Good to see this site is still going 
| RolStoppable said: It's a great article about Microsoft's videogame business and their questionable business practices. Malstrom is definitely right when saying it's not the question IF Microsoft will leave the console market, it is WHEN. I also thought about the possible future of the videogame industry as a whole if Nintendo really totally dominates this generation with the Wii. If so, MS and Sony would take billions of losses since their loss-leading strategies will fail badly. When Sony took the lead in this market they were competing against a weakened Sega and against an arrogant Nintendo causing 3rd parties to drop support. The N64 era was Nintendo's worst time in this industry considering their decisions and arrogance. The gamecube era was a lot better, although with going into the race again with 18 months trailing wasn't wise. The gc strategy wasn't good either, as we know trying to become market leader just by doing the same things as the competition better, does not succeed. The Wii is a totally different beast that will rise Nintendo back to the #1 spot, which they deserve. So after this 7th generation Sony would have to compete with the strongest Nintendo we have ever seen. Just doing the same as Nintendo, only better won't give Sony again the lead. They would need to have some disruptive element to this industry again. After all, the new market leaders in this industry always took the top spot because they had disruptive business strategies. Given the fact that Sony is/was never really innovative in this business I don't see any reason why they would have a chance against this mighty Nintendo. The risk to lose again lots of money in this business will be far too high for Sony. Plus they need a new brand since the PSP and especially the PS3 are hurting the playstation name. As for Microsoft, well, they have the cash to do some more Xboxes, but why would they continue to throw money into this business once their primary reason to enter the industry has gone. |
all right...
only to remember those superb loading times on N64...
something that capcom could understand with marvellus porting of RE2...
and EX-square-soft couldn't (they need waste of mbytes for those stupid FMVs...)
nowdays:
-SQUARE SOFT DOESN'T EXIST ANY MORE.
(THEY MERGED WITH ENIX BUT LOOKING ANNUAL SOFTCO CHART THEY NEVER GOT PODIUM)
-CAPCOM RESURRECTION WITH SPLENDID RE4.
-NINTENDO STRONGER THAN EVER.
or
not to speak about RARE...
third parties and second parties that betrayed nintendo simply don't exixt anymore like in "gold ages"...
Nintendo is still here.
maybe Nintendo was "arrogant" ...
MARIO64 and LOZ:Ocarina Of Time prove only that they were right...
good programmers make good games...others say they haven't enough space for crappy videos!!
| Kwaad said: Actually Halo is 1st party, as Microsoft owns Bungie. |
That's what I said.
It is a first-party IP that is developed by a second-party developer(Bungie). The same can be said for Jak & Daxter, which is owned by Sony but developed by Naughty Dog. Twisted Metal and Warhawk fit this as well(both developed by Incognito, which is owned by Sony). Ratchet & Clank is owned by Sony but is actually developed by a third-party(Insomniac Games).
Consoles owned: Saturn, Dreamcast, PS1, PS2, PSP, DS, PS3
Saying that sony or MS are dropping because 1 or 2 bad gens is like saying that nintendo was supposed to drop out after GC
| bdbdbd said: Sony has been so far profitable, but soon profit making PS2 leaves the market. Then theres only PSP and PS3 for Sony. This means, that before that, they have to start making profit with PS3. Looking at Sonys financial situation, which is not wery good, they can't afford wasting money the same way M$ can afford. To boost PS3 sales, they have to drop price and invest on a massive advertisement campain. Looking at financials again, they can't afford doing this, even that they have to. Even that Sony has invested a lot to PS3, they have to think over, that is there a possibility to break even with PS3, and if not they have to mark PS3 investments as a loss and maybe even to sell the SCE (now we should remember the PSP), maybe to M$, Nintendo or Sega. Sony is going to focus more on the first party games development, but they increase their risks also, if they are not planning to go as a 3rd party developer. In a situation, in which Sony is, companies usually sell their non-primary business areas, even Sony is doing so. Just look how they quit the TV manufacturing. Sonys problem is, that it works in too many areas. From M$ and Sony, it's hard to say which one would be first to leave, M$ has the money to hang on until they can be profitable, Sony does not, but they have showed that they can make profitable consoles, but they can't afford to wait if sales aren't decent. Both have bad business strategies at the moment. |
This concerns the gaming divisions. The other divisions in the company mean nothing. Sure, Microsoft can afford more losses than Sony because of the revenue from Windows and Office, but investors are going to want to see a profit from the 360 regardless of what they're making with their operating systems and office tools. If you'll pay special attention to the article, you'll see that even Microsoft is not going to allow a profitable division to babysit one that's losing money.
Also, the PS3 does not need to be the market leader in order to be profitable, and even if it isn't in 1st place at the end of the generation, it wouldn't be that big of a deal. Like I said, the only thing that's really hurting it is the price point, which can be easily remedied. It won't be $600 forever, and even at that price point, its sales haven't been a complete catastrophe, so they will most likely be okay this generation, even if they aren't the market leader.
If Sony were to leave the console market, it would be as a result of everything in their gaming division bombing hard and the PlayStation name being sullied beyond all repair, and they'd have to make 1990's Sega type mistakes with the PS4 and PS5 in order for the Vice President to decide to shut down the division(cut support for the PS2 and PSP, cut ties to third-party developers, refuse to bring popular games to the West, make their system virtually impossible for programmers, etc.), which they haven't done.
You also have to understand that Microsoft's game division isn't as important to it as Sony's is, so the former would have less qualms about nixing it, especially if it's just losing money.
Consoles owned: Saturn, Dreamcast, PS1, PS2, PSP, DS, PS3
| javidaco said: Saying that sony or MS are dropping because 1 or 2 bad gens is like saying that nintendo was supposed to drop out after GC |
The Gamecube was in last place, but it was the only one of the three to turn a consistent profit, so in effect, it was very successful.
Consoles owned: Saturn, Dreamcast, PS1, PS2, PSP, DS, PS3
Sony will likely make a profit with PS3, even if it probably won't be very big. What they're hoping to do is boost profits of HD more than anything game related.
But doesn't that make them second party games? They aren't IN HOUSE Sony which is what 1st party means, 2nd party means companies that create games for that company.
I would call SSBM, Halo, Metroid Prime all 2nd party not 1st party...
| OriGin said: But doesn't that make them second party games? They aren't IN HOUSE Sony which is what 1st party means, 2nd party means companies that create games for that company. I would call SSBM, Halo, Metroid Prime all 2nd party not 1st party... |
I thought the typical definition of first party was a developer who was owned by the console manufacturer; a second party developer was a developer who was in an exclusive publishing contract with a console manufacturer, and a third party developer was a developer who was licenced to produce games for a console. Under this definition Retro, Bungie and Hal Labs would all be first party developers, and Insomniac would be a second party developer.
So Rare is 1st party Microsoft but they were 2nd party Nintendo?
I'm not having a dig or anything i'm just wondering I could be completely wrong with my understanding.
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