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Forums - General - IGN: Top 25 Sci-Fi Movies

sapphi_snake on 15 September 2010
rocketpig said:
sapphi_snake said:
Reasonable said:


I know.  But big names like Asimov, etc. saw it this way and I do think that it's the right (if rarely used) definition.  I tend to dislike genres in general, but if we're gonna have them I want nice clean lines where possible.

For me, if the film isn't directly examining us in a technology or real science manner with regard to ourselves or society then it's not SF.  It's borrowing trappings from SF, it's using SF as a nice setting or selling point, but it's not SF.

Rather oddly (for me) it's one rare place I do find myself taking the elitist stance that only around 10% of what's called SF really is SF.

Your opinion, but that doesn't change the fact that what you don't deem sci fi is widely considered to be a subgenre of sci fi. Heeck I for one was shocked to find out that The Road by Cormack McCarthy is widely considered to be a dystopian novel, yet that's the case I guess.

How wouldn't The Road be considered a dystopian novel? Hell, things don't get much bleaker than that situation short of just having the entire world blow up and everyone die at the end.

A dystopia (from Ancient Greek: δυσ-: bad-, ill- and Ancient Greek: τÏŒπος: place, landscape) (alternatively, cacotopia,[1] or anti-utopia) is, in literature, an often futuristic society that has degraded into a repressive and controlled state, often under the guise of being utopian. Dystopian literature has underlying cautionary tones, warning society that if we continue to live how we do, this will be the consequence. A dystopia is, thus, regarded as a sort of negative utopia and is often characterized by an authoritarian or totalitarian form of government. Dystopias usually feature different kinds of repressive social control systems, a lack or total absence of individual freedoms and expressions and constant states of warfare or violence. Dystopias often explore the concept of technology going "too far" and how humans individually and en masse use technology. A dystopian society is also often characterized by mass poverty for most of its inhabitants and a large military-like police force.

That's the definition of Dystopian taken from Wikipedia. In The Road there was no society whatsoever. It was a post-apocalyptic novel, it didn't deal with a dystopian society, as there was no society to speak of.



"I don't understand how someone could like Tolstoy and Dostoyevsky, but not like Twilight!!!"

"Last book I read was Brokeback Mountain, I just don't have the patience for them unless it's softcore porn."

                                                                               (The Voice of a Generation and Seece)

"If you cant stand the sound of your own voice than dont become a singer !!!!!"

                                                                               (pizzahut451)

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sapphi_snake on 15 September 2010
rocketpig said:
sapphi_snake said:
rocketpig said:

The first movie wasn't a monstrous blockbuster like the second was and it flew under the radar somewhat... and, unfortunately, even "critics" can get wrapped up in visual whiz-bangery, which they did with T2 (I distinctly remember almost every article about the movie being nearly orgasmic over ILM's "liquid metal" effects).

The Romanian film 4 Months, 3 Weeks and 2 Days wasn't a monstrous blockbuster either, yet it recieved monstrous critical acclaim. The fact that The Terminator wasn't as big of a blockbuster as T2 doesn't exccuse the fact that critics liked it less.

So you're bringing up a foreign film made three years ago to prove a point about The Terminator? I don't know how old you are but in the days before the Interwebz, movie criticism was vastly different. Most people received their information from few sources, such as Siskel & Ebert or their local newspaper. Middling action films without a media blitz behind them (such as The Terminator) often received no consideration for anything at all while T2 was a monster largely due to its breakthrough special effects and budget, not the actual quality of the film.

Your opinion! Not a fact!



"I don't understand how someone could like Tolstoy and Dostoyevsky, but not like Twilight!!!"

"Last book I read was Brokeback Mountain, I just don't have the patience for them unless it's softcore porn."

                                                                               (The Voice of a Generation and Seece)

"If you cant stand the sound of your own voice than dont become a singer !!!!!"

                                                                               (pizzahut451)

rocketpig on 15 September 2010
sapphi_snake said:
rocketpig said:
sapphi_snake said:
Reasonable said:


I know.  But big names like Asimov, etc. saw it this way and I do think that it's the right (if rarely used) definition.  I tend to dislike genres in general, but if we're gonna have them I want nice clean lines where possible.

For me, if the film isn't directly examining us in a technology or real science manner with regard to ourselves or society then it's not SF.  It's borrowing trappings from SF, it's using SF as a nice setting or selling point, but it's not SF.

Rather oddly (for me) it's one rare place I do find myself taking the elitist stance that only around 10% of what's called SF really is SF.

Your opinion, but that doesn't change the fact that what you don't deem sci fi is widely considered to be a subgenre of sci fi. Heeck I for one was shocked to find out that The Road by Cormack McCarthy is widely considered to be a dystopian novel, yet that's the case I guess.

How wouldn't The Road be considered a dystopian novel? Hell, things don't get much bleaker than that situation short of just having the entire world blow up and everyone die at the end.

A dystopia (from Ancient Greek: δυσ-: bad-, ill- and Ancient Greek: τÏŒπος: place, landscape) (alternatively, cacotopia,[1] or anti-utopia) is, in literature, an often futuristic society that has degraded into a repressive and controlled state, often under the guise of being utopian. Dystopian literature has underlying cautionary tones, warning society that if we continue to live how we do, this will be the consequence. A dystopia is, thus, regarded as a sort of negative utopia and is often characterized by an authoritarian or totalitarian form of government. Dystopias usually feature different kinds of repressive social control systems, a lack or total absence of individual freedoms and expressions and constant states of warfare or violence. Dystopias often explore the concept of technology going "too far" and how humans individually and en masse use technology. A dystopian society is also often characterized by mass poverty for most of its inhabitants and a large military-like police force.

That's the definition of Dystopian taken from Wikipedia. In The Road there was no society whatsoever. It was a post-apocalyptic novel, it didn't deal with a dystopian society, as there was no society to speak of.

Or you could just look at the actual word "dystopia", which The Road fills in spades. Besides, even Wikipedia uses the all-important word "often" in the description, meaning that other uses of the word are possible. It's the same as qualifying sci-fi as "often being in the future" because it doesn't usually take place in modern times but that doesn't mean that it CAN'T take place in modern day.

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/dystopia




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rocketpig on 15 September 2010
sapphi_snake said:
rocketpig said:
sapphi_snake said:
rocketpig said:

The first movie wasn't a monstrous blockbuster like the second was and it flew under the radar somewhat... and, unfortunately, even "critics" can get wrapped up in visual whiz-bangery, which they did with T2 (I distinctly remember almost every article about the movie being nearly orgasmic over ILM's "liquid metal" effects).

The Romanian film 4 Months, 3 Weeks and 2 Days wasn't a monstrous blockbuster either, yet it recieved monstrous critical acclaim. The fact that The Terminator wasn't as big of a blockbuster as T2 doesn't exccuse the fact that critics liked it less.

So you're bringing up a foreign film made three years ago to prove a point about The Terminator? I don't know how old you are but in the days before the Interwebz, movie criticism was vastly different. Most people received their information from few sources, such as Siskel & Ebert or their local newspaper. Middling action films without a media blitz behind them (such as The Terminator) often received no consideration for anything at all while T2 was a monster largely due to its breakthrough special effects and budget, not the actual quality of the film.

Your opinion! Not a fact!

...

What about the rest of the paragraph?




Or check out my new webcomic: http://selfcentent.com/

sapphi_snake on 15 September 2010
rocketpig said:
sapphi_snake said:
rocketpig said:
sapphi_snake said:
Reasonable said:


I know.  But big names like Asimov, etc. saw it this way and I do think that it's the right (if rarely used) definition.  I tend to dislike genres in general, but if we're gonna have them I want nice clean lines where possible.

For me, if the film isn't directly examining us in a technology or real science manner with regard to ourselves or society then it's not SF.  It's borrowing trappings from SF, it's using SF as a nice setting or selling point, but it's not SF.

Rather oddly (for me) it's one rare place I do find myself taking the elitist stance that only around 10% of what's called SF really is SF.

Your opinion, but that doesn't change the fact that what you don't deem sci fi is widely considered to be a subgenre of sci fi. Heeck I for one was shocked to find out that The Road by Cormack McCarthy is widely considered to be a dystopian novel, yet that's the case I guess.

How wouldn't The Road be considered a dystopian novel? Hell, things don't get much bleaker than that situation short of just having the entire world blow up and everyone die at the end.

A dystopia (from Ancient Greek: δυσ-: bad-, ill- and Ancient Greek: τÏŒπος: place, landscape) (alternatively, cacotopia,[1] or anti-utopia) is, in literature, an often futuristic society that has degraded into a repressive and controlled state, often under the guise of being utopian. Dystopian literature has underlying cautionary tones, warning society that if we continue to live how we do, this will be the consequence. A dystopia is, thus, regarded as a sort of negative utopia and is often characterized by an authoritarian or totalitarian form of government. Dystopias usually feature different kinds of repressive social control systems, a lack or total absence of individual freedoms and expressions and constant states of warfare or violence. Dystopias often explore the concept of technology going "too far" and how humans individually and en masse use technology. A dystopian society is also often characterized by mass poverty for most of its inhabitants and a large military-like police force.

That's the definition of Dystopian taken from Wikipedia. In The Road there was no society whatsoever. It was a post-apocalyptic novel, it didn't deal with a dystopian society, as there was no society to speak of.

Or you could just look at the actual word "dystopia", which The Road fills in spades.

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/dystopia

I guess my definition of dystopia was wrong. Damn you wikipedia!!!



"I don't understand how someone could like Tolstoy and Dostoyevsky, but not like Twilight!!!"

"Last book I read was Brokeback Mountain, I just don't have the patience for them unless it's softcore porn."

                                                                               (The Voice of a Generation and Seece)

"If you cant stand the sound of your own voice than dont become a singer !!!!!"

                                                                               (pizzahut451)

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rocketpig on 15 September 2010

Not necessarily. Wiki goes into detail over what is "usually" a dystopian future but the way it's worded leaves it open to other interpretations. Overall, that description is just rather poorly worded.




Or check out my new webcomic: http://selfcentent.com/

sapphi_snake on 15 September 2010
rocketpig said:
sapphi_snake said:
rocketpig said:
sapphi_snake said:
rocketpig said:

The first movie wasn't a monstrous blockbuster like the second was and it flew under the radar somewhat... and, unfortunately, even "critics" can get wrapped up in visual whiz-bangery, which they did with T2 (I distinctly remember almost every article about the movie being nearly orgasmic over ILM's "liquid metal" effects).

The Romanian film 4 Months, 3 Weeks and 2 Days wasn't a monstrous blockbuster either, yet it recieved monstrous critical acclaim. The fact that The Terminator wasn't as big of a blockbuster as T2 doesn't exccuse the fact that critics liked it less.

So you're bringing up a foreign film made three years ago to prove a point about The Terminator? I don't know how old you are but in the days before the Interwebz, movie criticism was vastly different. Most people received their information from few sources, such as Siskel & Ebert or their local newspaper. Middling action films without a media blitz behind them (such as The Terminator) often received no consideration for anything at all while T2 was a monster largely due to its breakthrough special effects and budget, not the actual quality of the film.

Your opinion! Not a fact!

...

What about the rest of the paragraph?

Doesn't really prove anything, as it's just an assumption on your part that the fact that T2 was more critically acclaimed than The Terminator is due to those facts you stated (and you can't really prove otherwise, so the reviews still stand).



"I don't understand how someone could like Tolstoy and Dostoyevsky, but not like Twilight!!!"

"Last book I read was Brokeback Mountain, I just don't have the patience for them unless it's softcore porn."

                                                                               (The Voice of a Generation and Seece)

"If you cant stand the sound of your own voice than dont become a singer !!!!!"

                                                                               (pizzahut451)

rocketpig on 15 September 2010

For kicks, I was browsing through reviews to see how each movie fared. I didn't find one movie really blowing the other out of the water, though it's hard to find pre-1995 reviews on the modern interwebz.




Or check out my new webcomic: http://selfcentent.com/

_mevildan on 15 September 2010

Well I agree with number one. The rest... in places.



sapphi_snake on 15 September 2010
rocketpig said:

For kicks, I was browsing through reviews to see how each movie fared. I didn't find one movie really blowing the other out of the water, though it's hard to find pre-1995 reviews on the modern interwebz.

The Terminator: http://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/terminator/

T2: http://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/terminator_2_judgment_day/

This is about as best as you can find.

Lolz, can't beleive T1 actually got slightly better reviews that T2 (still doesn't change the fact that I liked 2 more than 1 though). What's funny is that both these movies got better reviews than a lot of Best Picture Oscar winners.

Gladiator (Best Picture Oscar winner of 2000): http://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/gladiator/

A Beautiful Mind (Best Pic inner 2001): http://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/beautiful_mind/

Chicago (Best pic winner 2002): http://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/chicago/

Crash (Best Pic winner 2005): http://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/1144992-crash/



"I don't understand how someone could like Tolstoy and Dostoyevsky, but not like Twilight!!!"

"Last book I read was Brokeback Mountain, I just don't have the patience for them unless it's softcore porn."

                                                                               (The Voice of a Generation and Seece)

"If you cant stand the sound of your own voice than dont become a singer !!!!!"

                                                                               (pizzahut451)