Forums - Sony Discussion - PS5 GDC Reveal and PS5 specs/performance Digital Foundry Video analysis : 3.5 Ghz 8 core Zen 2 CPU along with 10.3 TF RDNA 2 RT capable and 16GB GDDR6 RAM and also super crazy fast 5.5 GB/Second S

How do you feel

My brain become bigger su... 19 30.16%
 
I am wet 4 6.35%
 
What did he talked about??? 5 7.94%
 
I want some more info 6 9.52%
 
Total:34
Intrinsic said:
Chrkeller said:

By running out of storage space almost immediately after launch?

Yeah, if the PS5 runs outta space at 7 games... the XSX would run out at 8...

And considering tie ratio is 10-12 for a whole gen, it would take over 3 years for most users to need to delete their old games to install new ones.

duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

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Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

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Intrinsic said:
Chrkeller said:

By running out of storage space almost immediately after launch?

Yeah, if the PS5 runs outta space at 7 games... the XSX would run out at 8...

Yep, which concerns me greatly.  Especially given online play isn't free.  These super fancy fast drives sound great, but could jack the cost of the console, including what will likely be required upgrades.  It wouldn't take me more than a few months to run out of space.  I'm not liking what I see next generation.  Storage space is going to be a problem.    



Intrinsic said:
EricHiggin said:

I wonder if there's an Intrinsic type user on a healthcare/medical site who had the same level of foresight? If only more people listened to both.

Lol... to be fir the Power prediction was easy. All I had to do was double the power of the PS4pro/XB1X.My guess was that they would just jump to being 80CU parking APUs, but somewhere below that but benefit from running at higher clocks. My SSD talk though had some saying I was crazy and unrealistic.

Or do what many did back when PS4 launched - 1.84TFLOPS x8 for about the same jump from 7th to 8th gen, not counting architectural improvements.

Sad thing is, XSX and PS5 achieve this only after taking architectural imrpovements into account, and all that while having to handle 1.78x more pixels, if devs are crazy enough to chase 4K native.



Chrkeller said:
Intrinsic said:

Yeah, if the PS5 runs outta space at 7 games... the XSX would run out at 8...

Yep, which concerns me greatly.  Especially given online play isn't free.  These super fancy fast drives sound great, but could jack the cost of the console, including what will likely be required upgrades.  It wouldn't take me more than a few months to run out of space.  I'm not liking what I see next generation.  Storage space is going to be a problem.    

I really don't see what the issue is; I expect these consoles to be able to have at least 8 games installed to their internal drives. Not every games a 100GB+ game. 

But more so, even if given the option to buy some sort of compatible SSD expansion drive... I wouldn't. I find that to be a waste of money. Why should I spend $100+ on some sort of compatible 1TB drive (be it XSX proprietary drive or a 7GB/s NVMe off the shelf drive), when I can buy this 2TB drive for $65 or this 4TB drive for $94 

I mean yes, I would've to be doing some house management, but copying to ad from an external drive is a lot faster than redownloading data or reinstalling from the bluray drive.

I would probably only need to moe things to the external drive like 2- 3 ties a year anyways. And I am likely to go for the 4TB drive because that at least allows me to have a good amount of selected PS4 titles from my current library on there and it least with that games I can play them off the external drive.



HoloDust said:
Intrinsic said:

Lol... to be fir the Power prediction was easy. All I had to do was double the power of the PS4pro/XB1X.My guess was that they would just jump to being 80CU parking APUs, but somewhere below that but benefit from running at higher clocks. My SSD talk though had some saying I was crazy and unrealistic.

Or do what many did back when PS4 launched - 1.84TFLOPS x8 for about the same jump from 7th to 8th gen, not counting architectural improvements.

Sad thing is, XSX and PS5 achieve this only after taking architectural imrpovements into account, and all that while having to handle 1.78x more pixels, if devs are crazy enough to chase 4K native.

The issue is that there is a lot of generalization going around and people don't really take what these machines actually do need into consideration. Lets paint a cerian picture.

Ihave edited my originalpost to give a more accurate depiction of what really happens.

PS4 running game at 1080p@30fps. 33ms render time with its 1.8TF. Going by steps.

  1. CPU pre-renders the frame and has 33ms to do this. Then passes the results to the GPU.
  2. The GPU then uses those results and completes the frame. It to has to do this in under 33ms. While the GPU is working the CPU is pre-rendering the nxt frame.
  3. Rinse and repeat.

Now not everything scales with resolution. But for certain is that if you double the rez, and this gets a little tricky. Say you want to g from 2Mpx (1080P) to 4M px.

  • CPU workload increases by ~20%. GPU workload increases by 100%. You are trying to render exactly twice the pixels.
  • Now you need a slightly faster CPU and at least 3.6TF GPU. Or ain't so much faster CPU and maybe like a 4TF GPU. So while the CPU is taking more time do its work, the more powerful GPU is doing its own in less time.

Now you want to bump up to 8M px(native 4k). You need another 30% bump to your CPU and another 100% bump to your GPU bringing your GPU TF to around 7.2TF.

But he CPU and GPU in the PS5/XSX is significantly more powerful (or efficient) that whats in the PS4. The CPU is like at least 400% better, and the GPU TF is at least 65$ better.

So the PS5/XSX would need around 3TF to render that same game at native 4K@30fps and around 6TF to do it at 60fps.

Last edited by Intrinsic - on 25 March 2020

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The storage space is not ideal but its also super trivial.

How many games do you guys play at a time, 10? Especially when you take into account the the biggest games are normally single player campaigns, I think its fine. Games like COD have yearly replacements, and games like Read Dead Redemption come around once every 5 years. Plenty of games are also tiny, the average size of a game this gen is way closer to 40GB then it is to 100GB. Next gen I think we will see sizes vary drastically & the average being around 80GB and the max being 200GB in extremely rare blockbuster instances.

Either way it will not be a problem, just as 500GB was not a problem this gen.



Intrinsic said:
Chrkeller said:

Yep, which concerns me greatly.  Especially given online play isn't free.  These super fancy fast drives sound great, but could jack the cost of the console, including what will likely be required upgrades.  It wouldn't take me more than a few months to run out of space.  I'm not liking what I see next generation.  Storage space is going to be a problem.    

I really don't see what the issue is; I expect these consoles to be able to have at least 8 games installed to their internal drives. Not every games a 100GB+ game. 

But more so, even if given the option to buy some sort of compatible SSD expansion drive... I wouldn't. I find that to be a waste of money. Why should I spend $100+ on some sort of compatible 1TB drive (be it XSX proprietary drive or a 7GB/s NVMe off the shelf drive), when I can buy this 2TB drive for $65 or this 4TB drive for $94 

I mean yes, I would've to be doing some house management, but copying to ad from an external drive is a lot faster than redownloading data or reinstalling from the bluray drive.

I would probably only need to moe things to the external drive like 2- 3 ties a year anyways. And I am likely to go for the 4TB drive because that at least allows me to have a good amount of selected PS4 titles from my current library on there and it least with that games I can play them off the external drive.

It all depends on how it works.  If I can load up an external HDD with game, leave the internal storage empty, have games automatically transfer to the uber fast SSD drive while I play, this would be great.  But if I constantly have to install/delete this is a problem and makes me consider PC.  Especially since I have kids who will want a certain number of games installed pretty much at all times.  Storage could be a major issue with consoles.  Not sure I like what I am seeing.  I would be curious how well games run from an external standard HDD.  



HoloDust said:
Intrinsic said:

Lol... to be fir the Power prediction was easy. All I had to do was double the power of the PS4pro/XB1X.My guess was that they would just jump to being 80CU parking APUs, but somewhere below that but benefit from running at higher clocks. My SSD talk though had some saying I was crazy and unrealistic.

Or do what many did back when PS4 launched - 1.84TFLOPS x8 for about the same jump from 7th to 8th gen, not counting architectural improvements.

Sad thing is, XSX and PS5 achieve this only after taking architectural imrpovements into account, and all that while having to handle 1.78x more pixels, if devs are crazy enough to chase 4K native.

Do you really doubt that? .



Please excuse my bad English.

Currently gaming on a PC with an i5-4670k@stock (for now), 16Gb RAM 1600 MHz and a GTX 1070

Steam / Live / NNID : jonxiquet    Add me if you want, but I'm a single player gamer.

Intrinsic said:
HoloDust said:

Or do what many did back when PS4 launched - 1.84TFLOPS x8 for about the same jump from 7th to 8th gen, not counting architectural improvements.

Sad thing is, XSX and PS5 achieve this only after taking architectural imrpovements into account, and all that while having to handle 1.78x more pixels, if devs are crazy enough to chase 4K native.

The issue is that there is a lot of generalization going around and people don't really take what these machines actually do need into consideration. Lets paint a cerian picture.

Ihave edited my originalpost to give a more accurate depiction of what really happens.

PS4 running game at 1080p@30fps. 33ms render time with its 1.8TF. Going by steps.

  1. CPU pre-renders the frame and has 33ms to do this. Then passes the results to the GPU.
  2. The GPU then uses those results and completes the frame. It to has to do this in under 33ms. While the GPU is working the CPU is pre-rendering the nxt frame.
  3. Rinse and repeat.

Now not everything scales with resolution. But for certain is that if you double the rez, and this gets a little tricky. Say you want to g from 2Mpx (1080P) to 4M px.

  • CPU workload increases by ~20%. GPU workload increases by 100%. You are trying to render exactly twice the pixels.
  • Now you need a slightly faster CPU and at least 3.6TF GPU. Or ain't so much faster CPU and maybe like a 4TF GPU. So while the CPU is taking more time do its work, the more powerful GPU is doing its own in less time.

Now you want to bump up to 8M px(native 4k). You need another 30% bump to your CPU and another 100% bump to your GPU bringing your GPU TF to around 7.2TF.

But he CPU and GPU in the PS5/XSX is significantly more powerful (or efficient) that whats in the PS4. The CPU is like at least 400% better, and the GPU TF is at least 65$ better.

So the PS5/XSX would need around 3TF to render that same game at native 4K@30fps and around 6TF to do it at 60fps.

Generally speaking, scaling from 1080 to 4K in RL tests goes anything between 2x and 3x, depending on game and architecture.

In 7th to 8th gen ther was greater jump in GPU processing power (reffering to PS4 here), with less resolution penalty...yet still, only 720p to 1080p, with mostly 30fps.

JEMC said:
HoloDust said:

Or do what many did back when PS4 launched - 1.84TFLOPS x8 for about the same jump from 7th to 8th gen, not counting architectural improvements.

Sad thing is, XSX and PS5 achieve this only after taking architectural imrpovements into account, and all that while having to handle 1.78x more pixels, if devs are crazy enough to chase 4K native.

Do you really doubt that? .

Oh, they'll feel obliged to do it at first, it's new gen with lot of buzz words. Eventually, like in previous gens, they will push better visuals and sacrifice resolution.



Can't wait to see PS5 in action with its exclusive and optimized games.
I'm sure, given the hardware specs, games will be absolutely impressive! :)