By using this site, you agree to our Privacy Policy and our Terms of Use. Close

Forums - Microsoft Discussion - Official Xbox July Showcase 2020 thread

src said:
MS's biggest missteps due to how early their dev pipeline is. Its truly a colossal issue.

Halo - 2020 (5 years in dev) (gameplay)
Crossfire - 2020 (???) (gameplay)
Medium - 2020 (???) (gameplay)
FM7 - early in dev (3 years in dev) (in engine)
Everwild - ??? (2 years in dev) (in engine)
Fable - ??? (1-2 years in dev) (CGI)
SoD3 - ??? (2 years in dev) (CGI)
Avowed - ??? (2 years in dev) (CGI)
Hellblade - ??? (3 years in dev) (CGI)
STALKER 2 - ??? (???) (CGI)

Only 3 games showed gameplay and the lead was underwhelming. Apart from that, MS has shown games that are very early in dev, despite said studios actually having a supposed decent amount of time in dev. They've effectively laid bare their entire software pipeline till like 2023/4, which begs to question how will their shows for the next few years be.


Of course a lot of their games are early in development, the studios they bought are all mostly coming off a game they were already making or are still making them. But this isn't their entire software pipeline. You're missing games, and you're also forgetting that lots of these studios have multiple teams. They only showcased nine of their fifteen studios on Thursday, and we still know of other projects from the studios they did show. Not to mention there are always moneyhat time exclusive deals, and situations like Bloodborne or Sunset where they can just pay a studio to make an exclusive.

Plus all of their studios have been expanding. Even the small studios have been growing and opening up new teams/locations. Soon enough they'll be able to pump out games at a great pace. And for all we know four or five of your ???? games are coming in 2021. Another thing is most of those titles they showed us were XSX/PC only, so the devs aren't worrying about a last gen version.

Also we're in the middle of a global pandemic and have been for about 6-7 months+ now. So when you say "oh they've had 2 years to work on the game", nah, they really haven't. And throwing a demo build of games together is obviously not easy, because Sony suffered from the same "problem" in their showcase. Also regarding future shows, they have a wealth of studios and games now. How will they not have stuff for future shows? Can Sony not show a gameplay presentation of HFW just because they already gave us a non-gameplay look? Of course they can, and will. MS can do the same for big games like Fable and Avowed. They still have six studios they showed nothing from and still have multiple teams making games from studios that were shown Thursday.

They'll be fine.



Around the Network



Don't think I need to explain why the highlighted isn't an acceptable way to engage with someone on this forum. But liking comments with wording like this encourages this kind of behavior.



mjk45 said:
CGI-Quality said:

Not a single person has been formally banned and the couple that have been Thread Banned certainly weren't for calling Halo average. 

Maybe you should have stated that this thread is to stay xbox focused and no comparisons between either shows will be allowed.

With the addition that if you wish to do a comparison you can make another thread.

I really shouldn't have to state that an Xbox Thread should stay Xbox focused, but as Shika pointed out, that is exactly what I did.

In any case, the issue for a thread like this is what happens with most Xbox threads on our site — people come here whom either don't care at all for Xbox or use a shortcoming to continuously throw shade. You can give an opinion and not do that.

This is, in fact, a trend that doesn't happen nearly as much in either Nintendo or Sony topics (even though, yes, people cause trouble in them too). Smaller fanbase = less topics about Xbox, I get it, but they have no place to feel safe to discuss anything positive other than the Empire Thread, and thus, we have work to do.

Last edited by CGI-Quality - on 25 July 2020

                                                                                                                                                           

Alara317 said:
sales2099 said:

So much wrong in this, really makes me wonder if you’d trash the show regardless of what they offered. If the biggest issue is that there was not enough gameplay, that would be fine if you left it at that. 

You say no mixups...their genre representation in unmatched. Compared to their competition that locks almost all their games in “3rd person story driven single player action adventure” this was a great offering of what they have. 

SoD3 is supposed to be a AAA survival game. Grounded a smaller title but more creative in premise. Avowed is a exclusive Skyrim, Xbox One lacked exclusive RPGs this gen and how they have that and Fable. Halo a ambitious FPS with campaign and multiplayer (how many PS exclusives even have a multiplayer component?). Even though it was in engine, Forza showed a night and day graphics comparison to the competition. 

Please tell me how those things lacked oomph....having a literal LOTR action RPG from the masters of RPGs with Obsidian at the helm. Or thinking Hellblade 2 won’t be anything other then a graphical showcase and narratively pleasing when it’s ready to be shown?

What about Rare? How could you say Everwild looks like more of the same? We don’t even know how it plays but it looks creatively unleashed. After SoT reaching it’s critical success and audience I have full faith in Rare. 

“When was the last time they delivered on promises”: Playground, Turn 10, Rares last game, Obsidians track record at the very least should be enough to have high standards for their titles. Don’t act like every dev is unproven. 

You accuse me of bias then bend over backwards to make everything sound so much better than it actually is. And yes, unless they showed something new and original, different from what they've shown in the past, with a different approach, I likely would have bashed it for the exact reasons I Stated: Microsoft has no goodwill built up in their tank. They have absolutely failed since 2013 and earlier (Let's be honest, the last few years of the Xbox 360 were also devoid of anything significant, allowing Sony to somehow beat them that generation), and they're doing the same things in this presentation that got them nowhere the past decade. the same gameplay free trailers, the same "WORLD PREMIERE" declarations in front of every trailer to make it sound and look more important than it is, the tenuous grasp on the concept of exclusivity to make their games sound like they're more bound to Xbox than they actually are. 

All they had to do was show more gameplay and not be disingenuous with their language and I'd have given this a better score or been kinder to them. However, what they did was the exact same thing they've been doing for the past generation, and that exact same thing didn't work and instilled absolutely no confidence in them. I made that remarkably clear: This presentation does NOT exist in a vacuum, there are outside factors involved that paint one's perception of the event. 

And what are you even talking about, trying to compare Xbox's exclusives to PS4's? "Oh, all sony's games are singleplayer story-based action adventure games'....when that's the broadest and most all-encompassing of genres. And not true at all. Yeah, they do better with their singleplayer story-based games, but they also do shooters and racers and platformers and many other genres and styles. And even within 'singleplayer story-driven action-adventure', they have a tonne of variety. Try to tell me that The LAst of US, God of War, Bloodborne, Horizon zero Dawn, Spider-Man, and Ghost of Tsushima are in any way similar outside of that very, VERY broad title. Survival horror, epic fantasy, victorian gothic, post-apocalyptic dino-robot hunting, superhero, samurai. If you're deliberately trying to be reductive to prove a point, all you proved is that you cherry-pick to support your cause and ignore data that doesn't help you out. 

I Really don't feel the need to talk about 'oompf' because, as I stated, these games lacked any real depth. Nothing really felt new or original. Halo was just another Halo. Forza was just another Forza. State of Decay looked like just another State of Decay (And pretty much everything else lacked enough gameplay to really tell if it was more of the same or something unique.) I'm not the only one to say it, but almost all of these games have a tonne of potential. A lot of these games COULD be unique and interesting, but without enough information it's hard to tell if it'll be good, and even with information you can't really know if a game will be good until it comes out. 

You speak of Rare and Everwild. I think that game has a gorgeous art style and I think Rare has a hell of a legacy to live up to....but the last truly great game they made was Banjo Tooie, like 20 years ago (And most of the team that made that game went onto make Playtonic). After that, and after Microsoft bought them up, they made shitty banjo games, a terrible perfect dark game, the mediocre Viva Pinata series, a bunch of lame Kinect games, and the famously disappointing Sea of Thieves. and no, do NOT try to spin sea of Thieves as some monumental success. It was a game that looked wonderful, sounded great, and launched with nothing. IT was a boring, empty game that took years to reach any sort of potential and by now the legacy has long since been tarnished. It's not a bad game now, but try finding anyone that isn't a diehard Xbox stan that cares about it. You'll have a hell of a hard time. The point is, the rare of today is not the rare that made Donkey Kong Country and Perfect Dark and Banjo Kazooie. Your argument is invalid. 

And again, none of this exists in a vacuum. None of this is without context. The trailers themselves were fine, but all it did is reassure me that Microsoft isn't changing things up or trying anything new or going in a different direction, and given how unimpressive their brand has been for the past ten years, that paints mine and most other people's opinion on the presentation. 

I fully admit I went into this presentation with a critical eye. Given their history and their lack of originality or success over the past decade, I fully expected to not like what was shown while still being cautiously optimistic. I want them to succeed because the industry is better with more competition. The presentation itself was neutral, so with the reality of Microsoft's failures over the past generation it was disappointing. You, on the other hand, refuse to admit that you're biased. You seem to not be willing to accept that you will bend over backwards to be impressed by this unimpressive garbage. It was not a good presentation but here you are acting like it was some sort of technical marvel or that they knocked it out of the park. I reiterate, Microsoft could piss in your breakfast cereal and you'd eat it up. Then you'd argue with anyone telling you that you're eating piss. 

Don’t know what to tell ya, you on the other side and see things differently. Also strange I’ve been posting here all year long and you come out of nowhere when Xbox does a major showing. Tells me you came in looking for trouble. 

I never claimed this was the best show. In the Xbox Empire thread I was actually critical. No Hellblade 2 gameplay, Halo character models did look dated, too many moneyhats and no info on games like Gears Tactics and Flight Sim on Series X. 

I do however see the positives. The Halo Gears Forza narrative is dead. While we saw 2 of the 3, we now have healthy variety. The “Xbox mid gen drought” narrative is dead because while you say it’s all CG, that tells me the mid gen will have a steady stream of exclusives. I see GP continuing to be the best deal in gaming, with even the moneyhats being day 1 GamePass like Stalker 2 and Crossfire. I don’t even need to see gameplay to be excited for Avowed and Fable, Xbox gonna be the WRPG king next gen. 

So ya that’s my take. Wasn’t perfect, they held a lot back, but I liked what I did see. The gameplay will come, it’s inevitable. 



Xbox: Best hardware, Game Pass best value, best BC, more 1st party genres and multiplayer titles. 

 

CGI-Quality said:
mjk45 said:

Maybe you should have stated that this thread is to stay xbox focused and no comparisons between either shows will be allowed.

With the addition that if you wish to do a comparison you can make another thread.

I really shouldn't have to state that an Xbox Thread should stay Xbox focused, but as Shika pointed out, that is exactly what I did.

In any case, the issue for a thread like this is what happens with most Xbox threads on our site — people come here whom either don't care at all for Xbox or use a shortcoming to continuously throw shade. You can give an opinion and not do that.

This is, in fact, a trend that doesn't happen nearly as much in either Nintendo or Sony topics (even though, yes, people cause trouble in them too). Smaller fanbase = less topics about Xbox, I get it, but they have no other place to feel safe to discuss anything positive other than the Empire Thread, and thus, we have work to do.

Problem is noone is really making any new threads for any of the platforms so Gaming one is the default one for most people.

If we have more positive topics on games that people are excited about - i.e Fable and what it could be, what it will play like. Instead of being stuck in a big Xbox thread this site might be more popular. And pull in more people

So then we have a lot more clickbait threads and verses ones because that's what people talk about, especially in new consoles coming up.



Around the Network
hinch said:
CGI-Quality said:

~snip

Problem is noone is really making any new threads for any of the platforms so Gaming one is the default one for most people.

If we have more positive topics on games that people are excited about - i.e Fable and what it could be, what it will play like. Instead of being stuck in a big Xbox thread this site might be more popular. And pull in more people

So then we have a lot more clickbait threads and verses ones because that's what people talk about, especially in new consoles coming up.

It goes beyond what we talk about. For Xbox, it is generally any thread. Doesn't matter the game nor subject. I've watched the trend and have heard the complaints. This doesn't need to turn into a topic about it though, we're just going to do better going forward.



                                                                                                                                                           

LudicrousSpeed said:
src said:
MS's biggest missteps due to how early their dev pipeline is. Its truly a colossal issue.

Halo - 2020 (5 years in dev) (gameplay)
Crossfire - 2020 (???) (gameplay)
Medium - 2020 (???) (gameplay)
FM7 - early in dev (3 years in dev) (in engine)
Everwild - ??? (2 years in dev) (in engine)
Fable - ??? (1-2 years in dev) (CGI)
SoD3 - ??? (2 years in dev) (CGI)
Avowed - ??? (2 years in dev) (CGI)
Hellblade - ??? (3 years in dev) (CGI)
STALKER 2 - ??? (???) (CGI)

Only 3 games showed gameplay and the lead was underwhelming. Apart from that, MS has shown games that are very early in dev, despite said studios actually having a supposed decent amount of time in dev. They've effectively laid bare their entire software pipeline till like 2023/4, which begs to question how will their shows for the next few years be.


Of course a lot of their games are early in development, the studios they bought are all mostly coming off a game they were already making or are still making them. But this isn't their entire software pipeline. You're missing games, and you're also forgetting that lots of these studios have multiple teams. They only showcased nine of their fifteen studios on Thursday, and we still know of other projects from the studios they did show. Not to mention there are always moneyhat time exclusive deals, and situations like Bloodborne or Sunset where they can just pay a studio to make an exclusive.

Plus all of their studios have been expanding. Even the small studios have been growing and opening up new teams/locations. Soon enough they'll be able to pump out games at a great pace. And for all we know four or five of your ???? games are coming in 2021. Another thing is most of those titles they showed us were XSX/PC only, so the devs aren't worrying about a last gen version.

Also we're in the middle of a global pandemic and have been for about 6-7 months+ now. So when you say "oh they've had 2 years to work on the game", nah, they really haven't. And throwing a demo build of games together is obviously not easy, because Sony suffered from the same "problem" in their showcase. Also regarding future shows, they have a wealth of studios and games now. How will they not have stuff for future shows? Can Sony not show a gameplay presentation of HFW just because they already gave us a non-gameplay look? Of course they can, and will. MS can do the same for big games like Fable and Avowed. They still have six studios they showed nothing from and still have multiple teams making games from studios that were shown Thursday.

They'll be fine.

There isn't too much left in the pipeline to show. Gears (coalition), FH (Playground), InExile, Initiative. This is the output for MS for the next 4 years or so.

We are 3 or so months from the launch of a new console and the only game XGS has shown gameplay of is Halo Infinite, a game in dev for 5 years and still looking like its troubled.

There is the caveat that the CGI trailers were used so that in the next showcase gameplay can be revealed, but games like Forza have been said to be in early dev.

Forza has already had 3 years in dev, yet there is still another 1-2 left.

Everwild devs don't even know what the gameplay of there game is.

If its turns out the CGI games are far away then MS is going to be absolutely destroyed in the next few years.



src said:
LudicrousSpeed said:

Of course a lot of their games are early in development, the studios they bought are all mostly coming off a game they were already making or are still making them. But this isn't their entire software pipeline. You're missing games, and you're also forgetting that lots of these studios have multiple teams. They only showcased nine of their fifteen studios on Thursday, and we still know of other projects from the studios they did show. Not to mention there are always moneyhat time exclusive deals, and situations like Bloodborne or Sunset where they can just pay a studio to make an exclusive.

Plus all of their studios have been expanding. Even the small studios have been growing and opening up new teams/locations. Soon enough they'll be able to pump out games at a great pace. And for all we know four or five of your ???? games are coming in 2021. Another thing is most of those titles they showed us were XSX/PC only, so the devs aren't worrying about a last gen version.

Also we're in the middle of a global pandemic and have been for about 6-7 months+ now. So when you say "oh they've had 2 years to work on the game", nah, they really haven't. And throwing a demo build of games together is obviously not easy, because Sony suffered from the same "problem" in their showcase. Also regarding future shows, they have a wealth of studios and games now. How will they not have stuff for future shows? Can Sony not show a gameplay presentation of HFW just because they already gave us a non-gameplay look? Of course they can, and will. MS can do the same for big games like Fable and Avowed. They still have six studios they showed nothing from and still have multiple teams making games from studios that were shown Thursday.

They'll be fine.

There isn't too much left in the pipeline to show. Gears (coalition), FH (Playground), InExile, Initiative. This is the output for MS for the next 4 years or so.

We are 3 or so months from the launch of a new console and the only game XGS has shown gameplay of is Halo Infinite, a game in dev for 5 years and still looking like its troubled.

There is the caveat that the CGI trailers were used so that in the next showcase gameplay can be revealed, but games like Forza have been said to be in early dev.

Forza has already had 3 years in dev, yet there is still another 1-2 left.

Everwild devs don't even know what the gameplay of there game is.

If its turns out the CGI games are far away then MS is going to be absolutely destroyed in the next few years.

lol, this isn’t the output for the next four years. Compulsion is working on a new IP. Double Fine is working on a new IP plus Psychonauts which IIRC you didn’t list. inXile has a new RPG they are working on plus Wasteland 3. There’s no reason to assume all of Obsidian will be working on Avowed. Ninja Theory has three titles in the works. Initiative has at least one game in the works. 

Among others. No one expected Playground to be working on a new Horizon and something else. No one expected Obsidian to be making three games at once. No one thought Double Fine would be working on multiple projects and yet they are. And MS is expanding all of these studios. And there’s always third party partners like they already have for games like Tactics, Battletoads, Flight Sim, Tell Me Why, etc.



https://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-2020-halo-infinite-gameplay-demo-analysis



LudicrousSpeed said:
src said:

There isn't too much left in the pipeline to show. Gears (coalition), FH (Playground), InExile, Initiative. This is the output for MS for the next 4 years or so.

We are 3 or so months from the launch of a new console and the only game XGS has shown gameplay of is Halo Infinite, a game in dev for 5 years and still looking like its troubled.

There is the caveat that the CGI trailers were used so that in the next showcase gameplay can be revealed, but games like Forza have been said to be in early dev.

Forza has already had 3 years in dev, yet there is still another 1-2 left.

Everwild devs don't even know what the gameplay of there game is.

If its turns out the CGI games are far away then MS is going to be absolutely destroyed in the next few years.

lol, this isn’t the output for the next four years. Compulsion is working on a new IP. Double Fine is working on a new IP plus Psychonauts which IIRC you didn’t list. inXile has a new RPG they are working on plus Wasteland 3. There’s no reason to assume all of Obsidian will be working on Avowed. Ninja Theory has three titles in the works. Initiative has at least one game in the works. 

Among others. No one expected Playground to be working on a new Horizon and something else. No one expected Obsidian to be making three games at once. No one thought Double Fine would be working on multiple projects and yet they are. And MS is expanding all of these studios. And there’s always third party partners like they already have for games like Tactics, Battletoads, Flight Sim, Tell Me Why, etc.

Forgot Compulsion but they are a small studio.

100% all of Obsidian, Ninja Theory and Initiative are working on their AAA game. These studios are not that big and can only handle 1 AAA game at a time. Ninja Theory does not have three titles. Bleeding edge was worked on pre-MS. Project Mara is probably some small indie like game made from a few devs. All hands will be on Hellblade.