Forums - Politics Discussion - Historic Moment of Kim Jong Un stepping over the border of South Korea

So who will get the noble price , Trump, Kim Jong Un or Dennis Roadman ?

Trump 15 51.72%
 
Kim Jong Un 5 17.24%
 
Barack Obama 3 10.34%
 
Dennis Roadman 6 20.69%
 
Total:29
KLAMarine said:
SpokenTruth said:

The "Rocket man" series and "My button is bigger than your button" among others. 

Are you not aware of them?

I'm aware of them. Please bring them up in their original context.

Uh...ok.  Original context.



Massimus - "Trump already has democrat support."

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lol if you think Trump had anything meaningful to do with it.

In Kim Jong Un's New Year's speech, he said that relations between North and South Korea need to improve.
A few weeks after that both sides talked about North Korean Olympic athletes and the united(!) women's hockey team.
During the Olympic Games, Kim Jong Un's sister visited the South Korean president, Moon Jae-in, and invited him to Pyongyang.
After the Olympic games, both sides just continued talking.

The Olympic Games did far more than Trump to get both sides together.



Iasn't the actual thing that got the ball rolling on this the Olympic games and the North Korean Olympic delegation in Pyeongchang?
That was what got them talking, Kim Jong Uns desire for representation and South koreas willingness to listen.

I'm certainly no fan of the Olympics, they a are a political, economical and ecological nightmare, but it reeastablished the first talks after years.

I hope something genuinely good comes out of this, in any case.



SpokenTruth said:
KLAMarine said:

I'm aware of them. Please bring them up in their original context.

Uh...ok.  Original context.

I see now, thank you. After looking into this further, you are correct that these tweets threatened peaceful negotiations but considering North Korea's actions around that time

http://www.foxnews.com/world/2017/11/28/timeline-2017-north-korea-missile-and-nuclear-tests.html

I'd say Trump's aggressive tone was more than justified. I may go so far as to say I admire his aggressiveness to a degree.



KLAMarine said:
SpokenTruth said:

Uh...ok.  Original context.

I see now, thank you. After looking into this further, you are correct that these tweets threatened peaceful negotiations but considering North Korea's actions around that time

http://www.foxnews.com/world/2017/11/28/timeline-2017-north-korea-missile-and-nuclear-tests.html

I'd say Trump's aggressive tone was more than justified. I may go so far as to say I admire his aggressiveness to a degree.

There is being strong and assertive and then there is being childish and belligerent.  You can stand firm against their nuclear program without sounding like a 6 year old on a playground.  Being brash usually only results in further instigation of the problem, not a resolution to it.  NK, SK and China had already begun talks about denuclearizing all while Trump interjected his rude, untactful and audacious tweets.



Massimus - "Trump already has democrat support."

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SpokenTruth said:
KLAMarine said:

I see now, thank you. After looking into this further, you are correct that these tweets threatened peaceful negotiations but considering North Korea's actions around that time

http://www.foxnews.com/world/2017/11/28/timeline-2017-north-korea-missile-and-nuclear-tests.html

I'd say Trump's aggressive tone was more than justified. I may go so far as to say I admire his aggressiveness to a degree.

There is being strong and assertive and then there is being childish and belligerent.  You can stand firm against their nuclear program without sounding like a 6 year old on a playground.  Being brash usually only results in further instigation of the problem, not a resolution to it.  NK, SK and China had already begun talks about denuclearizing all while Trump interjected his rude, untactful and audacious tweets.

Just giving North Korea the good-ol' carrot-and-stick approach.



NK says Trump is not responsible for denuclearization talk and could be making things worse.

North Korea: US pressure not behind denuclearization

North Korea: Trump ruining good mood ahead of summit

 

Like I was trying to say before.  Trump is a threat to them, not the catalyst.  China and SK deserve the credit for the talks.



Massimus - "Trump already has democrat support."

SpokenTruth said:

NK says Trump is not responsible for denuclearization talk and could be making things worse.

North Korea: US pressure not behind denuclearization

North Korea: Trump ruining good mood ahead of summit

 

Like I was trying to say before.  Trump is a threat to them, not the catalyst.  China and SK deserve the credit for the talks.

And South Korea says President Trump deserves Nobel Peace Prize.

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-northkorea-southkorea-trump/south-korea-president-says-trump-deserves-nobel-peace-prize-idUSKBN1I10OD

I find it funny the amount of people who hate Trump so much that they start believing the news from North Korea and Russia. The two biggest propaganda/indoctrination news in the entire world.

Do you really expect NK to ever admit US had anything to do with it? The US is threatening to blow them off the map basically. If they admit the US was a reason, that admits that they succumbed to intimidation/threats. They want to be seen as a nuclear powerhouse. Someone to be taken seriously, ect. Admitting the US in any way threatened them to denuke, would take that away. 



irstupid said:
SpokenTruth said:

NK says Trump is not responsible for denuclearization talk and could be making things worse.

North Korea: US pressure not behind denuclearization

North Korea: Trump ruining good mood ahead of summit

 

Like I was trying to say before.  Trump is a threat to them, not the catalyst.  China and SK deserve the credit for the talks.

And South Korea says President Trump deserves Nobel Peace Prize.

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-northkorea-southkorea-trump/south-korea-president-says-trump-deserves-nobel-peace-prize-idUSKBN1I10OD

I find it funny the amount of people who hate Trump so much that they start believing the news from North Korea and Russia. The two biggest propaganda/indoctrination news in the entire world.

Do you really expect NK to ever admit US had anything to do with it? The US is threatening to blow them off the map basically. If they admit the US was a reason, that admits that they succumbed to intimidation/threats. They want to be seen as a nuclear powerhouse. Someone to be taken seriously, ect. Admitting the US in any way threatened them to denuke, would take that away. 

And do you believe Trump would stay involved if SK said he had nothing to do with it?  You do know that the treaty requires the US president to sign or it can't happen because of the terms of the 1953 armistice?  Trump is being placated and used. 



Massimus - "Trump already has democrat support."

irstupid said:
SpokenTruth said:

NK says Trump is not responsible for denuclearization talk and could be making things worse.

North Korea: US pressure not behind denuclearization

North Korea: Trump ruining good mood ahead of summit

 

Like I was trying to say before.  Trump is a threat to them, not the catalyst.  China and SK deserve the credit for the talks.

And South Korea says President Trump deserves Nobel Peace Prize.

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-northkorea-southkorea-trump/south-korea-president-says-trump-deserves-nobel-peace-prize-idUSKBN1I10OD

I find it funny the amount of people who hate Trump so much that they start believing the news from North Korea and Russia. The two biggest propaganda/indoctrination news in the entire world.

Do you really expect NK to ever admit US had anything to do with it? The US is threatening to blow them off the map basically. If they admit the US was a reason, that admits that they succumbed to intimidation/threats. They want to be seen as a nuclear powerhouse. Someone to be taken seriously, ect. Admitting the US in any way threatened them to denuke, would take that away. 

Its really not that people hate Trump, its the fact that people do not Trust Trump.  It's very hard to trust someone word when their word means nothing.  We have plenty of evidence of Trump taking credit for something which he had nothing to do with said situation.  We have plenty of evidence of Trump bluster but no bite.  Hell, we see the same situation with China Tariffs where he goes in with threats believing that this will get people to the table but instead they just hit back and easily wait him out.  He tried this with Nafta, he tried this with NK and he has tried this with China.  Each situation, everyone has seen through his plan and just believe they can either go elsewhere, hit back like China or just ignore him believe his Presidency is at best 2 more years.

I personally have no problem giving Trump credit if he did in fact get things to come to this point.  The key point here is that nothing has actually been decided and from NK statements it seems the White House is saying one thing and NK another.  Anytime you have disagreement like this, do not expect the outcome to be totally one way or the other.  If anything, it appears China is running this show and how they dictate the terms will be what goes down.