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Forums - Sales Discussion - Spiderman (PS4) has sold over 20m units

pikashoe said:

I give up, you are completely unwilling to see sense here. 

The new switch is rumoured for early next year, not 2022. It is unlikely that a new MK is coming out soon because MK 9 would likely not reach its full sales potential on switch, 8 and 9 would hurt each other.

First of all I never said AC will sell 50 million. I don't get the logic here, why does AC selling insanely well mean other games will as well. Here's an example, on the Wii MK sold way beyond what any MK had ever sold before, but Zelda sales didn't change and 3d mario didn't see any boost. Just because AC performs well doesn't mean anything for any other game. 30 million sales can't be just attributed to covid boost. If that were the case then all other new releases this year should have sold way more then they have.

Spiderman charted in November because miles morales released not despite. This is common that sequels boost the previous game for a couple of weeks. It happened with TLOU, it happened with new leaf. Typically software sales take a massive hit after a new console releases. Stuff like TLOU 2, GoT and cyberpunk will sell alright for awhile because they are new games.

Launching in 2022 is not "soon." Also, what makes you think MK9 sales would suffer from MK8, a game that released back in 2014 on the WiiU? MK9 can sell 30+ million on the Switch & can be ported to the next Nintendo console. Even the best case scenario for MK8, where it sells another 20 Million, would still be less money for Nintendo than MK9 selling 25+ Million. As for the example of MK Wii, that's not a good one, considering MK DS already pushed the franchise to new heights, and came before the Wii version. 

COVID played a huge role as to why Animal Crossing blew up. Its boost can be seen across the board. For Nintendo, their older titles sold millions in a single quarter & broke tons of hardware records. Sony made about a billion in profit in a single quarter in a non holiday quarter. IIRC even Microsoft saw a lot more engagement in their ecosystem. At one point in time, the PS4/Xbox One were sold out, in a year where their successors are on the way. All of the above happened in non holiday quarters. That certainly isn't typical. 

I won't be able to convince you about SM selling an extra 5+ Million on the PS4, or that 120+ Million users won't completely abandon the PS4 because the PS5 is out, so I will say that time will tell who's right. Though to be quite frank, a lot of Nintendo fans didn't expect Spiderman or God of War to hit 20+ Million, yet alone do it in two years time. 



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PotentHerbs said:
pikashoe said:

I give up, you are completely unwilling to see sense here. 

The new switch is rumoured for early next year, not 2022. It is unlikely that a new MK is coming out soon because MK 9 would likely not reach its full sales potential on switch, 8 and 9 would hurt each other.

First of all I never said AC will sell 50 million. I don't get the logic here, why does AC selling insanely well mean other games will as well. Here's an example, on the Wii MK sold way beyond what any MK had ever sold before, but Zelda sales didn't change and 3d mario didn't see any boost. Just because AC performs well doesn't mean anything for any other game. 30 million sales can't be just attributed to covid boost. If that were the case then all other new releases this year should have sold way more then they have.

Spiderman charted in November because miles morales released not despite. This is common that sequels boost the previous game for a couple of weeks. It happened with TLOU, it happened with new leaf. Typically software sales take a massive hit after a new console releases. Stuff like TLOU 2, GoT and cyberpunk will sell alright for awhile because they are new games.

Launching in 2022 is not "soon." Also, what makes you think MK9 sales would suffer from MK8, a game that released back in 2014 on the WiiU? MK9 can sell 30+ million on the Switch & can be ported to the next Nintendo console. Even the best case scenario for MK8, where it sells another 20 Million, would still be less money for Nintendo than MK9 selling 25+ Million. As for the example of MK Wii, that's not a good one, considering MK DS already pushed the franchise to new heights, and came before the Wii version. 

COVID played a huge role as to why Animal Crossing blew up. Its boost can be seen across the board. For Nintendo, their older titles sold millions in a single quarter & broke tons of hardware records. Sony made about a billion in profit in a single quarter in a non holiday quarter. IIRC even Microsoft saw a lot more engagement in their ecosystem. At one point in time, the PS4/Xbox One were sold out, in a year where their successors are on the way. All of the above happened in non holiday quarters. That certainly isn't typical. 

I won't be able to convince you about SM selling an extra 5+ Million on the PS4, or that 120+ Million users won't completely abandon the PS4 because the PS5 is out, so I will say that time will tell who's right. Though to be quite frank, a lot of Nintendo fans didn't expect Spiderman or God of War to hit 20+ Million, yet alone do it in two years time. 

Nintendo have never released 2 Mario karts on 1 system before. They'll affect each other because they are very similar games that are chasing the same audience. For the majority of people the Wii u didn't exist. So the game really is more of a 2017 release. I'm pretty sure selling 20 million copies of a ported game at full price will make more money than 25 million for a newly developed game. Well MK Wii sold quite a bit more than the ds version. Even so the point stands for both consoles. 

I won't deny that covid helped boost AC at the start. But even so AC sales go way beyond just covid. That game has been a phenomenon that has continued to sell well after the covid effect began to fade. Even before covid people new this game was going to be pretty big. It started gaining a huge social media presence in the lead up to its launch.

To be fair I don't think anyone expected those games to be so popular. Nintendo fans also didn't think BOTW, Mario odyssey, smash, animal crossing, Mario party or MK8D would be as successful as they have been.



pikashoe said:
DonFerrari said:

Sure pika, and I understand that because you agree with him you may not have noticed the tone, personal accusations and the intention to downplay the sales of Sony exclusives. If you read this and other threads you'll see that at most Sony fans have been saying Sony is approaching Nintendo level of sales and this is shoot down with exaggerated comparison and "to reach Nintendo you have to sell this much...." and that quantity keeps changing to the point even most Nintendo titles doesn't qualify.

You really need to stop assuming that everyone who disagrees with you is arguing in bad faith. I agree with some things he says and disagree with others. Even the guy he was talking to I agreed with some things he said. Even you on a rare occasion can say something I agree with. I don t keep an eye on everything he says but he didn't seem to be downplaying Sony sales. If what he says is considering downplaying then a lot of Sony fans in this thread are just as guilty.

I don't know what you consider Nintendo level sales. But for me it means that the ps4s top 10 best selling games needs to be on a similar level to the switches top 10 best selling games. Which at the moment is not the case. You can hold me to that. 

I'll agree that there are some obnoxious Nintendo fans but I find that Sony fans can be equally as bad.

He got banned while dishing personal attacks, so nope I don't think everyone that disagrees with me is in bad faith, in fact I don't think you are in bad faith, but he was in bad faith and wasn't even discussing with me on the topic he was much more discussing with PotentHerb. You may not see the downplaying because for you it is clear Nintendo is far of reach so you don't see the dismissal way he talked of Sony sales that perhaps he wouldn't use if Nintendo comparison wasn't used (and not sure why getting so defensive over someone saying Sony is entering a Nintendo level of sales, which by the time of the original thread discussing it was many games selling 10-15M range, but then to defend Nintendo this goalpost have been moved to 50M).



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."

PotentHerbs said:
pikashoe said:

I give up, you are completely unwilling to see sense here. 

The new switch is rumoured for early next year, not 2022. It is unlikely that a new MK is coming out soon because MK 9 would likely not reach its full sales potential on switch, 8 and 9 would hurt each other.

First of all I never said AC will sell 50 million. I don't get the logic here, why does AC selling insanely well mean other games will as well. Here's an example, on the Wii MK sold way beyond what any MK had ever sold before, but Zelda sales didn't change and 3d mario didn't see any boost. Just because AC performs well doesn't mean anything for any other game. 30 million sales can't be just attributed to covid boost. If that were the case then all other new releases this year should have sold way more then they have.

Spiderman charted in November because miles morales released not despite. This is common that sequels boost the previous game for a couple of weeks. It happened with TLOU, it happened with new leaf. Typically software sales take a massive hit after a new console releases. Stuff like TLOU 2, GoT and cyberpunk will sell alright for awhile because they are new games.

Launching in 2022 is not "soon." Also, what makes you think MK9 sales would suffer from MK8, a game that released back in 2014 on the WiiU? MK9 can sell 30+ million on the Switch & can be ported to the next Nintendo console. Even the best case scenario for MK8, where it sells another 20 Million, would still be less money for Nintendo than MK9 selling 25+ Million. As for the example of MK Wii, that's not a good one, considering MK DS already pushed the franchise to new heights, and came before the Wii version. 

COVID played a huge role as to why Animal Crossing blew up. Its boost can be seen across the board. For Nintendo, their older titles sold millions in a single quarter & broke tons of hardware records. Sony made about a billion in profit in a single quarter in a non holiday quarter. IIRC even Microsoft saw a lot more engagement in their ecosystem. At one point in time, the PS4/Xbox One were sold out, in a year where their successors are on the way. All of the above happened in non holiday quarters. That certainly isn't typical. 

I won't be able to convince you about SM selling an extra 5+ Million on the PS4, or that 120+ Million users won't completely abandon the PS4 because the PS5 is out, so I will say that time will tell who's right. Though to be quite frank, a lot of Nintendo fans didn't expect Spiderman or God of War to hit 20+ Million, yet alone do it in two years time. 

They don't need to release MK9, so they won't. That 2014 game is still selling a ton in 2020. Another example is GTA V, Rockstar doesn't need to release GTA VI when GTA V is still selling. Both of these games might release on their successors too. MK8 Omega deluxe for Switch 2 and GTA V super complete edition for PS5/XB Series X.



DonFerrari said:

He got banned while dishing personal attacks, so nope I don't think everyone that disagrees with me is in bad faith, in fact I don't think you are in bad faith, but he was in bad faith and wasn't even discussing with me on the topic he was much more discussing with PotentHerb. You may not see the downplaying because for you it is clear Nintendo is far of reach so you don't see the dismissal way he talked of Sony sales that perhaps he wouldn't use if Nintendo comparison wasn't used (and not sure why getting so defensive over someone saying Sony is entering a Nintendo level of sales, which by the time of the original thread discussing it was many games selling 10-15M range, but then to defend Nintendo this goalpost have been moved to 50M).

I never argued in bad faith, what is sad is that you would rather discuss my "bad faith" than my actual points. You only came to create a narrative for me and then Pikashoe tore it apart. Potentherbs despite the bullshit he was spewing atleast presented something besides hurt feelings unlike you. You simply don't like my tone about Sony sales lol, so you got all butthurt and came after my banning. Theres no downplaying, in one of my previous post with Potent I gave Spiderman and a ton of other Sony titles 25 million potential. I simply stated if a dead platform(PS4) can still provide that much more life for Sony's first party, then obviously a platform(Switch) in route to surpassing PS4 and still in its peak can clearly provide more life for its titles. Im sure in "route to surpassing PS4" will trigger you though lol. No one is getting defensive of Sony entering Nintendo level, we simply disagree but Nintendo didn't just stand still. Im sure thats what really hurts though, when Sony improved so did Nintendo. That's not moving the goalpost, thats raising the bar! 

What are you even getting at with your 10-15M range? Are you saying when Spiderman hit 20M, Nintendo's titles were only in the 10 to 15M range? That's a blatant lie if thats what you are saying. I find it funny Sony fans want to put Sony on Nintendo level by comparing Sony's top seller to Nintendo 4th best lol. For example, why should a Nintendo fan ignore Mario Kart and Animal Crossing because Sony has nothing on that level? Potentherb seems to acknowledge Sony games legs but doesn't do the same for Nintendo. He was also completely off on how much Nintendo's titles have already sold to begin with. Are you no different? Will you tell me how Horizon and TLOU II will crawl to 20 M but Zelda BOTW cant get no higher than 25M despite the Switch having around 3 or more years without a successor and then its dying years(PS4's current situation)? I noticed Sony fans don't ever even provide evidence of what they believe. Put together a chart and compare them. Here i'll start it for you.

Mario Kart 8 Deluxe (50 million, 60 million if WiiU version is included) currently 29 million as of Sept TLOU (25 million, has its remaster included) 20 million confirmed
Animal Crossing (50 million) currently 26 million as of Sept  Spiderman (25 million) 20 million speculated
Smash (30 - 35 million) currently 21 million as of Sept  GoW (25 million) 20 million speculated
Poke S&S (25 - 30 million) 19 million as of Sept TLOU II (20 million) speculated
Zelda BOTW (25 - 30 million) 19.7 million as of Sept Uncharted 4 (25 million)
Mario Ody (25 - 30 million) 19 million as of Sept Horizon?
Zelda BOTW II (25 million) speculated GT Sport?

Im gonna need your help on those other titles with the question mark. I simply cannot fathom why Potentherb can't see these Switch titles reaching these heights after seeing how much they have already sold before the Switch enters its very likely to be its highest quarter. Of course he is willing to believe any speculation that comes Sony way and some how a dying console still has all this life left in it. He's willing to acknowledge combining the sales of remasters for Sony (Spiderman PS4/PS5 & TLOU PS3/PS4) but consistently ignored Mario Kart 8 combined sales? But im the one downplaying? The issue is quite simple, Sony fans want to compare the lifetime sales of Sony's titles on PS4 to Switch but Switch hasn't lived a full life span. Usually software peaks after hardware which means Switch software peaks haven't even hit yet. PS4 is at the end of its life, time to accept those PS4 games don't have much time left. 

In summary, Nintendo top tier not only peak higher but Nintendo is more consistent in their releases and sells a much higher total volume. Sony is simply not getting closer but they are getting better. If Sony fans weren't so obsessed with comparison's to Nintendo then maybe Spiderman could celebrate its achievement.

❌ BANNED (1 week): Continued need to Flame/Troll users/generalizing a fanbase

Last edited by CGI-Quality - on 16 December 2020