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Forums - Sony - Sony Explains why it passed on NATAL TECH

Severance on 29 March 2010
Squilliam said:
C_Hollomon said:
Squilliam said:
thismeintiel said:

Seriously, as others have said, where's the trash talk at all in these statments?  The guy actually said he loved the 3-D camera tech, just that it didn't add much to what they were already doing and didn't allow them to do some things they were looking into.  So where's the trash talk?

Sony has no credibility to talk about competitor products. All they have ever done is trash talk the competition.


All companies trash talk each other.  Why you getting mad at Sony when they all do it? 

No they don't. You don't see Nintendo taking stabs at the userbase of the PS3 or say that PS3s are going into the closet. Sony has deservedly the worst reputation for talking smack about the competion but I wouldn't take offense if you disregarded anything Alan Greenburg said about Move because hes obviously biased and he too has a poor reputation as an individual. Sony has absolutely no credibility when talking about competitor products, none. They burnt it with all their stupid offhanded comments over the past couple of years.

do you only read what Sony says and ignore everything else?

boy you must be the biggest fanboy



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Severance on 29 March 2010
realill said:
Severance said:
realill said:

From what I have seen in videos Natal got much more lag then 3DV ZCam.

Link please? what videos?

ZCam http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6hDKaMvAFzA

Natal http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QGvYFAYqRRw

i don't see anything wrong with that?



I live for the burn...and the sting of pleasure...
I live for the sword, the steel, and the gun...

- Wasteland - The Mission.

Zlejedi on 29 March 2010
binary solo said:
Interesting that Sony and Ninty only looked at it for the gaming potential, it seems, whereas MS saw its potential in much more than gaming. So was willing to invest in the tech because of the possibility of an application well beyond the gaming console. It helps that it's got a virtual monopoly on PS OSs to it is an easy thing to put Natal drivers into PCs and get all sorts of potential that way.

 

How many personal computer operating systems do you know that are developed by Sony or Nintendo ?

If we consider operating system as most important market for Natal as Microsoft probably does then it makes sense to develop it instead of technologies better suited for gaming.

 



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binary solo on 29 March 2010
Zlejedi said:
binary solo said:
Interesting that Sony and Ninty only looked at it for the gaming potential, it seems, whereas MS saw its potential in much more than gaming. So was willing to invest in the tech because of the possibility of an application well beyond the gaming console. It helps that it's got a virtual monopoly on PS OSs to it is an easy thing to put Natal drivers into PCs and get all sorts of potential that way.

 

How many personal computer operating systems do you know that are developed by Sony or Nintendo ?

If we consider operating system as most important market for Natal as Microsoft probably does then it makes sense to develop it instead of technologies better suited for gaming.

 

Just noticed a typo. Freudian slip perhaps. I should have written "PC OSs".

In response: Ninty and Sony don't make any computer OSs it's true. However that doesn't have to stop them making peripheral devices for PCs. Ninty being solely about gaming is the least likely to want to develop potential outside of gaming. Given Sony make laptops they are already in the computer hardware business, so it wouldn't be too much of a leap for them to get into computer peripherals.

Of course MS also make (or at least licence their name to) PC peripheral devices such as mouses (mice?), keyboards, headphones, webcams etc. So adding a suped up webcam to their list of peripherals is a pretty natural progression for them.



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Cueil on 29 March 2010
realill said:
Cueil said:
except Natal isn't based on 3DV technology

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Project_Natal

Project Natal is likely based on software technology developed internally by Microsoft and 3D camera technology by Israeli developer Prime Sense, which interprets 3D scene information from a continuous infrared pattern.[15][16] It was initially reported that the hardware was acquired from time-of-flight camera developer 3DV Systems.[17][8][18][19][20][21] However, this was dismissed by comments from Alex Kipman, Natal's lead developer, who stated "Our IR does not pulse and it is not based on a TOF system."[22]

debunked on the effing day of the announcement... amazing how retarded some people are... even the guy in charge who named it said it wasn't... I can pull up more links if you want

 

Microsoft's Shane Kim has said that the systems making up Project Natal have been in development "for a long time", and distanced the full-body motion-sensing camera from the company's acquisition of 3DV Systems.

Following the announcement at the platform holder's E3 conference on Monday, many assumed that Natal's technology and 3DV's (seen in late 2007 prior to the company's acquisition) were one and the same, but Kim told VentureBeat, "At Microsoft Research, we have had a lot of working going on for a long time."

His colleague Aaron Greenberg was even more direct. Asked whether Natal was derived from 3DV technology, he told Eurogamer: "No, we built this in house."

"None of those rumours did justice to what we were actually doing with Project Natal. People expected a controller you put in your hands," Kim said to VentureBeat. "We have done a lot of work in natural user interfaces. Voice recognition is one of them. That's why we have been able to deliver development kits for it this week."

Microsoft hasn't gone it completely alone though, as Kim admitted "it's a combination of partners and our own software", and some have theorised that acquisitions like 3DV's were designed to insure the company against similar patents. "You have to be very aware," Kim said. "We want to ensure that we have great intellectual property protection. You have to have a strong legal approach, and this is not easy stuff. It has to be all buttoned up, legally. We have had a very concerted focus on this."

Elsewhere in the interview, Kim implied that Natal was as good as a new console anyway. "We firmly believe that the Xbox 360 has a life cycle through 2015," he said when asked about future plans for Xbox

 

source: http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/e3-natal-not-derived-from-3dv



 
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Zlejedi on 29 March 2010

Nintendo makes anything that works on pc ? I must say i never ever seen pc using any kind of Nintendo made peripheral and I'm in pc gaming for over 12 years ;)

Sony "makes" optical drives and if we count them here also headphones i don't think they are major producer of anything else pc related. And of cource they make laptops.

But neither of them has potential to change the way Windows operates. If it was done by Sony it would be only a gimmick additional controller with no chance to ever hit mainstream.
If it's supported by Microsoft then they have means to make it a viable alternative to mouse input and a standard solution for future (for example Natal could be awesome for media PC to browse through movies you have on HDD and operate them from a far)



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Cueil on 29 March 2010
Zlejedi said:
Nintendo makes anything that works on pc ? I must say i never ever seen pc using any kind of Nintendo made peripheral and I'm in pc gaming for over 12 years ;)

Sony "makes" optical drives and if we count them here also headphones i don't think they are major producer of anything else pc related. And of cource they make laptops.

But neither of them has potential to change the way Windows operates. If it was done by Sony it would be only a gimmick additional controller with no chance to ever hit mainstream.
If it's supported by Microsoft then they have means to make it a viable alternative to mouse input and a standard solution for future (for example Natal could be awesome for media PC to browse through movies you have on HDD and operate them from a far)


sony makes: PC Games : Example Everquest series

... computers... laptops... laptop batteries *chuckles*.... they also make various different software... video editing... audio editing... sony's pretty fucking huge... they have their fingers in a lot of honey pots



 
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realill on 29 March 2010
Cueil said:
realill said:
Cueil said:
except Natal isn't based on 3DV technology

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Project_Natal

Project Natal is likely based on software technology developed internally by Microsoft and 3D camera technology by Israeli developer Prime Sense, which interprets 3D scene information from a continuous infrared pattern.[15][16] It was initially reported that the hardware was acquired from time-of-flight camera developer 3DV Systems.[17][8][18][19][20][21] However, this was dismissed by comments from Alex Kipman, Natal's lead developer, who stated "Our IR does not pulse and it is not based on a TOF system."[22]

debunked on the effing day of the announcement... amazing how retarded some people are... even the guy in charge who named it said it wasn't... I can pull up more links if you want

 

Microsoft's Shane Kim has said that the systems making up Project Natal have been in development "for a long time", and distanced the full-body motion-sensing camera from the company's acquisition of 3DV Systems.

Following the announcement at the platform holder's E3 conference on Monday, many assumed that Natal's technology and 3DV's (seen in late 2007 prior to the company's acquisition) were one and the same, but Kim told VentureBeat, "At Microsoft Research, we have had a lot of working going on for a long time."

His colleague Aaron Greenberg was even more direct. Asked whether Natal was derived from 3DV technology, he told Eurogamer: "No, we built this in house."

"None of those rumours did justice to what we were actually doing with Project Natal. People expected a controller you put in your hands," Kim said to VentureBeat. "We have done a lot of work in natural user interfaces. Voice recognition is one of them. That's why we have been able to deliver development kits for it this week."

Microsoft hasn't gone it completely alone though, as Kim admitted "it's a combination of partners and our own software", and some have theorised that acquisitions like 3DV's were designed to insure the company against similar patents. "You have to be very aware," Kim said. "We want to ensure that we have great intellectual property protection. You have to have a strong legal approach, and this is not easy stuff. It has to be all buttoned up, legally. We have had a very concerted focus on this."

Elsewhere in the interview, Kim implied that Natal was as good as a new console anyway. "We firmly believe that the Xbox 360 has a life cycle through 2015," he said when asked about future plans for Xbox

 

source: http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/e3-natal-not-derived-from-3dv

Our links says the same thing.

 

I suspect they are planning to use ZCam technology for Natal 2.



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Galaki on 29 March 2010
Cueil said:
realill said:
Cueil said:
except Natal isn't based on 3DV technology

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Project_Natal

Project Natal is likely based on software technology developed internally by Microsoft and 3D camera technology by Israeli developer Prime Sense, which interprets 3D scene information from a continuous infrared pattern.[15][16] It was initially reported that the hardware was acquired from time-of-flight camera developer 3DV Systems.[17][8][18][19][20][21] However, this was dismissed by comments from Alex Kipman, Natal's lead developer, who stated "Our IR does not pulse and it is not based on a TOF system."[22]

debunked on the effing day of the announcement... amazing how retarded some people are... even the guy in charge who named it said it wasn't... I can pull up more links if you want

 

Microsoft's Shane Kim has said that the systems making up Project Natal have been in development "for a long time", and distanced the full-body motion-sensing camera from the company's acquisition of 3DV Systems.

Following the announcement at the platform holder's E3 conference on Monday, many assumed that Natal's technology and 3DV's (seen in late 2007 prior to the company's acquisition) were one and the same, but Kim told VentureBeat, "At Microsoft Research, we have had a lot of working going on for a long time."

His colleague Aaron Greenberg was even more direct. Asked whether Natal was derived from 3DV technology, he told Eurogamer: "No, we built this in house."

"None of those rumours did justice to what we were actually doing with Project Natal. People expected a controller you put in your hands," Kim said to VentureBeat. "We have done a lot of work in natural user interfaces. Voice recognition is one of them. That's why we have been able to deliver development kits for it this week."

Microsoft hasn't gone it completely alone though, as Kim admitted "it's a combination of partners and our own software", and some have theorised that acquisitions like 3DV's were designed to insure the company against similar patents. "You have to be very aware," Kim said. "We want to ensure that we have great intellectual property protection. You have to have a strong legal approach, and this is not easy stuff. It has to be all buttoned up, legally. We have had a very concerted focus on this."

Elsewhere in the interview, Kim implied that Natal was as good as a new console anyway. "We firmly believe that the Xbox 360 has a life cycle through 2015," he said when asked about future plans for Xbox

 

source: http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/e3-natal-not-derived-from-3dv

people will still use the false info regardless since it supports their argument and then call you trolling.



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d21lewis on 29 March 2010

Good to know, Sony. Thanks!

-but Nintendo had reasons why they passed on disc based technology and Sony had reasons why they passed on 7th gen rumble technology........I'm just playing Devil's Advocate, here.