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Forums - Gaming - "Sony copies, we innovate." - Nintendo

vaio on 13 March 2010
room414 said:
vaio said:
RolStoppable said:
room414 said:

@rolstoppable

First off, don't put words in my mouth. Nowhere did i say the sony's flight controller was pretty much the same as the nintendo 64 controller, only that it had dual analog sticks thus providing inspiration for sony's handheld controller.

Did you miss this part: First, it wasn't actually analog. Analog joysticks like the 5200's had too many moving parts and were prone to breaking. Nintendo's stick was digital, but provided enough levels of sensitivity that the distinction was moot. 

So nintendo obviously followed suit by making their subsequesnt controllers with analog sticks on them.

Looks just like a thumbstick to me.

Fine, the Vectrex had indeed an analog thumbstick. However, it didn't make it past the status of a gimmick and it didn't add anything substantial to gameplay. It's not surprising in the least that the Nintendo 64 controller had a much bigger impact on the industry. It's important to note that video games are more than just hardware and without the correct software, technology becomes meaningless.

Regarding the missed part: No, I didn't miss it. In the same sentence the article states that the distinction is moot which to me means negligible, not worth mentioning.

No rol it couldnt be used as a thumbstick and was never marketed (not even ment as one if the designers werent complete morons) as one you could not reach button 1 (and had troube to reach 2) if you used it as a thumb stick.You played with this as a stationary controller thats how it was ment to play and was marketed the same way you played in the arcade halls.

It was the best joystick out there at the time and it deserves credit for it not for being a thumbstick it never was. It was the best joystick closly followed by the tac3 wich would have been the best if it werent for the fact they broke easy as hell.

I forgot about the colecovision as well which also used a thumbstick. And don't even try and bullshit me by trying to say it wasn't a thumbstick cause this one i actually played on.

Ive played that one too and I seriously doubt you played it because if you did you would know its a 4 directional joystick witch you held in your left hand (or right) and controlled it with your right hand (or left) with they grey buttons on the side that you needed to use for all games but frogger you couldnt use that either as a thumbstick.

You are so beyond pathetic with your scourinng the internet to discredit Nintendo.

I can save you some time there were a few other gamecosoles that were from Taiwan wich you could use with your thumb but none of them were thumbsticks.

Also noone said Nintendo invented the thumbstick the innovated it there is a big difference.

I dont know who actually invented it, it could have been Nintendo but i dont know the point is they get credit for inovating it in the way that everyone is using it today.

Thanks for proving your are trolling Nintendo in any way you can just to prove your point and take away credit from them.

You even go as far as trying to change the legacy of the awesome Vectrex just to prove your point and now you are blatantly lying that you played this console just to do the same.

Anyone who has played this knows you didnt controll it with your thumbs not even with frogger, sure there may have been someone trying but it was never intended to be usedf that way and you can clearly see it on the design if you havent actually played it wich you obviously havent.



Vaio - "Bury me at Milanello"      R.I.P AC Milan

In the 60's, people took acid to make the world weird.
Now the world is weird  and people take Prozac  to make it normal.

If laughing is the best medicine and marijuana makes you laugh

Is marijuana the best medicine?

"Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind."

“If any creator has not played Mario, then they’re probably not a good creator. That’s something I can say with 100 percent confidence. Mario is, for game creators, the development bible.

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vaio on 13 March 2010
L.C.E.C. said:
room414 said:
L.C.E.C. said:
room414 said:

I forgot about the colecovision as well which also used a thumbstick. And don't even try and bullshit me by trying to say it wasn't a thumbstick cause this one i actually played on.

Are you kidding me? I've read this whole argument and it's rediculous. Are you really going to compare a quasi-directional, completely digital (with no variation in speed or distance of movement) joystick, to a "near-360-degree" analogue thumbstick? REALLY? The two are not even close.

Thumbstick is a thumbstick buddy, it's gotta start somewhere. And if you read the whole thing you would know the 64 thumbstick was digital. I honestly don't know why this is so hard for you nintendo fans. You seem to think everything originated with nintendo.

Um, dude, since you love to quote wikipedia: "An analog stick, sometimes called a thumbstick or control stick, is an input device for a controller (often a game controller) that is used for two-dimensional input. An analog stick is a popular variation of a joystick. It consists of some sort of protrusion from the controller, and the input is based on the position of this protrusion. While a digital joystick relies on single electrical connections for movement (using internal digital electrical contacts for up, down, left and right), an analog stick uses continuous electrical activity running through potentiometers.... Its use is prevalent in 3D games, where more than 8 directions are needed (which is all that was offered on the d-pad). Using a D-pad in a 3D game greatly limits the ability to move. For example, in a 3D platformer like Super Mario 64, using a D-pad would allow Mario to move forward, left, and forward-left, but nothing in between. Some early 3D games like Resident Evil overcame this limitation by assigning the Left and Right directions on the D-pad to spin the character instead of making the character move in that direction. However with the prevalence of analog sticks, the aforementioned limitation of the D-pad no longer became an issue."

I DID see it say that it was technically digital, but face it: No other gaming system before the n64 had a thumbstick that provided more than 8 (even 4, if I recall correctly) directional choices.

BAD ASSUMPTION: I am a Nintendo fan? Nice try bud. I have a 360, Wii, and TWO PS3's. Try again?

Dont even bother replying to him anymore thats not even a thumbstick there its a 4 directional joystick wich you held the base in one hand and controlled the joystick with the other hand by using 2 fingers the thumb and indexfinger (I think its called that). He obviously never played one and saw the video where the guy moves it with his thumb and went its a thumbsti!!!! with out even knowing how it was actually used.

Oh and according to him anyone that wants to credit Nintedo for what they did is obviously a Nintendo fanboy I dont think he will change his mind even if both of us have xboxes.



Vaio - "Bury me at Milanello"      R.I.P AC Milan

In the 60's, people took acid to make the world weird.
Now the world is weird  and people take Prozac  to make it normal.

If laughing is the best medicine and marijuana makes you laugh

Is marijuana the best medicine?

"Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind."

“If any creator has not played Mario, then they’re probably not a good creator. That’s something I can say with 100 percent confidence. Mario is, for game creators, the development bible.

gekkokamen on 13 March 2010

This thread's been nice, but let me finish it for all of you.

Yay, Nintendo innovates!

Let's pretend now -scratch that- the following is the whole truth :


Nintendo created the Analog stick and rumble!

Nintendo created Motion controls!


Yay!


NOW, what did they do with it (in terms of compelling experiences) ???


Nay!



Exactly....



Aion on 13 March 2010

I agree with this quote.



 

   PROUD MEMBER OF THE PLAYSTATION 3 : RPG FAN CLUB

 

bmmb1 on 13 March 2010

While some of the above posters are aware of it, I think someone needs from time to time to add a small reminder to those who at least bother reading the latest comments but not the entire thread - this is a 2006 article. This is a 2006 article. So no, this is not some Nintendo rep's reaction to Move. This is a 2006 article.



Currently Playing: Shin Megami Tensei: Devil Survivor Overclocked, Professor Layton and the Curious Village

Anticipating: Xenoblade, The Last Story, Mario Kart 7, Rayman Origins, Zelda SS, Crush3D, Tales of the Abyss 3DS, MGS:Snake Eater 3DS, RE:Revelations, Time Travellers, Professor Layton vs. Ace Attorney, Luigi's Mansion 2, MH TriG, DQ Monsters, Heroes of Ruin

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WereKitten on 13 March 2010
room414 said:
L.C.E.C. said:

Are you kidding me? I've read this whole argument and it's rediculous. Are you really going to compare a quasi-directional, completely digital (with no variation in speed or distance of movement) joystick, to a "near-360-degree" analogue thumbstick? REALLY? The two are not even close.

Thumbstick is a thumbstick buddy, it's gotta start somewhere. And if you read the whole thing you would know the 64 thumbstick was digital. I honestly don't know why this is so hard for you nintendo fans. You seem to think everything originated with nintendo.

Quite a bit of confusion on this point. A clarification about what "analog" means:

- in electronics, it basically means that you have a signal that can assume any value in a continuous range. Say a tension between 0 and 5V or a resistence between 0 and 500Ohm. This is in opposition to digital signals, where the values are a discrete sets of numbers, say 0,1,2. Because microchips usually work with the binary system, it's most common for digital signals to be expressed by n binary bits, for example a digital 8bit signal can assume all integer values in the 0-255 range.

- in input interfaces, it means that the user can set a value in range that appears continuous, as opposed to a discrete action. Turning a free rotating knob or using a free slider, for example, versus a knob or a slider that move between pre-set ticks, or the pressure of a button, or the turning of a two-way switch.

Now the gotcha is that most "analog" input devices nowadays are actually digital in the way they are implemenrted.

The atari 5200 analog stick, for example, was a truly analogic piece of electronic: it used two resistors for x and y axis and it was up to the console covnerting the analog electric signal into something it could use.

The N64 analog thumbstick was an analog input device, that worked at the electronic level as a digital one. I'm not sure which resolution it had, but for example the Sony analog sticks on the DS2/DS3 are 10bits on each axis, ie when you move it it outputs a number for x displacement and one for y displacement, each in the 0-1023 range. Since the user can't physically distinguish between two positions of his thumb that are 1/thousand of the range apart, it appears continuous to him/her, but is actually digital in implementation.

So let's not muddle the water: the N64 thumbstick was analog where it counts, ie for the user.



"All you need in life is ignorance and confidence; then success is sure." - Mark Twain

"..." - Gordon Freeman

room414 on 13 March 2010
vaio said:
room414 said:
vaio said:
RolStoppable said:
room414 said:

@rolstoppable

First off, don't put words in my mouth. Nowhere did i say the sony's flight controller was pretty much the same as the nintendo 64 controller, only that it had dual analog sticks thus providing inspiration for sony's handheld controller.

Did you miss this part: First, it wasn't actually analog. Analog joysticks like the 5200's had too many moving parts and were prone to breaking. Nintendo's stick was digital, but provided enough levels of sensitivity that the distinction was moot. 

So nintendo obviously followed suit by making their subsequesnt controllers with analog sticks on them.

Looks just like a thumbstick to me.

Fine, the Vectrex had indeed an analog thumbstick. However, it didn't make it past the status of a gimmick and it didn't add anything substantial to gameplay. It's not surprising in the least that the Nintendo 64 controller had a much bigger impact on the industry. It's important to note that video games are more than just hardware and without the correct software, technology becomes meaningless.

Regarding the missed part: No, I didn't miss it. In the same sentence the article states that the distinction is moot which to me means negligible, not worth mentioning.

No rol it couldnt be used as a thumbstick and was never marketed (not even ment as one if the designers werent complete morons) as one you could not reach button 1 (and had troube to reach 2) if you used it as a thumb stick.You played with this as a stationary controller thats how it was ment to play and was marketed the same way you played in the arcade halls.

It was the best joystick out there at the time and it deserves credit for it not for being a thumbstick it never was. It was the best joystick closly followed by the tac3 wich would have been the best if it werent for the fact they broke easy as hell.

I forgot about the colecovision as well which also used a thumbstick. And don't even try and bullshit me by trying to say it wasn't a thumbstick cause this one i actually played on.

Ive played that one too and I seriously doubt you played it because if you did you would know its a 4 directional joystick witch you held in your left hand (or right) and controlled it with your right hand (or left) with they grey buttons on the side that you needed to use for all games but frogger you couldnt use that either as a thumbstick.

You are so beyond pathetic with your scourinng the internet to discredit Nintendo.

I can save you some time there were a few other gamecosoles that were from Taiwan wich you could use with your thumb but none of them were thumbsticks.

Also noone said Nintendo invented the thumbstick the innovated it there is a big difference.

I dont know who actually invented it, it could have been Nintendo but i dont know the point is they get credit for inovating it in the way that everyone is using it today.

Thanks for proving your are trolling Nintendo in any way you can just to prove your point and take away credit from them.

You even go as far as trying to change the legacy of the awesome Vectrex just to prove your point and now you are blatantly lying that you played this console just to do the same.

Anyone who has played this knows you didnt controll it with your thumbs not even with frogger, sure there may have been someone trying but it was never intended to be usedf that way and you can clearly see it on the design if you havent actually played it wich you obviously havent.

I've been around since the days of the magnavox odyssey. You're goddamn right i've played on it.

THE GUY IN THE GODDAMN VIDEO OWNS THE FUCKING THING. HE'S CALLING IT A THUMBSTICK. HELLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLOOOOOOOO

Wow, delusional nintendo fans at their worst. Scouring the internet? Remembering the colecovision and checking on youtube is scouring? And yes there are many nintendo fans who think nintendo invented it. Obviously they didn't.

I already proved you wrong with the vectrex videos. Nobody holds the thing you said...WRONG AGAIN. Once again the guy in the videos owns the thing. I'm gonna go out on a limb and say he's a little more clued in than you are.

Do NOT ever call me a liar again.



                                
vaio on 13 March 2010
room414 said:
vaio said:
room414 said:
vaio said:
RolStoppable said:
room414 said:

@rolstoppable

First off, don't put words in my mouth. Nowhere did i say the sony's flight controller was pretty much the same as the nintendo 64 controller, only that it had dual analog sticks thus providing inspiration for sony's handheld controller.

Did you miss this part: First, it wasn't actually analog. Analog joysticks like the 5200's had too many moving parts and were prone to breaking. Nintendo's stick was digital, but provided enough levels of sensitivity that the distinction was moot. 

So nintendo obviously followed suit by making their subsequesnt controllers with analog sticks on them.

Looks just like a thumbstick to me.

Fine, the Vectrex had indeed an analog thumbstick. However, it didn't make it past the status of a gimmick and it didn't add anything substantial to gameplay. It's not surprising in the least that the Nintendo 64 controller had a much bigger impact on the industry. It's important to note that video games are more than just hardware and without the correct software, technology becomes meaningless.

Regarding the missed part: No, I didn't miss it. In the same sentence the article states that the distinction is moot which to me means negligible, not worth mentioning.

No rol it couldnt be used as a thumbstick and was never marketed (not even ment as one if the designers werent complete morons) as one you could not reach button 1 (and had troube to reach 2) if you used it as a thumb stick.You played with this as a stationary controller thats how it was ment to play and was marketed the same way you played in the arcade halls.

It was the best joystick out there at the time and it deserves credit for it not for being a thumbstick it never was. It was the best joystick closly followed by the tac3 wich would have been the best if it werent for the fact they broke easy as hell.

I forgot about the colecovision as well which also used a thumbstick. And don't even try and bullshit me by trying to say it wasn't a thumbstick cause this one i actually played on.

Ive played that one too and I seriously doubt you played it because if you did you would know its a 4 directional joystick witch you held in your left hand (or right) and controlled it with your right hand (or left) with they grey buttons on the side that you needed to use for all games but frogger you couldnt use that either as a thumbstick.

You are so beyond pathetic with your scourinng the internet to discredit Nintendo.

I can save you some time there were a few other gamecosoles that were from Taiwan wich you could use with your thumb but none of them were thumbsticks.

Also noone said Nintendo invented the thumbstick the innovated it there is a big difference.

I dont know who actually invented it, it could have been Nintendo but i dont know the point is they get credit for inovating it in the way that everyone is using it today.

Thanks for proving your are trolling Nintendo in any way you can just to prove your point and take away credit from them.

You even go as far as trying to change the legacy of the awesome Vectrex just to prove your point and now you are blatantly lying that you played this console just to do the same.

Anyone who has played this knows you didnt controll it with your thumbs not even with frogger, sure there may have been someone trying but it was never intended to be usedf that way and you can clearly see it on the design if you havent actually played it wich you obviously havent.

I've been around since the days of the magnavox odyssey. You're goddamn right i've played on it.

THE GUY IN THE GODDAMN VIDEO OWNS THE FUCKING THING. HE'S CALLING IT A THUMBSTICK. HELLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLOOOOOOOO

Wow, delusional nintendo fans at their worst. Scouring the internet? Remembering the colecovision and checking on youtube is scouring? And yes there are many nintendo fans who think nintendo invented it. Obviously they didn't.

I already proved you wrong with the vectrex videos. Nobody holds the thing you said...WRONG AGAIN. Once again the guy in the videos owns the thing. I'm gonna go out on a limb and say he's a little more clued in than you are.

Do NOT ever call me a liar again.

Then stop lying.

The vextrex is used exacly as i said and so is colecovision and i have actually had one my self long time ago.

How would you be able to use the grey action buttons on the sides of the controller if u used it as a thumbstick? you cant and only someone that never played it would ever try and say so. The guy ownes one but he never said how to hold the controller. Since you need the action buttons on the side (the grey ones) it effectivly makes it impossible to be used as a thumbstick in all games except frogger and pacman (if i remember correcly it had pacman but i could be wrong on that one.)

They guy is using a modern term to an old technology and it is a 4 directional joystick he even says so himself in the video.

If you actually played the thing you would know it couldnt be used as a thumbstick unless you only played frogger wich didnt use the grey action buttons.

I am done with you you are obviously trolling and lying and sinking so low so you would try and change the whole legacy of the vectrex shame on you.

Good bye and good riddence.



Vaio - "Bury me at Milanello"      R.I.P AC Milan

In the 60's, people took acid to make the world weird.
Now the world is weird  and people take Prozac  to make it normal.

If laughing is the best medicine and marijuana makes you laugh

Is marijuana the best medicine?

"Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind."

“If any creator has not played Mario, then they’re probably not a good creator. That’s something I can say with 100 percent confidence. Mario is, for game creators, the development bible.

jneul on 13 March 2010

Nintendo, don't worry Ps Move will be nowhere as successful as the wiimote, you have nothing to fear.



it's the future of handheld

PS VITA = LIFE

The official Vita thread http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/thread.php?id=130023&page=1

vaio on 13 March 2010
jneul said:
Nintendo, don't worry Ps Move will be nowhere as successful as the wiimote, you have nothing to fear.

its not a reaction from nintendo to the PS Move its a 3.5 year old comment from someone that is not with nintendo any more



Vaio - "Bury me at Milanello"      R.I.P AC Milan

In the 60's, people took acid to make the world weird.
Now the world is weird  and people take Prozac  to make it normal.

If laughing is the best medicine and marijuana makes you laugh

Is marijuana the best medicine?

"Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind."

“If any creator has not played Mario, then they’re probably not a good creator. That’s something I can say with 100 percent confidence. Mario is, for game creators, the development bible.