able to tell the difference... furthermore, that would mean that the original person (or their consciousnesses) was destroyed o_0


Here's a tougher one: If you would split every atom of your body and then put them together again, you would certainly still have all of your memories and consciousness intact. But what if you split all your atoms and replaced them with new ones? o.0



IIIIITHE1IIIII said:
miz1q2w3e said:
"You" or your consciousnesses would wake up in your own body, but unless marked with a marker, the outer world wouldn't be able to tell the difference between the two.

I was wondering to myself about teleportation once, about how the information that travels through the internet is just a copy of the original, but an outside observer can't tell the difference either way. If humans learned how to teleport, there would always be a small suspicion that the people who come out through the other side would simply be copies of the original people and no one would ever be able to tell the difference... furthermore, that would mean that the original person (or their consciousnesses) was destroyed o_0

Here's a tougher one: If you would split every atom of your body and then put them together again, you would certainly still have all of your memories and consciousness intact. But what if you split all your atoms and replaced them with new ones? o.0

omg have you played the game 999 on DS? I just finished it the other week and it mentioned the exact same crazy theories XD Really cool game btw

Anyways, I'm not even sure the first case would keep your consciousness intact since a brain can't function when split up so you'd "die" the instant you got split up. If you were put back together in the same way, it'd just be like a copy of you.

Just noticed the way I wrote that, sounded as though I was certain but I actually have no idea lol :p



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miz1q2w3e said:
IIIIITHE1IIIII said:

Here's a tougher one: If you would split every atom of your body and then put them together again, you would certainly still have all of your memories and consciousness intact. But what if you split all your atoms and replaced them with new ones? o.0

omg have you played the game 999 on DS? I just finished it the other week and it mentioned the exact same crazy theories XD Really cool game btw

Anyways, I'm not even sure the first case would keep your consciousness intact since a brain can't function when split up so you'd "die" the instant you got split up. If you were put back together in the same way, it'd just be like a copy of you.

Just noticed the way I wrote that, sounded as though I was certain but I actually have no idea lol :p

Well, we can't be certain :P, but I don't see a single difference between now and if my atoms were split and then put back together. I would literally be the same guy with nothing different from before the split. It wouldn't be a copy of me, it would be me O.O'



IIIIITHE1IIIII said:
miz1q2w3e said:
"You" or your consciousnesses would wake up in your own body, but unless marked with a marker, the outer world wouldn't be able to tell the difference between the two.

I was wondering to myself about teleportation once, about how the information that travels through the internet is just a copy of the original, but an outside observer can't tell the difference either way. If humans learned how to teleport, there would always be a small suspicion that the people who come out through the other side would simply be copies of the original people and no one would ever be able to tell the difference... furthermore, that would mean that the original person (or their consciousnesses) was destroyed o_0


Here's a tougher one: If you would split every atom of your body and then put them together again, you would certainly still have all of your memories and consciousness intact. But what if you split all your atoms and replaced them with new ones? o.0

Your constantly swap out cells. You don't keep the same atoms all your life anyway. On average your body is only ever between 11-15 years old. For a long time scientist believed that brain cells never regenerate but since 1998 new found evidence suggest that parts of your brain also regenerates. http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn11188-brain-cell-regeneration-sniffed-out-in-adult-humans.html

"furthermore, that would mean that the original person (or their consciousnesses) was destroyed"
That depends what conciousness is. I believe conciousness is part of the information, not dependent on the hardware. So you would have effictively copied your conciousness after teleportation. Would 'wiping' out the original then be murder or suicide?

Not a problem though with the current theorical view of quantum teleportation as the original is destroyed in the process of measuring. Would you ever use such a device though, sending yourself without crc checks?



SvennoJ said:
IIIIITHE1IIIII said:
miz1q2w3e said:
"You" or your consciousnesses would wake up in your own body, but unless marked with a marker, the outer world wouldn't be able to tell the difference between the two.

I was wondering to myself about teleportation once, about how the information that travels through the internet is just a copy of the original, but an outside observer can't tell the difference either way. If humans learned how to teleport, there would always be a small suspicion that the people who come out through the other side would simply be copies of the original people and no one would ever be able to tell the difference... furthermore, that would mean that the original person (or their consciousnesses) was destroyed o_0


Here's a tougher one: If you would split every atom of your body and then put them together again, you would certainly still have all of your memories and consciousness intact. But what if you split all your atoms and replaced them with new ones? o.0

Your constantly swap out cells. You don't keep the same atoms all your life anyway. On average your body is only ever between 11-15 years old. For a long time scientist believed that brain cells never regenerate but since 1998 new found evidence suggest that parts of your brain also regenerates. http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn11188-brain-cell-regeneration-sniffed-out-in-adult-humans.html

"furthermore, that would mean that the original person (or their consciousnesses) was destroyed"
That depends what conciousness is. I believe conciousness is part of the information, not dependent on the hardware. So you would have effictively copied your conciousness after teleportation. Would 'wiping' out the original then be murder or suicide?

Not a problem though with the current theorical view of quantum teleportation as the original is destroyed in the process of measuring. Would you ever use such a device though, sending yourself without crc checks?

Yes individual cells regenerate, but not all at once... if all cells in the body are destroyed then the thought processes running at the time of destruction would be stopped. As such the newly created body would essentially be a blank slate. And a dead one at that as the heart is regulated by an electrical pulse, though admitedly in that case it would be possible to start the heart with a defibrillator. If that turns out to be a requirement of teleportation though I am pretty sure it won't become a viable method of transportation.

As Dodece mentioned though, if the processes in the body are stopped, either by complete suspended animation or by destruction then re-construction of cells, then the mind would not be recovered. If there is to be a viable method of complete suspension or teleportation then the thought patterns in the brain have to be mapped and stored somehow before being transferred back into the body (be it the original if coming back from suspension, or a new identical body in the total cell reproduction case)



You exist in both, and are no longer unique.

If they replicated your brain, then both bodies would have the memory of being frozen, so both would say they are the original body. The two beings would go insane because they wouldn't be able to prove to themselves that one or the other is the original. Unless the original comes out of a pod marked "original" then yes, or if the scientists tell them.



e=mc^2

Gaming on: PS4 Pro, Switch, SNES Mini, Wii U, PC (i5-7400, GTX 1060)

It's no silly question. Philosophy is beautiful; My favorite is skepticism. Prove to me you are not currently dreaming and the world around you is real.



e=mc^2

Gaming on: PS4 Pro, Switch, SNES Mini, Wii U, PC (i5-7400, GTX 1060)