| Machiavellian said: Well lets put it this way, from my experience just telling a child someone loves each other isn't the end of the discussion as you stated. That is only the beginning and from there you have to define exactly what love is. Is it love between 2 friends, a family member like sister and brother or the love between a mom and dad. You made the statement that all you need to say they love each other and that's it, the child is satisfied with the answer and never want the details or the context. |
You are an Adult... Make it the end of a discussion. Children don't get to control or dictate terms to you.
You are delving into slippery slope arguments, which is a logical fallacy, you need to recognize that and recognize that your line of thinking is highly erroneous due to that very fact.
https://www.logicallyfallacious.com/tools/lp/Bo/LogicalFallacies/162/Slippery-Slopehttps://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/slippery-slope
The fact of the matter is... Whenever someone has used me as an example of teaching their children about Homosexuality, they left it as "They love each other". - The kids were satisfied with that answer.
| Machiavellian said: Not sure what you mean. I am stating you cannot leave out context or just leave gaps in the subject hoping the the child will not come back for more answers or for that matter not come back at all but get their info from somewhere else. There is no slippery slope in my argument because I am stating that once you open up a topic you have to be prepared to talk about everything, not just the parts you feel you can handle. Its great that you are a person some parents can come to to open up the subject but are you the person they come back to to fill in the gaps. Do you believe that just saying we love each other the child will not seek context to what that means. At the end of the day, most parents do not have you for context in these talks but instead rely on their own experience and what they either know or think they know or how they feel about the subject. Its a subject that will constantly come back as the child gets more info on the topic. |
If you think that talking about two adults showing love and affection to children is suddenly going to turn into a discussion about how individuals fuck each other.. Then you are probably going about it the wrong way, kids don't need to know details like how I went and had sex with 7 different guys at a gay sauna with my partner last weekend... But telling them I love my partner as I hug him after dealing with casualties at a car accident is all that is needed.
It is literally no different talking to a child about how their mum and dad loves each other, there is no further discussion that delves into questionable aspects like you so eloquently describe, it just doesn't happen... It's baseless fear mongering.
If the parents don't have appropriate experience, information or context like you say... Then that just places a larger emphasis on the need of teaching kids about LGBTQI issues in the curriculum does it not? You said it yourself that parents are failing in this area.
| Machiavellian said: Raising their children in what way because as a parent, you deal with a thousand things you need to do to raise your child. What exactly does that mean. What this does is at this early age is force a conversation on the topic earlier then I believe the LGBT community would want. Instead of teaching a child early about different relationships it brings up the conversation so bias can be introduced at an early age and enforced before the child has a chance to develop their own opinions. The majority of parents would never even have such conversations with their kids and for most they would see nothing wrong or different if they see Dad and Dad or Mom and Mom because there is no bias within a child so young. What this does is now the child will look for context to what is taught in school and they will ask their parents to fill the gap. If you are ok that the happy path will not always be the result then so be it but I do not believe this closes the gap. I believe this opens the door for bias and indoctrination during the very early development stage of a child and will not accomplish the learning you wish for but instead give parents who do not look favorable towards the LGBT community to instill their bias to the child.
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LGBT people are here to stay, they are in the community. Kids are going to see two men holding hands, showing affection and ask questions... Telling a child that it's because those two people love each other isn't the end of the world.
Kids understand the concept of love, apparently than allot of Adults... It's not some dirty, unthinkable topic that should be avoided, LGBT people are part of the real world, they have always existed, will always exist and it's time that some people embraced that very fact and got over it.
As for indoctrination... I think you should be a little more concerned about religion on that front than education on LGBT issues/culture. I mean.. Shit.
| DonFerrari said: Well I would say where we would disagree is that I think school is to teach, family is to educate (and from what you have said in other thread I think, and I may be wrong but perhaps your family failed you on this). So respecting people, LGBT included, is part of family obligation and if a family wants to teach biggotry that unfortunatelly is their right. Because in the end the power you give to the government is the power you lose yourself. In this situation they are doing something that most people would say is the right thing, but they could very well be doing just the opposite (as happened in the past with government persecuting people based on who they were). And one thing that is very hard to do is take away power from the government, so once it grows to a size it almost never reduce back. And sure I agree with you that it will be great when it is a time where we don't need to teach anyone to respect the basic rights of LGBT people, including the right to marry and to be a blood donor if they so wish and won't harm another person (same standard a hetero person would be held) among others. |
I think school is there to teach and educate... Same with family. Children should be taught from all angles in life not just specific avenues.
My family is a basket of cats that I really won't get into...
I guess things are different here government wise where such things aren't an issue.
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