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Is free speech suppressed on the internet's main public squares

Yes 56 53.85%
 
No 44 42.31%
 
Undecided 4 3.85%
 
Total:104
the-pi-guy said:
zero129 said:

1. I honestly feel insulted by this post. Care to explain how millions of people and kids dying from starvation and having to leave their homes etc isnt the same why?.

2. Explain how did me or my kids or anyone else in "Ireland" benefit from slavery or stuff that happened years ago?. Clearly it "Is" from stuff that happened years ago as its clear that stuff isnt going on today and if it is its not a world wide thing and doesnt only include "White" people. I am sorry if i dont feel like saying sorry for something i had no part in. Just like i dont expect everyone who was racist towards my community of people in the traveling/gypsy community to apologize for stuff they didnt do to us.

Go after the places this stuff still exist but dont paint a whole group of people with the same brush as thats just silly.

3.) As mods you should know how it is to generalize a whole group of people based on a few bad eggs.

1.) I'm hoping that you can inform me on your conflating slavery with famine.

Some of my family members came over here because of the Potato famine, but I'm not as familiar with it, as I am with American slavery. And I doubt that you are as familiar with American slavery as you are with the potato famines.

2.) Can I give an example here. I benefit from infrastructure here in the US, most of which is older than I am. The university I went to was 150 years old. That is far older than me, or my parents, or my grandparents, or my great grandparents, and probably my great great parents. I still benefit from decades of infrastructure. I benefited from roads that were built over decades, I benefited from hills that were flattened, the trees that were cut down to be able to put those roads down. I benefited from the materials that were imported, and perhaps even using slave labor for the university and the roads over decades or maybe longer. My primary education was funded by property taxes, which is based off values of houses and properties many of which are hundreds of years old.

I get it, it's abstract, it's distant, it's way before any of us were alive. But we benefit from things, indirectly too. Sometimes even second hand or third hand or 100th hand.

3.)  It's not generalizing a whole group based on a few bad eggs. It is me recognizing that I don't live in a vacuum. As a white male, I get a lot of benefits, and surely some downsides.

1. I am hoping how you can inform me how one bad thing (Black slavery) Makes another less bad (The irish famine) as they where both caused by people in power not the general populous. But that in no way makes one less bad than the other and once again i am insulted by your narrow view point on this subject. If all them Irish was black would it fit what your saying then? As if the colour of skin means anything when bad things happen?.

2. That point means nothing to me as the irish here build our own things. It also means nothing if i lived in america as i should not feel guilty for something that happened years ago. Otherwise how long is this guilt trip going to go on?. and also Africans was not the only slaves in history. If you follow history you would know Africans had slaves themself well before the USA. They had European slaves from the coasts in the pirate raids. Slavery is nothing new it was part of history and imo thats where it should be left as looking back will bring no one forward only make more divide.

3. Thats good for you. If you can let me know when my benefits a due ill be happy but for now i see none. Once again this is painting everyone with the same brush. If you feel guilty for being white thats on you but me i dont as i know we didnt do anything or dont benefit in anyway.

 



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zero129 said:

1. I am hoping how you can inform me how one bad thing (Black slavery) Makes another less bad (The irish famine) as they where both caused by people in power not the general populous. But that in no way makes one less bad than the other and once again i am insulted by your narrow view point on this subject. If all them Irish was black would it fit what your saying then? As if the colour of skin means anything when bad things happen?.

2. That point means nothing to me as the irish here build our own things. It also means nothing if i lived in america as i should not feel guilty for something that happened years ago. Otherwise how long is this guilt trip going to go on?. and also Africans was not the only slaves in history. If you follow history you would know Africans had slaves themself well before the USA. They had European slaves from the coasts in the pirate raids. Slavery is nothing new it was part of history and imo thats where it should be left as looking back will bring no one forward only make more divide.

3. Thats good for you. If you can let me know when my benefits a due ill be happy but for now i see none. Once again this is painting everyone with the same brush. If you feel guilty for being white thats on you but me i dont as i know we didnt do anything or dont benefit in anyway.

 

1.) Firstly I have never said the Irish Famine is less bad. Or anything like that. I just said that they're different. 

For one, the US created a culture to justify slavery. That culture can still be seen today.

2/3.) You do benefit/have benefited as a person who lives in the western hemisphere. 

And I get that it doesn't feel like it.



the-pi-guy said:
zero129 said:

1. I am hoping how you can inform me how one bad thing (Black slavery) Makes another less bad (The irish famine) as they where both caused by people in power not the general populous. But that in no way makes one less bad than the other and once again i am insulted by your narrow view point on this subject. If all them Irish was black would it fit what your saying then? As if the colour of skin means anything when bad things happen?.

2. That point means nothing to me as the irish here build our own things. It also means nothing if i lived in america as i should not feel guilty for something that happened years ago. Otherwise how long is this guilt trip going to go on?. and also Africans was not the only slaves in history. If you follow history you would know Africans had slaves themself well before the USA. They had European slaves from the coasts in the pirate raids. Slavery is nothing new it was part of history and imo thats where it should be left as looking back will bring no one forward only make more divide.

3. Thats good for you. If you can let me know when my benefits a due ill be happy but for now i see none. Once again this is painting everyone with the same brush. If you feel guilty for being white thats on you but me i dont as i know we didnt do anything or dont benefit in anyway.

 

1.) Firstly I have never said the Irish Famine is less bad. Or anything like that. I just said that they're different. 

For one, the US created a culture to justify slavery. That culture can still be seen today.

2/3.) You do benefit/have benefited as a person who lives in the western hemisphere. 

And I get that it doesn't feel like it.

1. You insinuated it so thats as good, why even bring up the difference in the first place as if thats important? slaves? starved both where done by people in power not the general populous and thats whats important here.

2/3. I would love for you to explain to me how i benefit anymore then anyone else living here?. Like i said if you feel like you should feel guilty for stuff you didnt do thats up to you but i dont feel the same way. And also do you really think it was only African people that build them roads you drive/walk on and buildings you go into?. do you really believe that?.

Edit:

And once again i want to point out that this is not me saying that racism doesnt exist today being on the end of it myself only a few months ago i know very well it exists but i am not going to blame a whole group of people for a few bad eggs.

Last edited by zero129 - on 28 November 2022

zero129 said:
Machiavellian said:

Its not about giving anyone a right to do anything, because you cannot give that right or take it away.  A person that holds a grudge for whatever reason will do so because as humans that is what we do.  Whether it's blaming a whole race, or gender or sexual orientation, this is what humans do because we see this example every day.  

So how does that make you feel.  Its one thing to have it done once and a blue moon, its another to deal with it on a daily basics.  The thing is, how do people deal with such situations because everyone is not going to react the same way.  My point is that you seem to only view a situation on how you will react but that's not how it really works because everyone is different and come from different backgrounds and environments.  Everyone usually believes how they react to a situation is the correct response, that is why you can have so many different responses to just about every scenario.

I understand the point you are trying to make but your fix to that problem isn't going to happen anytime soon because the problem you present is nothing new.  Its not like we all woke up today and started to believe that if only we stop being prejudice, discriminatory, angry, fearful etc all the problems would just go away.  What I am saying is that it really does not matter if it's some Celeb or the person down the street.  They are all just human, it being a Celeb means nothing as if that status makes that person any better than the person you meet by chance.  Social media just helps to bring out opinions you would never know someone holds within themselves because now their opinion can reach millions in seconds.  That is why I say go to Gab and you will see such hate on the regular.  The problem is as old as time itself and the solution to that also is as old.  The complexity is how do you implement the solution because for as many people who believe "Stop painting everyone with broad Strokes", there are just as many who are happy to do exactly that.

So my main point is that it seems you are focused that a Celeb has said some hateful stuff but I am saying there are millions saying hateful stuff everyday.  Just because its some Celeb is of little consequence in the light of how many unknown people who view and say such things on a daily basis.  The only difference between a Celeb and your regular Joe is public fallout.

I feel like we have and are still agreeing on the first point. People will always hold grudges but imo that doesnt make them right. The IRA wouldnt be right to go around slandering or bombing english innocent people today over things that happened years ago just like they wasnt right to do that in the first place.

I never said it was only once. Its clear your not from Ireland or England as if you where you would know that over here travelers/Gypsys are every bit if not more prosecuted then any black person or other colour person. Its a Sigma that we are a bunch of free loaders who only want to live off social welfare look for trouble and rob people. That mind frame is embedded into people over here but i dont blame all the people for the racist shit i had to put up with as i still know not everyone thinks like that and i wouldnt blame a whole group for the short comings of a few who dont want to understand any better then they where told.

And its not just one celeb its lots of celebs that have massive platforms that could easy be preaching proper messages of unity and holding the companys who still pay shitty to colourd people etc for account but instead like to say stuff like how "All whites are the devil" "White people are animals" etc etc. As if they in their high privlege levels are the ones who had to deal with it?. I know for a fact if it was a white celeb saying that about any other group than themselfs they would be canceled from every tv show and platform we have. But as long as they only be racist towards white people it seems to be ok.

What I am getting here is that you believe other races who say hateful stuff get a pass while someone white says it and they get canceled.  I see two scenarios that says different.  Kanye West just made some comments and lost billions for it.  Kyrie Irving posted a video and got suspended and lost millions for it.  Hell, I remember Nick Cannon made some crazy comments and got fired from his job over it.  I know plenty of people who have made racial comments and paid the price for those comments but I also have seen many white people make racial comments and are still in power.  It seems you believe that white people are being persecuted but then ignore that their are millions of others who are persecuted on a daily basis.  So for the Celeb you feel is getting away with something who is this person and exactly how are they getting away with it.  



Machiavellian said:
zero129 said:

I feel like we have and are still agreeing on the first point. People will always hold grudges but imo that doesnt make them right. The IRA wouldnt be right to go around slandering or bombing english innocent people today over things that happened years ago just like they wasnt right to do that in the first place.

I never said it was only once. Its clear your not from Ireland or England as if you where you would know that over here travelers/Gypsys are every bit if not more prosecuted then any black person or other colour person. Its a Sigma that we are a bunch of free loaders who only want to live off social welfare look for trouble and rob people. That mind frame is embedded into people over here but i dont blame all the people for the racist shit i had to put up with as i still know not everyone thinks like that and i wouldnt blame a whole group for the short comings of a few who dont want to understand any better then they where told.

And its not just one celeb its lots of celebs that have massive platforms that could easy be preaching proper messages of unity and holding the companys who still pay shitty to colourd people etc for account but instead like to say stuff like how "All whites are the devil" "White people are animals" etc etc. As if they in their high privlege levels are the ones who had to deal with it?. I know for a fact if it was a white celeb saying that about any other group than themselfs they would be canceled from every tv show and platform we have. But as long as they only be racist towards white people it seems to be ok.

What I am getting here is that you believe other races who say hateful stuff get a pass while someone white says it and they get canceled.  I see two scenarios that says different.  Kanye West just made some comments and lost billions for it.  Kyrie Irving posted a video and got suspended and lost millions for it.  Hell, I remember Nick Cannon made some crazy comments and got fired from his job over it.  I know plenty of people who have made racial comments and paid the price for those comments but I also have seen many white people make racial comments and are still in power.  It seems you believe that white people are being persecuted but then ignore that their are millions of others who are persecuted on a daily basis.  So for the Celeb you feel is getting away with something who is this person and exactly how are they getting away with it.  

If you think i feel that way your thinking wrong.

Nick Cannon made comments and got banned from one network but how many more does he work with? Heck they couldnt even use the words he used and had to make it look like he was talking about jewish people when he was clearly on about white people why do that?. Name one white person thats rich and famous in tv and movies or entertainment that has ever said stuff like the "The colour of someones skin" makes them less then us so they turn into beasts or animals and still have any network to talk to.

How many white celebs can go on twitter or whatever and signal virtue to a bunch of people of a colour and still have a platform to do it?.

Anyway i feel like i am being taking off track here my main points i have made already and thats enough for me.

Last edited by zero129 - on 28 November 2022

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Elon Musk has gone full moron.

“Apple has mostly stopped advertising on Twitter. Do they hate free speech in America?” -Elon Musk.
He’s basically saying that companies that don’t advertise on his platform must not do so because they hate free speech. It takes a special kind of entitled stupidity to say something like that.

Musk looks oblivious to the fact that the changes he’s made are what’s at fault: eliminating authenticity of posters which caused advertisers to lose billions of dollars in market cap thanks to fake information; destroying the appeal of the platform by prioritizing the posts of people who give him money and inviting top voices for hate speech to the platform. How on earth can this Elon Musk be so fucking dense that he can’t see that clearly he’s at fault here? Twitter is no longer for free speech, it’s speech that will cost you a subscription fee of 100 Euros per year. A platform that doesn’t work all that well anymore, one that’s more vulnerable than ever to hackers and scammers.

No, people don’t hate free speech just because they don’t want to give Elon Musk money. Is there something about being rich that rots the brain into this level of profound stupidity? Or did he damage his own brain by hooking up his neuralink bullshit to it? He’s like one of those fat stupid French nobles from enlightenment era literature.

Last edited by Jumpin - on 28 November 2022

I describe myself as a little dose of toxic masculinity.

zero129 said:
Machiavellian said:

What I am getting here is that you believe other races who say hateful stuff get a pass while someone white says it and they get canceled.  I see two scenarios that says different.  Kanye West just made some comments and lost billions for it.  Kyrie Irving posted a video and got suspended and lost millions for it.  Hell, I remember Nick Cannon made some crazy comments and got fired from his job over it.  I know plenty of people who have made racial comments and paid the price for those comments but I also have seen many white people make racial comments and are still in power.  It seems you believe that white people are being persecuted but then ignore that their are millions of others who are persecuted on a daily basis.  So for the Celeb you feel is getting away with something who is this person and exactly how are they getting away with it.  

If you think i feel that way your thinking wrong.

Nick Cannon made comments and got banned from one network but how many more does he work with? Heck they couldnt even use the words he used and had to make it look like he was talking about jewish people when he was clearly on about white people why do that?. Name one white person thats rich and famous in tv and movies or entertainment that has ever said stuff like the "The colour of someones skin" makes them less then us so they turn into beasts or animals and still have any network to talk to.

How many white celebs can go on twitter or whatever and signal virtue to a bunch of people of a colour and still have a platform to do it?.

Anyway i feel like i am being taking off track here my main points i have made already and thats enough for me.

Lol, you must be new to the US, there are multiple incidents of white people saying racist crap and still having their careers intact.  I suggest you use google for the complete list, you probably will be very surprised.

Basically, you are making a statement that says White people who own the majority of companies and the wealth within the US are being persecuted because of a few Celebs saying bad things about them when we have had decades of White people saying bad things about other races.  We are not just talking about saying bad things but implementing bad things for decades.  Your view point seems very limited on this particular subject especially when it concerns American history.  American history is steeped in racism, prejudice, discrimination etc.  From the founding of the nation all the way to today's climate.  Hell you have politicians on the GOP side still painting black people with a broad stroke and still getting re-elected.

I would love for you to take a semester of a college black history class just to get a simple understanding.  Did you go to the Gab site, because if you want to get some real good old racism, discrimination and hatred you will get your cup filled fast.  Maybe even read up on the real CRT not the BS the GOP calls CRT to understand the institutions that were put in place to promote discrimination, segregation etc. Ireland is still pretty much a homogeneous society; I believe it would be hard for you to fully understand how very different the US is compared to Ireland.



Jumpin said:

Elon Musk has gone full moron.

“Apple has mostly stopped advertising on Twitter. Do they hate free speech in America?” -Elon Musk.
He’s basically saying that companies that don’t advertise on his platform must not do so because they hate free speech. It takes a special kind of entitled stupidity to say something like that.

Musk looks oblivious to the fact that the changes he’s made are what’s at fault: eliminating authenticity of posters which caused advertisers to lose billions of dollars in market cap thanks to fake information; destroying the appeal of the platform by prioritizing the posts of people who give him money and inviting top voices for hate speech to the platform. How on earth can this Elon Musk be so fucking dense that he can’t see that clearly he’s at fault here? Twitter is no longer for free speech, it’s speech that will cost you a subscription fee of 100 Euros per year. A platform that doesn’t work all that well anymore, one that’s more vulnerable than ever to hackers and scammers.

No, people don’t hate free speech just because they don’t want to give Elon Musk money. Is there something about being rich that rots the brain into this level of profound stupidity? Or did he damage his own brain by hooking up his neuralink bullshit to it? He’s like one of those fat stupid French nobles from enlightenment era literature.

If Musk want to make Twitter like Gab where anything goes, they will definitely lose a lot of people.  People really do not want to view all that hateful crap on a daily basis, if it was true, then Gab would be above Twitter.  Either way, it will be interesting to see how Musk move forward with Twitter.  I rarely use the site but I am mostly interested in how he manages it then anything else.



Pemalite said:
ConservagameR said:

Come up with some better quality content instead of parroting others. They weren't assumptions, they were statements.

Create better content? Is this YouTube or a chat forum? I'm not getting paid.

That is a false equivalency.

Building foundations for equality and equity in every facet of society does not mean that highly intelligent, high achieving individuals are at a disadvantage.

The issue that you don't seem to grasp is that, when someone is LGBTQI or have a different cultural/ethnic background, can be denied equivalent roles or opportunities, even when they have the same level of intellectual fortitude and would hypothetical be capable of the same achievements.

You likely have never been on the receiving end of this, but it actually does happen and still does happen.

Hating white people and being racist towards them because you say they have an advantage is acceptable, but hating higher IQ people and also trying to tear them down due to that advantage isn't acceptable? Should hate towards rich smart people be stopped at all costs?

You mean like the time I didn't get the job because they chose the bosses sons idiot white friend instead? So we should put a stop to some racism but not favoritism? No big deal though right? I'm sure you'll assume I just went back home to my castle and lounged in the Olympic sized pool all day.

Stop trolling.

I wasn't. I made a good joke, and I used another point you made earlier about aspects to strengthen my point. You didn't say anything about lacking content this time though which makes me wonder if you even got the point.

Are you really trying to justify people working and not being paid for it? I think you aren't grasping something here.

I am managing a company, I know how these things actually work... You have what is called a "Probation Period". - Usually a company will hire you as a casual or permanent employee, but for the Probation Period (Usually 3-6 months) you can be fired at the drop of the hat for any number of reasons.

Casual employees can just have their hours cut down to 0 even 12 months down the line, they are casual and don't have guaranteed hours.

If you walk into a company and are employed by the company, even if you are just doing training or a few trial shifts, you are taking someones time... And they need to be paid for it.

Apprenticeships and Internships are also paid here, because it's the right thing to do. - They start off at a lower wage, but as they invest more of their time and their skills improve, their rate of pay increases rather substantially. As it should.

End of the day people need to eat and pay bills, the only way that happens is if you actually pay them for it. Clearly the American way is inferior to the working class.

Some people think the minimum wage isn't enough. Is the minimum wage acceptable? Was it before it was raised? Will it be after it's raised again? What if people are willing to work for that now, knowing they'll be better off later because of it? That's the same concept with unpaid positions, simply with a greater degree of delayed gratification.

If that person happens to be white, they live like a king or queen anyway so what would the oppressive wait for pay even matter?

I doubt Trump was ever actually poor.
I.E. Living on the streets with just the clothes on his back.

Do I dare assume you've never had to deal with that either? Does that put you and Trump in the same camp? 

You are right, Twitter didn't sit down and give those individuals that opportunity and that was clearly a fault of Twitter.

Still, being a hypocrite is not a good thing. - Clearly even yourself can recognize that?

You're right, being hypocritical isn't a good thing, but when powerful people and businesses are doing that to great success and getting away with it while hurting others, then it's fair game for everyone to play that game if they choose to.

It's not like people haven't been trying to do the right thing for a while now. Even Elon tried and was getting nowhere. So he decided to take a leap for mankind by purchasing Twitter and now throwing it back in their faces.

Not everyone learns the easy way. You no doubt must understand that doing what you do.

So basically you only believe polls you agree with?

Conservatives in general agree with polls that look to make sense based on how they were conducted and how the data is presented.

Some did buy into the red wave cool aid which was relatively obvious wasn't going to happen long before the election. When the media who's always against you is agreeing they're about to get crushed by you, it should set off alarms that something ain't right.

You seem to be confused, so I will dumb it down further. What people do, doesn't concern me.

What does concern me is people being marginalized or mistreated, remember I am a first responder, life comes first, I have morals.

What those people do, who you're responding to, certainly does.

Lots of people have morals. Your morals don't outweigh someone else's ability to offer or choose.

If someone chooses to drive irresponsibly and goes off a cliff, were they wrong to do so? Are they immoral? Are you going to save them anyway, knowing full well they vary well may do it or something else irresponsible again later?

If someone wants to offer an unpaid position and someone else willingly chooses to accept it, knowing it'll likely lead to a stable paid position or even just the knowledge and skills that will get them where they want to go eventually, that's unacceptable?



August

ConservagameR said:

I can't help but take Elon + Twitter + Starlink + T-Mobile and see a broader connection.

It was made pretty clear it's only supposed to be for text and calls early on, and maybe some pics.
Other than attached vids, could this be useful for Twitter? If not now, maybe in the future when there's plenty of sats?

November

Elon + Twitter + Starlink + T-Mobile + Tesla Pi Phone?