Forums - Gaming Discussion - Difficulty vs Accessibility: A responsibility for the developers, not for the players.

Alcyon said:

Then Dark Souls isn't for you. I don't like racing games, so I don't play racing games. Should they add "more options" and give me a "non-racing option" in their racing game? Or perhaps, I say perhaps, I should not play racine games?

There's way more to souls games than just beating the difficulty. Racing games have many options as well. Only 5% of people owning GT Sport actually play in sport mode. Some just like to collect cars, make liveries and take pictures of cars. You never have to race one bit to have fun, although a bit of driving to get cars speeds things along. So yep, plenty non racing options in GT Sport ;)

I'm glad PD doesn't listen to the die hard sim racers that want everyone locked to cockpit mode, wheel only, no assists and full damage. They do expect you to use a wheel without (most) assists when invited to the top drivers live events which is completely fine. But they do understand that you're not getting a new audience to your games if you expect them to be experts from the get go, and that the average majority keep the lights on and the free content updates going.



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SvennoJ said:
Alcyon said:

Then Dark Souls isn't for you. I don't like racing games, so I don't play racing games. Should they add "more options" and give me a "non-racing option" in their racing game? Or perhaps, I say perhaps, I should not play racine games?

There's way more to souls games than just beating the difficulty. Racing games have many options as well. Only 5% of people owning GT Sport actually play in sport mode. Some just like to collect cars, make liveries and take pictures of cars. You never have to race one bit to have fun, although a bit of driving to get cars speeds things along. So yep, plenty non racing options in GT Sport ;)

I'm glad PD doesn't listen to the die hard sim racers that want everyone locked to cockpit mode, wheel only, no assists and full damage. They do expect you to use a wheel without (most) assists when invited to the top drivers live events which is completely fine. But they do understand that you're not getting a new audience to your games if you expect them to be experts from the get go, and that the average majority keep the lights on and the free content updates going.

And, again, using general arguments to discuss about a few games isn't the best way to get a point. If, out of 20 racing games, A SINGLE ONE is for the die hard sim racers, where is the problem?



I love difficult games, I'm an older gamer, games used to be really hard in early 90's.

With that said, games are algo much longer to finish, so I prefer not that hard but hard enough to be a real challenge, If games become too easy, then there is no reason to play, games are made for challenge, if I just wanted the story I'd read a book or watch a movie.

Some people feel the need for easier games so they could finish all the games, the big issue here is people shouldn't play all games, pick 1 or 2 great games per month and that's it. I don't like sports games so I never buy them, and there hasn't been a good racer on ps4 at all, so that's another genre that I don't have to play. I limit myself to around 20 games per year, so that I can enjoy without rushing, without having to chose it on easy mode.

When I review games I drop a star/point if the game is too easy on the hardest mode. I remember doing this for all the uncharted games for example. The worst offender for me was GT sport, the campaign mode is just far too easy compared to the older ones, I remember GT1 and 2 spending hours to get gold, on GT sport I get gold on the first try, it makes the game boring.



Alcyon said:
SvennoJ said:

There's way more to souls games than just beating the difficulty. Racing games have many options as well. Only 5% of people owning GT Sport actually play in sport mode. Some just like to collect cars, make liveries and take pictures of cars. You never have to race one bit to have fun, although a bit of driving to get cars speeds things along. So yep, plenty non racing options in GT Sport ;)

I'm glad PD doesn't listen to the die hard sim racers that want everyone locked to cockpit mode, wheel only, no assists and full damage. They do expect you to use a wheel without (most) assists when invited to the top drivers live events which is completely fine. But they do understand that you're not getting a new audience to your games if you expect them to be experts from the get go, and that the average majority keep the lights on and the free content updates going.

And, again, using general arguments to discuss about a few games isn't the best way to get a point. If, out of 20 racing games, A SINGLE ONE is for the die hard sim racers, where is the problem?

Can you name 20 current racing games :p

Sim(cade) racing games naturally share the same tracks and cars, so it's totally fine to have iRacing next to Asetto Corsa next to GT Sport. What other games have the same lore, art, level design, atmosphere and story as the souls series? Difficulty is just a small part of what defines the souls series, and imo not the important part.



SvennoJ said:
Alcyon said:

And, again, using general arguments to discuss about a few games isn't the best way to get a point. If, out of 20 racing games, A SINGLE ONE is for the die hard sim racers, where is the problem?

Can you name 20 current racing games :p

Sim(cade) racing games naturally share the same tracks and cars, so it's totally fine to have iRacing next to Asetto Corsa next to GT Sport. What other games have the same lore, art, level design, atmosphere and story as the souls series? Difficulty is just a small part of what defines the souls series, and imo not the important part.

Series/games I remember

Grand Turismo

Forza

Need for Speed

Sega Rally

V Rally

Ridge Racer

Micro Machines

Mario Kart (and clones)

Formula One

WRC

Project Cars

Gear

Dirt

Driveclub

Nascar games (I don't remember any but they exist)

Moto GP games

Burn-out (I think, the game with Takedowns)

For the rest, I need some help

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_driving_and_racing_video_games

And "all racing games are similar duh" isn't a valid answer. Seriously, stop making nonsense.

Last edited by Alcyon - on 20 February 2020

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SvennoJ said:
Alcyon said:

Then Dark Souls isn't for you. I don't like racing games, so I don't play racing games. Should they add "more options" and give me a "non-racing option" in their racing game? Or perhaps, I say perhaps, I should not play racine games?

There's way more to souls games than just beating the difficulty. Racing games have many options as well. Only 5% of people owning GT Sport actually play in sport mode. Some just like to collect cars, make liveries and take pictures of cars. You never have to race one bit to have fun, although a bit of driving to get cars speeds things along. So yep, plenty non racing options in GT Sport ;)

I'm glad PD doesn't listen to the die hard sim racers that want everyone locked to cockpit mode, wheel only, no assists and full damage. They do expect you to use a wheel without (most) assists when invited to the top drivers live events which is completely fine. But they do understand that you're not getting a new audience to your games if you expect them to be experts from the get go, and that the average majority keep the lights on and the free content updates going.

I don't like to race on the multiplayer even though I have wheel and can play with 0 assist fairly good most of time I would play on the controller and some assistance because I can't have my wheel on the room due to children.



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Dying Light devs just implemented a "story mode", years after the game's release, which adds in an easier mode to the game:

Story Mode Details

Decreased damage dealt by zombies by 25%
Increased damage dealt by player by 50-100%
Decreased fall damage by 50%
Normal attacks use 25% less stamina
Charged attacks use 25% less stamina
Medkits are twice as effective
Player loses 50% less experience points upon death
Days are longer by 25%
Nights are shorter by 25%
Traders pay 20% more for player’s items
Player earns 50% less Legend experience
Airdrops remain on the map twice as long

I'm not sure if anyone has been asking for this over the years, but the devs felt some reason to patch it in after 5-6 years down the line. Either way it's a nice addition to those that just want to play the game for the story, and not just and only challenges. 



                                       

Alcyon said:
SvennoJ said:

Can you name 20 current racing games :p

Sim(cade) racing games naturally share the same tracks and cars, so it's totally fine to have iRacing next to Asetto Corsa next to GT Sport. What other games have the same lore, art, level design, atmosphere and story as the souls series? Difficulty is just a small part of what defines the souls series, and imo not the important part.

Series/games I remember

Grand Turismo

Forza

Need for Speed

Sega Rally

V Rally

Ridge Racer

Micro Machines

Mario Kart (and clones)

Formula One

WRC

Project Cars

Gear

Dirt

Driveclub

Nascar games (I don't remember any but they exist)

Moto GP games

Burn-out (I think, the game with Takedowns)

For the rest, I need some help

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_driving_and_racing_video_games

And "all racing games are similar duh" isn't a valid answer. Seriously, stop making nonsense.

Sorry, thought we were talking about sim racers.



SvennoJ said:
Alcyon said:

Series/games I remember

Grand Turismo

Forza

Need for Speed

Sega Rally

V Rally

Ridge Racer

Micro Machines

Mario Kart (and clones)

Formula One

WRC

Project Cars

Gear

Dirt

Driveclub

Nascar games (I don't remember any but they exist)

Moto GP games

Burn-out (I think, the game with Takedowns)

For the rest, I need some help

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_driving_and_racing_video_games

And "all racing games are similar duh" isn't a valid answer. Seriously, stop making nonsense.

Sorry, thought we were talking about sim racers.

And that are still releasing =p

Plus it is funny that he mocks not all racing being similar, because no one said that, even though he grouped games that aren't really on the same genre.



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

DonFerrari said:

And that are still releasing =p

Plus it is funny that he mocks not all racing being similar, because no one said that, even though he grouped games that aren't really on the same genre.

Yeah, iRacing and Micro machines are as far removed from each other as Dark souls and Fat princess. You walk around in both carrying a sword, same thing! Don't like the difficulty in one, play the other :)

Anyway, atm I wouldn't mind having an arcade mode in Dirt Rally 2 with rewind feature. Even without hardcore damage on I still somehow get stuck in the scenery and get terminal damage forcing retirement from the championship. Realistic maybe, fun no. At least you have 5 restarts or you can simply restart the game when you're out of restarts (it doesn't save until you click continue). There's not much choice on the rally side of racing and I blame the move to more time consuming strict career nonsense for that. Dirt went the wrong way by neglecting rally for rally cross and focusing too much on silly festival nonsense. Dirt rally goes too far the other way with so called realism restricting the user base. WRC seems to sit in the middle but has been low quality for ages with crap handling. I haven't tried WRC 8 yet though, maybe it has improved. The last one I played was either 6 or 7, disliked it so much I traded it in.