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Forums - Microsoft Discussion - Halo Infinite won't be having an XP progression system!?

It was one thing to have a 3 month delay on co-op campaign and 6 month delay on Forge since that's mainly 5% at most of the overall community and a small delay really isn't that big of a deal. Especially with Forge since that's more of a tool for the longevity of the game. I was giving 343 the benefit of a doubt based on 1) this is the first open world, non-linear Halo campaign compared to the much shorter, very linear campaigns of the past, so there are surely a lot of technical hurdles to iron out and 343 wanted it to be polished and ready and 2) we don't know the extent the pandemic has had on development the past year and a half. The gaming industry in general has been setback and who knows, co-op campaign and forge could've been there at launch if it wasn't for the pandemic. 

BUT THIS?! 

You will not get XP for completing matches in Halo Infinite multiplayer. The only way to progress your battle pass is through challenges. And this is a system that is going to be monetized through "challenge swaps." A system that is completely the opposite over the progression system they implemented in Halo: MCC, which itself was inspired by Halo: Reach and has been highly commended by the community. A lack of any progression system outside of the challenges will not keep players motivated to keep playing and it directly incentivizes players to purchase those challenge swaps because players will want to progress faster.

So either be a god or pay up to progress! Not being rewarded for gameplay performance or activity completion will not keep players long-term. This is something that is deeply concerning as this isn't a technical hurdle or can blame the pandemic on a setback. This was a design choice. And with the "no per-match XP at launch" statement, they can come out in like Season 3 with XP progression and actually market XP gains per match as a new thing as if it's not in literally every single FPS game. 

Imagine the daily challenge is to get a certain number of sniper kills and that one god tier player keeps getting the sniper. You'll either quit the match or just play out the match and make no progress whatsoever. No long term XP system will just not fly. It'll be a detriment to matchmaking. It's just creates the narrative that the battle pass IS the only progression system within Infinite. 343 is really shooting themselves in the foot over and over again with blatantly obvious missteps. 

Last edited by gtotheunit91 - on 27 August 2021

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Yes I agree it is very odd. I don't think it's a matter of resources. They could certainly implement an XP system if they wanted to. The fact they have chosen not to may raise a few red flags. Especially since in the test flight they had "Kill +100" and other points-based notifications. Do they want you to care about this stuff, or not? Are they trying to rinse you for microtransactions?

I don't think this is any more "pay to progress" than shortcuts or XP boosts in other games. The legitimate concern though is that if you don't wanna pay to swap, and you get a dud challenge that you're not good enough to achieve, that's gonna hang around for your day's gaming session. Get three duds and all of a sudden there's no headline way to progress that day. I think it's unlikely for sure (the challenges in the flight were quite trivial to do). But if and when that situation obtains, you're not gonna be happy, and you're not gonna play Halo.

It's worth also recognising that unlike with Reach, which tied armour unlocks to XP ranks, Infinite is tying up unlocks with Seasons/Battlepasses. A ranking system (if implemented) would be quite hollow, with nothing to reward you with.

I fully expect there to be ranked playlists which display and matchmake according to a skill rank. And of course I hope there is a way to display how many medals (eg. how many overkills) you've managed to get. I do like the Battlepass system they're going for. The way its structured seems to me to be best-in-class for free to play games, with no quicksale tactics or "gone for good" threats. In my mind, the challenge system is also a great tool to encourage players to try playing different modes. My support for its is obviously predicated on there also being a skill based rank in ranked playlists.



If this game flops, I really hope they fire 343. MCC, Halo 5 and possibly Halo Infinite? Time to give the franchise to a new studio that can actually handle a flagship.



             

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In MCC is there even a point for ranking up? I just get my season points and dip, so this kinda sounds similar if I’m not mistaken. Tbh the co op and to a lesser extent forge being missing at launch are far bigger hang ups for me but still this change seems odd as hell. Weren’t they supposed to have some double xp promo last year with monster or Mountain Dew?



Having played the beta, it seems like some of the challenges are just for doing matches, so you will still be doing alot of progression from matches, but you can get even more XP from other challenges.



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Captain_Yuri said:

If this game flops, I really hope they fire 343. MCC, Halo 5 and possibly Halo Infinite? Time to give the franchise to a new studio that can actually handle a flagship.

They also did Halo 4 which is easily the worst game in the franchise. 



FormerlyTeamSilent13 said:
Captain_Yuri said:

If this game flops, I really hope they fire 343. MCC, Halo 5 and possibly Halo Infinite? Time to give the franchise to a new studio that can actually handle a flagship.

They also did Halo 4 which is easily the worst game in the franchise. 

4 had a better campaign than 5, way better. Multiplayer on 4 was meh though.



shikamaru317 said:
FormerlyTeamSilent13 said:

They also did Halo 4 which is easily the worst game in the franchise. 

4 had a better campaign than 5, way better. Multiplayer on 4 was meh though.

Both were awful coming from Bungie's games and the books. I did not really like Reach's story either, but it had great level design unlike Halo 4. Halo 4 is by far the worst Halo game because at least Halo 5's multiplayer was somewhat fun (although did not feel like Halo) while I think both campaigns are flawed. Warzone in particular was better than anything new Halo 4 tried. I was one of the top 50 players in Halo 4's multiplayer on halo charts and beat legendary solo blind with only 16 deaths (probably every death was to a promethean knight). It may seem strange to criticize a game you are good at, but I have done that among other games as well. The campaign wasn't challenging, the story was full of plotholes, and it sucked. I want Bungie's atmosphere of hope and actual consequences for humanity. I almost prefer Halo 5 just because I think Halo 4 is what led to Halo 5 and at least the giant Guardians were interesting. I maintain Halo 4 was the worst AAA game I ever purchased not just worst Halo game.

Last edited by FormerlyTeamSilent13 - on 28 August 2021

FormerlyTeamSilent13 said:
Captain_Yuri said:

If this game flops, I really hope they fire 343. MCC, Halo 5 and possibly Halo Infinite? Time to give the franchise to a new studio that can actually handle a flagship.

They also did Halo 4 which is easily the worst game in the franchise. 

I did a play through of all the Halo games not long ago and Halo 4 was probably my favorite campaign. The level design, pacing, and gameplay with the bad ass enemies made for an awesome game. Then they followed that with Halo 5… yuck.



Captain_Yuri said:

If this game flops, I really hope they fire 343. MCC, Halo 5 and possibly Halo Infinite? Time to give the franchise to a new studio that can actually handle a flagship.

Definitely my personal least favorite studio of all time, even if they've fixed most of MCC by now. The level of incompetence reaches to a point where I actively get annoyed at what used to be my favorite gaming franchise. There's definitely other franchises that have fallen out of my favor, but mostly because of stagnation/a lack of interest on my part. Halo just kept getting worse and while Infinite will almost assuredly be better than 5 I don't know if it will be "great" either at launch at this rate.