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Forums - General - Are Christians and North American's cowards?

zuvuyeay on 12 September 2010
KillerMan said:
pizzahut451 said:
KillerMan said:
Kantor said:
KillerMan said:
TheRealMafoo said:
Kantor said:

The majority of the Islamic world is war-torn and impoverished. The people you see burning Bibles and American flags are ignorant fools who have been brainwashed by terrorist groups into hating everything not expressly approved by their twisted version of the Qur'an. Is the West responsible for that? No. Is Islam responsible for that? Not really, no. Only circumstance is responsible for that.

I can sit comfortably in a warm room in a nice chair and post this without any fear for my life. I don't need to take things out on Islam. Someone sitting in Iraq or Afghanistan probably won't have a warm room or a nice chair, and if they're brought up from birth to believe that that is the fault of America rather than a succession of oppressive terrorist regimes, what do you expect them to think?

You imply that terrorist kill out of jealousy. They don't. They kill for god. They don't kill because you have something they don't. They kill because you have something god says is wrong.

It would be much harder to twist other religions into that way of thinking, then it is Islam.

Christians were doing the same thing just couple of hundred years ago.

But they don't now. Christianity has grown up. Islam seriously needs to grow up.

Which isn't to say, of course, that all Muslims are extremists. Just a hell of a lot more Muslims than Christians.

And to clarify, I have no high opinion of Christianity, either.


I absolutely agree. It's just wrong to say that as religion islam is somehow more violent than christianity. Past proves this wrong. It was basically Industrial revolution that started to change christianity more tolerant. Islam world needs the same change.


it really isn't. Christians stopped killing more non christians 200 years ago, and some muslims are still doing it today.

They did stop but before that they killed more non christians than muslims have killed non muslims so far trough the history. You have to remember that if we look history and go to dark ages it was islam that was more tolerant religion. You could live as christian in muslim land if you just pay you taxes. They also had higher education (first universities were in muslim lands) and higher health care in islam world. Jesus is also prophet in islam so they didn't really mind christians before christians started these crusades... Kill muslim and you get place in heaven. Very tolerant indeed....


why are you so one onesided,

islam practically wiped out all the churches,monastaries,coptic christians in eithiopia,,egypt,middle east etc

christians were around there way before islam



                                                                                                                                        Above & Beyond

   

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Wagram on 12 September 2010

I'm North American, i'm not christian, and i'm not patriotic. What group do I fall in? :/ lol



sapphi_snake on 12 September 2010
Smidlee said:
Badassbab said:

pizzahut451-

Google any empire and massacres have been committed by all of them. Don't forget European empires justified colonising the rest of the world by bringing 'Christianity' to the 'uncivilised heathens'. It also made it easier to kill them when they were degraded to mere beasts. And what do you expect Muslims to do when a Crusader army comes along? Welcome them with open arms? All 3 of the Abrahamic faiths are as violent as each other whether now or throughout history.

And I quote Richard Dawkins:-

"The God of the Old Testament is arguably the most unpleasant character in all fiction: jealous and proud of it; a petty, unjust, unforgiving control-freak; a vindictive, bloodthirsty ethnic cleanser; a misogynistic, homophobic, racist, infanticidal, genocidal, filicidal, pestilential, megalomaniacal, sadomasochistic, capriciously malevolent bully."

You can say Christians / churches fought against the Germans in WW2 yet if you look at the individuals who fought most were not necessary  Christians. Thus the church may have influenece but it's the governments that actually lead the war against Hitler. This is even true with the Crusades , they were more politicial then religious.

 There is a time of peace and there is a time for war. Sometimes the violent act is the best act to follow. When it came to Allies vs Axis during WW2 both sides were extremely violent but I think everyone would agree Hitler had to be stopped no matter the cost. France found out the hard way  It was wrong to try to make peace with Hitler.

Another example cutting someone arm off is an extremely violent act yet doctors sometimes perform this very act to save someone life.

The Pope himself encouraged beleivers to join the Crusades. What more proof do you need?



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whatever on 12 September 2010
Slimebeast said:
pizzahut451 said:
Slimebeast said:
whatever said:

You apparently have not read the bible.

http://www.evilbible.com/

All that violence under the Old Covenant between God and the Jews doesnt apply to Christians who's relationship with God is based on the New Covenant which God established by sending Jesus Christ to die for all of mankind.

 


Not to mention that that entire retarded piece of shit web site is incredibly biased, hateful and it misunderstood Bible  by a lot. 

Yeah it's a joke. It's hard to take anyone who refers to that site seriously.

LMAO.  It's hard to take anyone seriously that believes in fairy tales like the bible.



whatever on 12 September 2010
pizzahut451 said:
Slimebeast said:
whatever said:
Slimebeast said:
KillerMan said:


I absolutely agree. It's just wrong to say that as religion islam is somehow more violent than christianity. Past proves this wrong. It was basically Industrial revolution that started to change christianity more tolerant. Islam world needs the same change.

Stop.

It's highly ignorant to say that Christianity as a religion is as violent as Islam. Can you show us some Christian theology that promotes violence?

You apparently have not read the bible.

http://www.evilbible.com/

All that violence under the Old Covenant between God and the Jews doesnt apply to Christians who's relationship with God is based on the New Covenant which God established by sending Jesus Christ to die for all of mankind.

 


Not to mention that that entire retarded piece of shit web site is incredibly biased, hateful and it misunderstood Bible  by a lot. 

The website simply quotes passages from the bible.  If that is disturbing to you, then that's a problem between you and your precious bible.



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whatever on 12 September 2010
TheRealMafoo said:
whatever said:

 Any religion can be used for evil purposes.  They all have at one time or another.  To say one is better or worse than the other is extremely naive.


I would find it hard to make up two religions, and make them the same. One will be better then the other.


Who said they had to be the same?  The point was that any means of controlling large numbers of people is very easily misused by individuals put in a position of power over these people.  It has happened in every religion throughout history.



whatever on 12 September 2010
Slimebeast said:
whatever said:
Slimebeast said:
KillerMan said:


I absolutely agree. It's just wrong to say that as religion islam is somehow more violent than christianity. Past proves this wrong. It was basically Industrial revolution that started to change christianity more tolerant. Islam world needs the same change.

Stop.

It's highly ignorant to say that Christianity as a religion is as violent as Islam. Can you show us some Christian theology that promotes violence?

You apparently have not read the bible.

http://www.evilbible.com/

All that violence under the Old Covenant between God and the Jews doesnt apply to Christians who's relationship with God is based on the New Covenant which God established by sending Jesus Christ to die for all of mankind.

 

You really don't know your own religion.



TheRealMafoo on 12 September 2010
whatever said:
TheRealMafoo said:
whatever said:

 Any religion can be used for evil purposes.  They all have at one time or another.  To say one is better or worse than the other is extremely naive.


I would find it hard to make up two religions, and make them the same. One will be better then the other.


Who said they had to be the same?  The point was that any means of controlling large numbers of people is very easily misused by individuals put in a position of power over these people.  It has happened in every religion throughout history.

Right. What makes Islam worse then Christianity in this case, is how hard it is to make someone die for it.

For Christianity, you need to warp what the bible says. You need to convince someone that god somehow wants you to kill for him, even though the teaches say otherwise.

For Islam, all you need to do is convince the people that the conditions in the world match what the book says is required to conduct violence. That's a lot easier problem to solve.

The Koran says when conditions are right, to go kill people. The Bible never says that.



Badassbab on 12 September 2010
Smidlee said:
Badassbab said:

pizzahut451-

Google any empire and massacres have been committed by all of them. Don't forget European empires justified colonising the rest of the world by bringing 'Christianity' to the 'uncivilised heathens'. It also made it easier to kill them when they were degraded to mere beasts. And what do you expect Muslims to do when a Crusader army comes along? Welcome them with open arms? All 3 of the Abrahamic faiths are as violent as each other whether now or throughout history.

And I quote Richard Dawkins:-

"The God of the Old Testament is arguably the most unpleasant character in all fiction: jealous and proud of it; a petty, unjust, unforgiving control-freak; a vindictive, bloodthirsty ethnic cleanser; a misogynistic, homophobic, racist, infanticidal, genocidal, filicidal, pestilential, megalomaniacal, sadomasochistic, capriciously malevolent bully."

You can say Christians / churches fought against the Germans in WW2 yet if you look at the individuals who fought most were not necessary  Christians. Thus the church may have influenece but it's the governments that actually lead the war against Hitler. This is even true with the Crusades , they were more politicial then religious.

 There is a time of peace and there is a time for war. Sometimes the violent act is the best act to follow. When it came to Allies vs Axis during WW2 both sides were extremely violent but I think everyone would agree Hitler had to be stopped no matter the cost. France found out the hard way  It was wrong to try to make peace with Hitler.

Another example cutting someone arm off is an extremely violent act yet doctors sometimes perform this very act to save someone life.

I don't understand what your post has to do with my post? Is there meant to be any or are you just making a random comment? The European theatre of WWII were not a religious war or if you do want to see it from a religious point of view than surely it would be Christian on Christian. The Crusades however you may want to dress it were religious wars. Why would it be political?






whatever on 12 September 2010
TheRealMafoo said:
whatever said:
TheRealMafoo said:
whatever said:

 Any religion can be used for evil purposes.  They all have at one time or another.  To say one is better or worse than the other is extremely naive.


I would find it hard to make up two religions, and make them the same. One will be better then the other.


Who said they had to be the same?  The point was that any means of controlling large numbers of people is very easily misused by individuals put in a position of power over these people.  It has happened in every religion throughout history.

Right. What makes Islam worse then Christianity in this case, is how hard it is to make someone die for it.

For Christianity, you need to warp what the bible says. You need to convince someone that god somehow wants you to kill for him, even though the teaches say otherwise.

For Islam, all you need to do is convince the people that the conditions in the world match what the book says is required to conduct violence. That's a lot easier problem to solve.

The Koran says when conditions are right, to go kill people. The Bible never says that.

Go read it, it most certainly does say that when conditions are right, go kill people.