Forums - Microsoft Discussion - Series X's rumored heat issues seem to be false

DonFerrari said:
d21lewis said:

He did? Man, haven't watched one of his videos in a couple of years. I'd love to see that! 😂

Would be good if someone posted the video with he saying why he changed side.

Probably not hard to find. I'll just look at the videos where he stops bashing Sony and starts bashing Microsoft. I imagine it's a money thing. Sony fans far outnumber Xbox fans and, though there's money/views to be made by being contrarian, there's probably more money to be made by going with what's popular. People eventually get bored watching content from someone they disagree with.

He should have ditched the name "crapgamer", though. Hard to take him seriously with that monniker.



mZuzek loves Smeags. 😢

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d21lewis said:
DonFerrari said:

Would be good if someone posted the video with he saying why he changed side.

Probably not hard to find. I'll just look at the videos where he stops bashing Sony and starts bashing Microsoft. I imagine it's a money thing. Sony fans far outnumber Xbox fans and, though there's money/views to be made by being contrarian, there's probably more money to be made by going with what's popular. People eventually get bored watching content from someone they disagree with.

He should have ditched the name "crapgamer", though. Hard to take him seriously with that moniker.

The guys make some of the worst clickbait content ever. Zero integrity and spin fake news like no other.

His content and viewers breed negativity and hatred. 

Anyone that takes him seriously should really revisit their life choices. 



Tommy Jean, CPA, CGA

shikamaru317 said:
DroidKnight said:

I got the red ring 5 years after purchase and the yellow light 6 years after purchase.  It was 100% for me.

My first 360 died, but it was not because of the typical red ring of death failure, mine actually died because I used a Nyko Intercooler, specifically hoping to avoid a red ring of death, not realizing that Microsoft recommended against using Nyko Intercoolers because they can damage the system. Microsoft Repair team told me that the Nyko Intercooler caused some kind of power surge that burned out the power plug and prevented the system from getting enough power to properly run. 2nd 360 I bought was the Arcade model, reusing my hard drive from my first 360 on it, I've had no issues with it at all, gave it to my sister after back compat was added to Xbox One, and it is still running to this day.  

My bro bought one of those Nyko Intercoolers not that long after purchasing the white OG 360 model, since he had read about it's heat concerns. While after over a decade of casual use, he finally got the RROD, but I don't think it had anything to do with the Intercooler. A bunch of the capacitors were blown and worn out and needed to be replaced. After reading about the caps, which there wasn't much info, it seemed like they were a lower grade product, which a few online with repair experience had said were more rare to find in 360's as though they were only used for a limited time for whatever reason.

It fired up right after replacing the caps, though both the internal fans weren't working, even without the Intercooler. I would've assumed the system wouldn't allow it to run like that in the OS menu, but it did. Since the Intercooler provided plenty of cooling itself, I just cut the internal fans out of their housing to remove the blockage, allowing for better airflow. I also cleaned out some minor dust, replaced the thermal paste, extended the heatsink shroud, etc, and it's run great ever since.

The exhaust was quite warm but not hot, which it should be, because the heat transfer efficiency is higher now with new, better quality paste. Plus better directed heatsink airflow. Though how hot the exhaust feels, will also depend on how much air is being pulled through the system. The higher the airflow, the cooler the exhaust will feel, in comparison to lower airflow and hotter exhaust. The Intercooler moves quite a bit of air, so the exhaust will never feel hot. Along with that, the higher the airflow, the faster the fan has to run, so the louder the noise levels. The Intercooler has tiny fans that run at high RPM which are loud and make my PS4 seem reasonably quiet.

That's way over a decade running with the Intercooler, so I'd assume in your case that it was either a bad batch of Nyko product, or MS was using that as an excuse. 360 had a ton of issue's that they obviously didn't and don't want to admit to in detail. They just paid to fix the problem while keeping the hardware issue's as quiet as possible.

They have heavily focused on fixing those weaker points of their XB hardware products ever since though. They clearly learned a lesson with 360, but also learned a lesson with XB1, that the answer can't simply be just make a bulky bland boring console, to house a bulky fan and heatsink to fix the heating problem. That lead to even better hardware in terms of the XB1S and especially XB1X.

If XBSX is running a little hot, the problem is highly unlikely to be another RROD like with the 360, it would be more of a long term RROD in terms of longevity possibly. Electronics are made to run warm in general, and can be designed to run hot, or even really really hot. That costs more though. They have to balance product cost and longevity, along with noise, etc, so it's a game of wait and see. Odds are by the time it could potentially be a problem, if that ever comes to pass, it'll be last gen outdated tech already.



EricHiggin said:
shikamaru317 said:

My first 360 died, but it was not because of the typical red ring of death failure, mine actually died because I used a Nyko Intercooler, specifically hoping to avoid a red ring of death, not realizing that Microsoft recommended against using Nyko Intercoolers because they can damage the system. Microsoft Repair team told me that the Nyko Intercooler caused some kind of power surge that burned out the power plug and prevented the system from getting enough power to properly run. 2nd 360 I bought was the Arcade model, reusing my hard drive from my first 360 on it, I've had no issues with it at all, gave it to my sister after back compat was added to Xbox One, and it is still running to this day.  

My bro bought one of those Nyko Intercoolers not that long after purchasing the white OG 360 model, since he had read about it's heat concerns. While after over a decade of casual use, he finally got the RROD, but I don't think it had anything to do with the Intercooler. A bunch of the capacitors were blown and worn out and needed to be replaced. After reading about the caps, which there wasn't much info, it seemed like they were a lower grade product, which a few online with repair experience had said were more rare to find in 360's as though they were only used for a limited time for whatever reason.

It fired up right after replacing the caps, though both the internal fans weren't working, even without the Intercooler. I would've assumed the system wouldn't allow it to run like that in the OS menu, but it did. Since the Intercooler provided plenty of cooling itself, I just cut the internal fans out of their housing to remove the blockage, allowing for better airflow. I also cleaned out some minor dust, replaced the thermal paste, extended the heatsink shroud, etc, and it's run great ever since.

The exhaust was quite warm but not hot, which it should be, because the heat transfer efficiency is higher now with new, better quality paste. Plus better directed heatsink airflow. Though how hot the exhaust feels, will also depend on how much air is being pulled through the system. The higher the airflow, the cooler the exhaust will feel, in comparison to lower airflow and hotter exhaust. The Intercooler moves quite a bit of air, so the exhaust will never feel hot. Along with that, the higher the airflow, the faster the fan has to run, so the louder the noise levels. The Intercooler has tiny fans that run at high RPM which are loud and make my PS4 seem reasonably quiet.

That's way over a decade running with the Intercooler, so I'd assume in your case that it was either a bad batch of Nyko product, or MS was using that as an excuse. 360 had a ton of issue's that they obviously didn't and don't want to admit to in detail. They just paid to fix the problem while keeping the hardware issue's as quiet as possible.

They have heavily focused on fixing those weaker points of their XB hardware products ever since though. They clearly learned a lesson with 360, but also learned a lesson with XB1, that the answer can't simply be just make a bulky bland boring console, to house a bulky fan and heatsink to fix the heating problem. That lead to even better hardware in terms of the XB1S and especially XB1X.

If XBSX is running a little hot, the problem is highly unlikely to be another RROD like with the 360, it would be more of a long term RROD in terms of longevity possibly. Electronics are made to run warm in general, and can be designed to run hot, or even really really hot. That costs more though. They have to balance product cost and longevity, along with noise, etc, so it's a game of wait and see. Odds are by the time it could potentially be a problem, if that ever comes to pass, it'll be last gen outdated tech already.

Yeah, it was definitely the intercooler, I don't think Microsoft repair lied to me. They said that there was a power surge and told me to look at where the intercooler plugs into the power cord hole on the back of the 360, there were indeed scorch marks there from where the Nyko Intercooler power plug overheated. They said that because the intercooler draws power from the console power supply instead of having it's own power supply, it can cause major issues due to the amount of power that goes through the power brick, through the intercooler, and into the system, Nyko build quality wasn't great and could cause a short as that current passed through it. Nyko was actually sued over it as I recall because they didn't disclose to people that Microsoft recommended against using their Intercoolers, and they were forced to put a disclaimer on later models that they made, that you would be using the intercooler at your own risk of damage and warranty voiding.



shikamaru317 said:
EricHiggin said:

My bro bought one of those Nyko Intercoolers not that long after purchasing the white OG 360 model, since he had read about it's heat concerns. While after over a decade of casual use, he finally got the RROD, but I don't think it had anything to do with the Intercooler. A bunch of the capacitors were blown and worn out and needed to be replaced. After reading about the caps, which there wasn't much info, it seemed like they were a lower grade product, which a few online with repair experience had said were more rare to find in 360's as though they were only used for a limited time for whatever reason.

It fired up right after replacing the caps, though both the internal fans weren't working, even without the Intercooler. I would've assumed the system wouldn't allow it to run like that in the OS menu, but it did. Since the Intercooler provided plenty of cooling itself, I just cut the internal fans out of their housing to remove the blockage, allowing for better airflow. I also cleaned out some minor dust, replaced the thermal paste, extended the heatsink shroud, etc, and it's run great ever since.

The exhaust was quite warm but not hot, which it should be, because the heat transfer efficiency is higher now with new, better quality paste. Plus better directed heatsink airflow. Though how hot the exhaust feels, will also depend on how much air is being pulled through the system. The higher the airflow, the cooler the exhaust will feel, in comparison to lower airflow and hotter exhaust. The Intercooler moves quite a bit of air, so the exhaust will never feel hot. Along with that, the higher the airflow, the faster the fan has to run, so the louder the noise levels. The Intercooler has tiny fans that run at high RPM which are loud and make my PS4 seem reasonably quiet.

That's way over a decade running with the Intercooler, so I'd assume in your case that it was either a bad batch of Nyko product, or MS was using that as an excuse. 360 had a ton of issue's that they obviously didn't and don't want to admit to in detail. They just paid to fix the problem while keeping the hardware issue's as quiet as possible.

They have heavily focused on fixing those weaker points of their XB hardware products ever since though. They clearly learned a lesson with 360, but also learned a lesson with XB1, that the answer can't simply be just make a bulky bland boring console, to house a bulky fan and heatsink to fix the heating problem. That lead to even better hardware in terms of the XB1S and especially XB1X.

If XBSX is running a little hot, the problem is highly unlikely to be another RROD like with the 360, it would be more of a long term RROD in terms of longevity possibly. Electronics are made to run warm in general, and can be designed to run hot, or even really really hot. That costs more though. They have to balance product cost and longevity, along with noise, etc, so it's a game of wait and see. Odds are by the time it could potentially be a problem, if that ever comes to pass, it'll be last gen outdated tech already.

Yeah, it was definitely the intercooler, I don't think Microsoft repair lied to me. They said that there was a power surge and told me to look at where the intercooler plugs into the power cord hole on the back of the 360, there were indeed scorch marks there from where the Nyko Intercooler power plug overheated. They said that because the intercooler draws power from the console power supply instead of having it's own power supply, it can cause major issues due to the amount of power that goes through the power brick, through the intercooler, and into the system, Nyko build quality wasn't great and could cause a short as that current passed through it. Nyko was actually sued over it as I recall because they didn't disclose to people that Microsoft recommended against using their Intercoolers, and they were forced to put a disclaimer on later models that they made, that you would be using the intercooler at your own risk of damage and warranty voiding.

My bro's Intercooler plugs in pretty snug. I could see an issue if the user didn't push hard enough to ensure a solid connection. Pretty hard to believe it was that big of a manufacturing tolerance issue for Nyko that they didn't realize it until there was a ton of products sold to consumers and didn't recall them. Could be, just kinda tough to believe.

Mind you, it's tough to believe MS themselves would launch XB 360 as they did and ignore the RROD as long as they did. Yet MS eventually made good on those problems, so why not Nyko? Business is business I guess.



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hinch said:
eva01beserk said:

Well sure. Just not to the extreme the guy made it out to be. He pulled the ssd out and said it burned him. I'm sure he was exagerating. 

A piece of electronics drawing 180-190W (on average according to previews) is going to produce some heat. I saw the video and the guy pull the SSD straight from the console and proceeds to touch the heatsink lol.. its going to be hot man xD

I'd imagine this is a non issue unless you totally block off the top ventilation. Unless there's mass reports of retail units overheating or failing there isn't much to speculate about other than it it produces hot air. Which should be expected from these 300w+ console.

It is a non-issue. It's by design.

eva01beserk said:
hinch said:

A piece of electronics drawing 180-190W (on average according to previews) is going to produce some heat. I saw the video and the guy pull the SSD straight from the console and proceeds to touch the heatsink lol.. its going to be hot man xD

I'd imagine this is a non issue unless you totally block off the top ventilation. Unless there's mass reports of retail units overheating or failing there isn't much to speculate about other than it it produces hot air. Which should be expected from these 300w+ console.

Dont think anybody expects any issue like red ring of death 2.0. Just people taking it to an extreme. The worst I see hapening is maybe a fan runing loud and even that is unlikely.

The RROD cannot occur with the 8th gen or 9th gen devices, long before failure can occur the consoles will throttle their clockspeeds and if that isn't enough, enter thermal shutdown to protect the hardware.

It's a PC technology, it's been around for decades now, it works.

AsGryffynn said:

Solder comes before temperature stress tests, not after. Otherwise, the non defective units would have had a different design. OTOH, other components might have had poor heat tolerance and also needed replacing. 

Simply put, the issue wasn't cooling the console so much as making sure it would work at that temperature. Cooling problems imply fan failure or mechanical issues slowing heat exchange. 

Metal expands and contracts with heat. - This is basic thermodynamics. (But I wouldn't know anything about heat, would I?)
The solder would expand and contract with the heat and start to produce fine hair-line cracks, which is why people would cover their Xbox in a towel in order to bring the heat level up high enough to "reset" the solder, but that was only a temporary solution.

It is because the solder wasn't designed to tolerate those heat levels like the older lead solder. - That is down to the cooling design in the Xbox 360 not being up to snuff and the materials being used.

The PCB would also "warp" and buckle compounding the solder issue over time, again, poor thermal design and poor supports.

The same issue would occur on the PC, some older GPU's would have the PCB flex over time, newer GPU's now come with a GPU back-plate which keeps the PCB torqued and as straight as possible.
The older Geforce GPU's would also have the solder joints fail due to heat stresses over time as well, which forced nVidia to do a recall, it's the same issue the Xbox 360 had ironically.
https://www.cnet.com/news/summarizing-the-nvidia-problems-with-laptop-chips-overheating/
https://techreport.com/news/15720/chip-failures-nvidia-responds-at-last/






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