Forums - Gaming Discussion - In your mind, what will the Xbox SX conference have to do to beat the PS5 conference?

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Answer the damned question!

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d21lewis said:
The Lockhart will only "hold back Series X" if mid-range PCs "hold back high end PCs".

Mid-range pc's aren't holding high-end pc's back, consoles are. The last game I can remember that wasn't a straight port from the console version was probably BF3.



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sales2099 said:
goopy20 said:

Exactly! Native 4k and 60fps (or even 120fps) is a sure fire way for developers to be as inefficient as possible as that would suck up 2/3 of gpu resources on something that some people won't even notice. So why are we all thinking Lockhart is such a great idea, saying its not going to hold back Series X? How would a game that pushes Series X to its limits at 30fps/1440p be able to run on Lockhart? The truth is that Lockhart is only going to work if Series X would be wasting those 8Tflops and 7GB of extra RAM on running Lockhart games at 4k/60fps. 

I know most people don't care or expect all games to be 4k/60fps. But that's what MS is selling with Series X anyway. I mean has there been any game announced for Series X that isn't 4k/60fps or even 120fps? Its pretty much what the "optimized for Series X" stands for (together with Ray Tracing) and all uncle Phil's been talking about. 

For arguments sake, lets say MS only announced Lockhart and Series X would have come out somewhere in 2024 as a mid-gen console. Would anyone have been ok with that? Because that's exactly what's happening, only they're releasing their mid-gen console early.

Again guys, look at these two badges and you tell me what's the difference between Series X and the XOne X? 

Series X has 20% more power so it can do better at achieving as close to those benchmarks as possible. And it goes without saying games that aren’t AAA aren’t pushing the graphics to their limits due to lack of budgets so it would make those benchmarks easier to hit too.

I mean, we’ve seen the in-engine trailers in Halo Infinite. Gorgeous and certainly look a step above anything Xbox One can do. I think Series x can do both. Hit benchmarks as well as look next gen. 

I know, but why do think MS put 4k/60fps as some fixed standard on their Series X badge in the first place? And how will Lockhart be able to run a game that's pushing Series X to its limits at 1440p and 30fps?

I think Halo Infinite will be amazing. It looks like its going back to its roots, the art style looks great and they spend a lot of time on it. Apparently it will be 120fps and 4k on Series X, which certainly is impressive, but 120fps also means its not even close the fully pushing the capabilities of Series X.



goopy20 said:
sales2099 said:

Series X has 20% more power so it can do better at achieving as close to those benchmarks as possible. And it goes without saying games that aren’t AAA aren’t pushing the graphics to their limits due to lack of budgets so it would make those benchmarks easier to hit too.

I mean, we’ve seen the in-engine trailers in Halo Infinite. Gorgeous and certainly look a step above anything Xbox One can do. I think Series x can do both. Hit benchmarks as well as look next gen. 

I know, but why do think MS put 4k/60fps as some fixed standard on their Series X badge in the first place? And how will Lockhart be able to run a game that's pushing Series X to its limits at 1440p and 30fps?

I think Halo Infinite will be amazing. It looks like its going back to its roots, the art style looks great and they spend a lot of time on it. Apparently it will be 120fps and 4k on Series X, which certainly is impressive, but 120fps also means its not even close the fully pushing the capabilities of Series X.

A game pushing 120 frames per second IS fully utilizing the capabilities of the Series X LOL. It might not be doing so in a manner that appeals to you, but it is still utilizing its power to do so. 

Also you don’t seem to understand what the Optimized for Series X badge means. A game doesn’t have to be 4k60. They use that badge on every game. At their May event they showed 12 games. Half of them are 4k60. Half of them are 30fps. But they still utilize the SSD, Smart Delivery, and/or 4k, so they still have the optimized badge. Per usual, what you believe to be happening when it pertains to Xbox and what’s actually happening aren’t even close.

Lockhart will be able to run a game that is 1440p on XSX the same way that consoles can run incredible PC games: optimization. The way it’s been done for decades and decades.



LudicrousSpeed said:
goopy20 said:

I know, but why do think MS put 4k/60fps as some fixed standard on their Series X badge in the first place? And how will Lockhart be able to run a game that's pushing Series X to its limits at 1440p and 30fps?

I think Halo Infinite will be amazing. It looks like its going back to its roots, the art style looks great and they spend a lot of time on it. Apparently it will be 120fps and 4k on Series X, which certainly is impressive, but 120fps also means its not even close the fully pushing the capabilities of Series X.

A game pushing 120 frames per second IS fully utilizing the capabilities of the Series X LOL. It might not be doing so in a manner that appeals to you, but it is still utilizing its power to do so. 

Also you don’t seem to understand what the Optimized for Series X badge means. A game doesn’t have to be 4k60. They use that badge on every game. At their May event they showed 12 games. Half of them are 4k60. Half of them are 30fps. But they still utilize the SSD, Smart Delivery, and/or 4k, so they still have the optimized badge. Per usual, what you believe to be happening when it pertains to Xbox and what’s actually happening aren’t even close.

Lockhart will be able to run a game that is 1440p on XSX the same way that consoles can run incredible PC games: optimization. The way it’s been done for decades and decades.

It's using all the resources that's true. But if people have a hard time noticing the difference, would you then call that fully utilizing the capabilities of the Series X? Isn't console development all about efficiency and getting the best visual bang for your buck out of the things?

Okay, which games did they show in May that weren't 4k/60fps?

Last edited by goopy20 - on 05 July 2020

I’m not doing your homework for you.



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goopy20 said:
sales2099 said:

Series X has 20% more power so it can do better at achieving as close to those benchmarks as possible. And it goes without saying games that aren’t AAA aren’t pushing the graphics to their limits due to lack of budgets so it would make those benchmarks easier to hit too.

I mean, we’ve seen the in-engine trailers in Halo Infinite. Gorgeous and certainly look a step above anything Xbox One can do. I think Series x can do both. Hit benchmarks as well as look next gen. 

I know, but why do think MS put 4k/60fps as some fixed standard on their Series X badge in the first place? And how will Lockhart be able to run a game that's pushing Series X to its limits at 1440p and 30fps?

I think Halo Infinite will be amazing. It looks like its going back to its roots, the art style looks great and they spend a lot of time on it. Apparently it will be 120fps and 4k on Series X, which certainly is impressive, but 120fps also means its not even close the fully pushing the capabilities of Series X.

Because up until Sony advertised the UE demo at 1440p/30 fps, both Xbox and ps fans were in a 4k arms race. Just because the goal posted rapidly shifted for you doesn’t mean it shifted for MS. To many, that 4K/60 FPS badge means “next gen” because it simply wasn’t possible now. 

Again, Lockhart is a lower GPU, devs been doing that for Pc games for decades. 

Don’t believe that rumor. Its targeting 4K/60. 120 is probably for the Pc version if true. And yet....the in engine trailer looked pretty next gen to me. Despite the taxing elements of 4K/60, the 20% extra power and slipspace engine seem to compensate very well. It’ll look next gen regardless. 



 

 

sales2099 said:
goopy20 said:

I know, but why do think MS put 4k/60fps as some fixed standard on their Series X badge in the first place? And how will Lockhart be able to run a game that's pushing Series X to its limits at 1440p and 30fps?

I think Halo Infinite will be amazing. It looks like its going back to its roots, the art style looks great and they spend a lot of time on it. Apparently it will be 120fps and 4k on Series X, which certainly is impressive, but 120fps also means its not even close the fully pushing the capabilities of Series X.

Because up until Sony advertised the UE demo at 1440p/30 fps, both Xbox and ps fans were in a 4k arms race. Just because the goal posted rapidly shifted for you doesn’t mean it shifted for MS. To many, that 4K/60 FPS badge means “next gen” because it simply wasn’t possible now. 

Again, Lockhart is a lower GPU, devs been doing that for Pc games for decades. 

Don’t believe that rumor. Its targeting 4K/60. 120 is probably for the Pc version if true. And yet....the in engine trailer looked pretty next gen to me. Despite the taxing elements of 4K/60, the 20% extra power and slipspace engine seem to compensate very well. It’ll look next gen regardless. 

Everybody gets excited about 4k/60fps because they are easy to grasp concepts when talking about next gen gaming and no games have been shown. It's just that once people do actually see the games, they are going to judge them with their eyes and care a lot less about the technical details like number of pixels rendered on screen. Either a game looks next gen or it doesn't, and it should be instantly noticeable even in a low quality Youtube stream. 

I get why some keep referring to pc and how low-end pc's aren't holding back high-end, but that makes no sense. Things like Ray Tracing and SSD have been around on pc for a long time, but we still have hardly any games that make practical use of it. Pc is typically held back by the console versions, though. Sure, pc gets some extra graphics settings and options for unlocked framerates and higher resolution, but the entire core game (level design, ai, pysics etc.) is still the same on a 12Tflops RTX2080 Ti as on a 2Tflops ps4.

Last edited by goopy20 - on 05 July 2020

Just watched. Everwild art direction is unique and mesmerizing, but again, it was only a trailer. 

Overall, weak show. Too many trailers, little gameplay footage, and whenever there is gameplay footage, it is a disappointment. Some footage reminded me of the PS3 era. Demon Souls and the inevitable remaster of the PS4 2020 lineup can easily outmatch what MS shown.



LurkerJ said:

Just watched. Everwild art direction is unique and mesmerizing, but again, it was only a trailer. 

Overall, weak show. Too many trailers, little gameplay footage, and whenever there is gameplay footage, it is a disappointment. Some footage reminded me of the PS3 era. Demon Souls and the inevitable remaster of the PS4 2020 lineup can easily outmatch what MS shown.

Looking back at this thread, I have to say: It was less about what it needed to beat Sony (history showed that was virtually impossible given the legacy of the two companies), but what it needed to be a good presentation in its own right. 

It had new IPs, it had returning favourites, and it had a lot of things that showed potential. what it didn't have was gameplay. It didn't have enough information about the games. With new IP you need to show gameplay or it means nothing. A cool idea is a cool idea; I can think up a cool idea. Without that implementation and demonstration, it means nothing. 

So I say, they needed gameplay.