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Forums - Microsoft Discussion - Teraflops are NOT a Measurement of Gaming Performance

Mr Puggsly on 09 March 2020
last92 said:
Mr Puggsly said:

You should have just said that.

It's evident there was a lot of discussion about Xbox being weaker and it was mostly discussed on the web.

But now that Xbox seemingly has more powerful devices, I'm glad we realized it doesn't really matter.

Well...power wasn't what caused the xbox one to be mocked by all the internet though.

Tv, sports, 100$ price difference, kinect, always online and fee on used games did much more damage to the xbox brand. And then, of course, there was the power difference on top of all that.

Most of that was addressed by launch, I don't think Kinect was even required but still bundled at launch and removed months later.

What didn't change was discussion about the GPU disparity. Either way, I just think its funny the OP cherry picked X1X as where teraflop numbers became a topic. Obviously it started years before with the 8th gen specs.



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last92 on 09 March 2020
Mr Puggsly said:

Most of that was addressed by launch, I don't think Kinect was even required but still bundled at launch and removed months later.

What didn't change was discussion about the GPU disparity. Either way, I just think its funny the OP cherry picked X1X as where teraflop numbers became a topic. Obviously it started years before with the 8th gen specs.

Well, the price difference was the biggest problem, and that stayed for a few months if I remember correctly.

I agree though that power stayed a relevant topic for a long time. But I still think that wasn't the biggest factor that led to PS dominating the whole gen. That's something only people on the web care about. It's still true, however, that MS has been focusing on power and tflops much more than Sony in the last few years. Looking at PS exlcusives for 2020 and how good they look vs what xbox one x is getting...well, I can't help but wonder if all this focus on tflops really means anything. And looking at xbox one x sales, I really thing that power is one of the least important characteristics, provided the gap is not too big.



Mr Puggsly on 09 March 2020
last92 said:
Mr Puggsly said:

Most of that was addressed by launch, I don't think Kinect was even required but still bundled at launch and removed months later.

What didn't change was discussion about the GPU disparity. Either way, I just think its funny the OP cherry picked X1X as where teraflop numbers became a topic. Obviously it started years before with the 8th gen specs.

Well, the price difference was the biggest problem, and that stayed for a few months if I remember correctly.

I agree though that power stayed a relevant topic for a long time. But I still think that wasn't the biggest factor that led to PS dominating the whole gen. That's something only people on the web care about. It's still true, however, that MS has been focusing on power and tflops much more than Sony in the last few years. Looking at PS exlcusives for 2020 and how good they look vs what xbox one x is getting...well, I can't help but wonder if all this focus on tflops really means anything. And looking at xbox one x sales, I really thing that power is one of the least important characteristics, provided the gap is not too big.

You're turning this into a bigger console war debate than I am looking for. I will not entertain that, countless other threads have been dedicated or derailed for that.

Just pointing out the OP cherry picked X1X's 6TF, when it really started around 2013 and it was for PS4 boasting. Most know this as reality.

MS has put a focus both on price and power. Hence, X1SAD and X1X. Now we seemingly will get Series S and Series X.



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ArchangelMadzz on 09 March 2020
Mr Puggsly said:
last92 said:

Well, the price difference was the biggest problem, and that stayed for a few months if I remember correctly.

I agree though that power stayed a relevant topic for a long time. But I still think that wasn't the biggest factor that led to PS dominating the whole gen. That's something only people on the web care about. It's still true, however, that MS has been focusing on power and tflops much more than Sony in the last few years. Looking at PS exlcusives for 2020 and how good they look vs what xbox one x is getting...well, I can't help but wonder if all this focus on tflops really means anything. And looking at xbox one x sales, I really thing that power is one of the least important characteristics, provided the gap is not too big.

You're turning this into a bigger console war debate than I am looking for. I will not entertain that, countless other threads have been dedicated or derailed for that.

Just pointing out the OP cherry picked X1X's 6TF, when it really started around 2013 and it was for PS4 boasting. Most know this as reality.

MS has put a focus both on price and power. Hence, X1SAD and X1X. Now we seemingly will get Series S and Series X.

Sony never pushed it's 1.84Teraflops. It wasn't in major marketing promotion. And if it was it was minor, I don't recall every seeing it mentioned in any press conference but I'm going to give you the benefit of the doubt, or you can just link me marketing material they released talking about their Teraflop performance in either their announcements or trailers.

The first time we saw teraflops being used as a focal point of marketing is with the Xbox One X. That's simply fact. It's literally the first spec they listed in their official announcement at E3. It's also in their product page on the official website https://www.xbox.com/en-GB/consoles/xbox-one-x.


It's very clear that teraflops has never been a major point of marketing as I mentioned in the OP since the Xbox One X announcement.



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sales2099 on 09 March 2020

MS wouldn’t be advertising the TFlops if every, and I mean every multiplat Xbox One and PS4 title wasn’t compared for resolution differences in the early years of the gen.

MS telling us what we all want to hear, despite some fan groups changing the narratives to save face. Not saying Xbox fans aren’t guilty of this, but in terms of system power we have been pretty transparent about our wants as a community.



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ArchangelMadzz on 09 March 2020
sales2099 said:
MS wouldn’t be advertising the TFlops if every, and I mean every multiplat Xbox One and PS4 title wasn’t compared for resolution differences in the early years of the gen.

MS telling us what we all want to hear, despite some fan groups changing the narratives to save face. Not saying Xbox fans aren’t guilty of this, but in terms of system power we have been pretty transparent about our wants as a community.

The resolution differences and frame rates of this new gen is going to be compared regardless of Teraflop PR. 



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sales2099 on 09 March 2020
ArchangelMadzz said:
sales2099 said:
MS wouldn’t be advertising the TFlops if every, and I mean every multiplat Xbox One and PS4 title wasn’t compared for resolution differences in the early years of the gen.

MS telling us what we all want to hear, despite some fan groups changing the narratives to save face. Not saying Xbox fans aren’t guilty of this, but in terms of system power we have been pretty transparent about our wants as a community.

The resolution differences and frame rates of this new gen is going to be compared regardless of Teraflop PR. 

Right, but at least MS wants to be on the right side of the comparisons this time. Their whole PR campaign is reactionary in nature. 



Xbox: Best hardware, Game Pass best value, best BC, more 1st party genres and multiplayer titles. 

 

derpysquirtle64 on 09 March 2020
last92 said:
Mr Puggsly said:

Most of that was addressed by launch, I don't think Kinect was even required but still bundled at launch and removed months later.

What didn't change was discussion about the GPU disparity. Either way, I just think its funny the OP cherry picked X1X as where teraflop numbers became a topic. Obviously it started years before with the 8th gen specs.

Well, the price difference was the biggest problem, and that stayed for a few months if I remember correctly.

I agree though that power stayed a relevant topic for a long time. But I still think that wasn't the biggest factor that led to PS dominating the whole gen. That's something only people on the web care about. It's still true, however, that MS has been focusing on power and tflops much more than Sony in the last few years. Looking at PS exlcusives for 2020 and how good they look vs what xbox one x is getting...well, I can't help but wonder if all this focus on tflops really means anything. And looking at xbox one x sales, I really thing that power is one of the least important characteristics, provided the gap is not too big.

Price difference was the biggest problem because it stayed this way for almost whole year, not a couple of months. Microsoft reaction was way too slow. And I'm also not talking about another big issue which is console availability. Xbox One was only available in less than 20 countries at launch if I'm not mistaken while PS4 was selling almost everywhere. It took a year for MS to catch up with Sony in terms of console availability on the market and the general public already bought PS4 by that time.



 

DonFerrari on 09 March 2020
Mr Puggsly said:
DonFerrari said:

Yes there were discussion in 2013.

You should have just said that.

It's evident there was a lot of discussion about Xbox being weaker and it was mostly discussed on the web.

But now that Xbox seemingly has more powerful devices, I'm glad we realized it doesn't really matter.

Why should I omit context?

MS was the one discussing Tflop heavily at the time, as sure were generic people on the internet. Trying to put it at the fault of generic people while ignoring the great sponsor, the same sponsor for the "most powerful console ever", isn't very good.



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."

DonFerrari on 09 March 2020
Mr Puggsly said:
last92 said:

Well...power wasn't what caused the xbox one to be mocked by all the internet though.

Tv, sports, 100$ price difference, kinect, always online and fee on used games did much more damage to the xbox brand. And then, of course, there was the power difference on top of all that.

Most of that was addressed by launch, I don't think Kinect was even required but still bundled at launch and removed months later.

What didn't change was discussion about the GPU disparity. Either way, I just think its funny the OP cherry picked X1X as where teraflop numbers became a topic. Obviously it started years before with the 8th gen specs.

I'll remember that when you try to put the PS4 selling over 2:1 X1 due to the launch problems.



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."