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Forums - Gaming Discussion - 4 games found to be violating Dutch gambling laws, publishers will have 8 weeks to adjust their games or risk getting fined or having the sale of their game banned

irstupid said:
Conejo said:
As a Dutchman I'm glad this is happening!

Rocket League is a prime example of the loot box problem and why the government should intervene: it's a game accessible to kids that contains straight-up gambling that is only legal for adults. Either Rocket League should be rated M or there shouldn't be loot boxes in an child-friendly game.

For M rated games I have less of an issue - if you a grown man it's your decision to gamble or not, and parents should watch out for their kids playing these games (granted there should be some public announcements about this issue because there are WAY too many parents who don't know about ratings).

Isn't it pure cosmetic loot boxes? Who cares?

As Nintendo said, loot boxes concept is nothing new, just look at cards. Pokémon cards, baseball cards, magic gathering cards, ect. You never know what your gonna get buying them.

Hell, I'd be more upset in regards to the online card games like Pokémon, the WoW card game, elders Scrolls cardgame, ect. Those, you can be complete shit without good cards which you need to for the most part spend money to get at a reasonable at all rate. I would ban those things as gambling way before a cosmetic vehicle skin.

These are fundamentally different as there is no trade system in Rocket League. 

Pokémon is literally a trading card game - the whole system is based around getting random cards and being able to trade them with your friends for ones you like better. 

The crater system in Rocket League replaced normal DLC were you just bought a car and cosmetics you wanted. Now you pay and hope to get what you want - only way to try to get it again is to pay again. That's more nefarious than Pokémon or Magic in my eyes. 



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Conejo said:
irstupid said:

Isn't it pure cosmetic loot boxes? Who cares?

As Nintendo said, loot boxes concept is nothing new, just look at cards. Pokémon cards, baseball cards, magic gathering cards, ect. You never know what your gonna get buying them.

Hell, I'd be more upset in regards to the online card games like Pokémon, the WoW card game, elders Scrolls cardgame, ect. Those, you can be complete shit without good cards which you need to for the most part spend money to get at a reasonable at all rate. I would ban those things as gambling way before a cosmetic vehicle skin.

These are fundamentally different as there is no trade system in Rocket League. 

Pokémon is literally a trading card game - the whole system is based around getting random cards and being able to trade them with your friends for ones you like better. 

The crater system in Rocket League replaced normal DLC were you just bought a car and cosmetics you wanted. Now you pay and hope to get what you want - only way to try to get it again is to pay again. That's more nefarious than Pokémon or Magic in my eyes. 

Again, pure cosmetics versus actual gameplay items.

I would say gameplay items/cards is more nefarious. Think of Pokémon again. I could get a Charizard card easy enough. Little more luck involved to get a reverse holo of the same card. Super insane luck to get a holocard, or possibly even the full art version. Again the card plays EXACTLY the same in all scenerios. Same stats, just looks different. If they made the base Charizard card a 1 in a million chance, then it's BS, but if they make that super easy to get and the others each incrementally harder to get then its fine.  For gameplay reasons, you are not gimped at all.

And then again to card games online, such as WoW's card game. Strange I can never remember its name. Can you trade in that? I don' think so. You can't trade in Yu-go-oh's card game online. So again to get a better deck to not suck you need to rely on loot crates. Rocket leage on the other hand, you are not gimped at all whether you have 10,000 hours on your save and 1,000's of dollars spend or you just installed the game seconds ago and not spent a dime on it. You could still go in and kick that person ass who spent thousands of dollars on cosmetics. You can't do the same in card games.

(I havne' tplayed rocket league, so there may be some rpg elements that raise your cars effectiveness for all I know. I'm under impression game is just purely same identical cars under the hood that all just look different.)

Or take a game like League of Legends. That game has many unlockable characters, but they are all supposed to be balanced, so whether or not you have someone unlocked or not should not make you uncompetitive. But again card games like Wow, pokemon, yugioh, ect you need good cards to even stand a chance. No starter deck will last a second against a good deck even if that person has the worst draw luck in the universe.



irstupid said:

Again, pure cosmetics versus actual gameplay items.

I would say gameplay items/cards is more nefarious. Think of Pokémon again. I could get a Charizard card easy enough. Little more luck involved to get a reverse holo of the same card. Super insane luck to get a holocard, or possibly even the full art version. Again the card plays EXACTLY the same in all scenerios. Same stats, just looks different. If they made the base Charizard card a 1 in a million chance, then it's BS, but if they make that super easy to get and the others each incrementally harder to get then its fine.  For gameplay reasons, you are not gimped at all.

And then again to card games online, such as WoW's card game. Strange I can never remember its name. Can you trade in that? I don' think so. You can't trade in Yu-go-oh's card game online. So again to get a better deck to not suck you need to rely on loot crates. Rocket leage on the other hand, you are not gimped at all whether you have 10,000 hours on your save and 1,000's of dollars spend or you just installed the game seconds ago and not spent a dime on it. You could still go in and kick that person ass who spent thousands of dollars on cosmetics. You can't do the same in card games.

(I havne' tplayed rocket league, so there may be some rpg elements that raise your cars effectiveness for all I know. I'm under impression game is just purely same identical cars under the hood that all just look different.)

Or take a game like League of Legends. That game has many unlockable characters, but they are all supposed to be balanced, so whether or not you have someone unlocked or not should not make you uncompetitive. But again card games like Wow, pokemon, yugioh, ect you need good cards to even stand a chance. No starter deck will last a second against a good deck even if that person has the worst draw luck in the universe.

I'm gonna agree with you on the online game cards. That sounds more nefarious, yes. I've never played them and I certainly don't intend to. I'm not sure how they work though. I've played Magic: The Gathering on PC and I vaguely remember being able to trade. At the very least with real-life trading card games, the whole point of the game is to randomly get cards and trade them. It's not intrinsically about gambling (honestly that just came out of competitive play) like the crate system in the games identified by Dutch law. 

I'm not saying Rocket League is broken; by no means. You can still play the game without paying for crates without gameplay hurdles (I've never bought crates). What I'm saying is that it has elements of gambling that have no business doing there. It has nothing to do with gameplay, is not an integral part of the game, or anything. It's purely to make cash from people. 

We need to look up how many kids pay up to these systems and just get addicted 'cause the little twerps have no self-control. We already have stories of that happening with mobile games and them spending thousands from their parent's credit cards when unaccompanied. I don't like it in Rocket League especially because it's a rated E game; and the fact that it was singled out among these four games does mean something. 

P.S. I don't like the loot boxes in LoL either; but at least the base game is free. It's easier to rationalize. 



Immersiveunreality said:

Are you an ANTIFA member perhaps?

Nope.  I'm a hardcore libertarian. 



CSGO trading has been re-enabled in the Netherlands, however players from the Netherlands and Belgium will no longer be able to open containers in CSGO http://blog.counter-strike.net/index.php/2018/07/20618/