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Forums - Politics Discussion - Climate change is inconsequential (because Peak Oil is a bigger issue)

...in the bigger picture of whats going to kill us.

Forget about the financial crisis and the uncertain economic market. 

There is a bigger problem on the horizon its called Peak Oil.

In short a slowdown in the supply of oil production and the depopulation of the world's population will follow shortly after. 

1kJ of Food Production requires 8kJ of energy to produce.

Most of the energy is given off as heat in the production of food.

Source of most energy is oil. No real alternative to oil. Oil prices are rising because the oil supply has reached its peak.

A slowdown due to less oil in the food production will starve the population and the food prices will go up even further. 

The starvation and freezing of the population will occur eventually and over time the population will go down and those left behind will end up in ww3 over the remaing foodsupplies.

Do you see this scenario happening?



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kirby007 said:

<SNIP>

Do you see this scenario happening?

No.



--::{PC Gaming Master Race}::--

It's inconsequential, because by the time it's getting really, really serious, our generation will likely be dead already. Therefore it's of no concern to us.



Legend11 correctly predicted that GTA IV (360+PS3) would outsell SSBB. I was wrong.

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Peak oil was already supposed to have happened.
Nuclear and tar sands can sustain us for a while.
When the costs of cheap oil go up, nuclear fusion will get more funding.
We can always re-open the coal mines!



As an expert on Fallout survival tactics I have nothing to worry about, as long as there is a steady spawn rate of raiders to loot I will be ok.



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The sun bathes us with monstrous amounts of energy 24/7, 365. The sooner we learn to harvest it to its fullest, the better.



Just like with climate change, for peak oil we have passed the point of no return several times in the past decades. It seems like every 10-12 years is the time for the same people to say, "OOO, past the point of no return. The government needs more power and money to fix the problem." Not reflect on how they were wrong the previous 2-3 times they predicted it.



kirby007 said:

...in the bigger picture of whats going to kill us.

Forget about the financial crisis and the uncertain economic market. 

There is a bigger problem on the horizon its called Peak Oil.

In short a slowdown in the supply of oil production and the depopulation of the world's population will follow shortly after. 

1kJ of Food Production requires 8kJ of energy to produce.

Most of the energy is given off as heat in the production of food.

Source of most energy is oil. No real alternative to oil. Oil prices are rising because the oil supply has reached its peak.

A slowdown due to less oil in the food production will starve the population and the food prices will go up even further. 

The starvation and freezing of the population will occur eventually and over time the population will go down and those left behind will end up in ww3 over the remaing foodsupplies.

Do you see this scenario happening?

We are getting increasingly less dependent of fossile fuels if looking on a global scale. Hydro, Solar and Wind energy are massively on the rise.

In 2010 already, they accounted for 16.7% of the world energy production, over 6 times the amount of nuclear energy (2.7%). Several countries have taken up measures to limit the use of petrol and coal and replacing them with renewable energy sources. And it's working, as despite the massive amounts of energy needed by China for instance (which more than tripled their energy consumption since 2000 already) the total amount of petrol only rose moderately from 76 to 92 mbpd (million Barril per Day) in that timeframe, much slower than past decades. Wind energy has more than doubled since 2010 (if not tripled, the data only shows up to 2016), Solar is growing even faster, being projected to have grown more than sixfold since 2010.

Add to this that an increasing amount of vehicle fuel is made up from vegetable sources all while it's starting to get slowly electrified, and I think that peak oil will not be when there's no more oil to find, but when there's not enough demand anymore for all that oil. Especially electric power generation from oil is going down fast percentage-wise, as almost none are getting built anymore but more and more getting decommissioned.

The sheer power needs of India and China are the main reason why oil production is still on the rise anyway, and once both slow down after having met their needs in +-10 years or so, I'm sure the world will have reached the maximum of oil production needs, unless much of Africa goes through such a fast development phase by then, too.

Also, keep in mind that oil peak is tied to the oil price. If oil gets more expensive, then more harder (and thus pricier) to extract oil ressources are getting viable, rising the amount of exploitable oil ressources up again. Because oil reserves is not just tied to oil production, but total viable production for a give price. The higher the price gets the bigger the reserves become. Hence why we had several small oil peaks already, but the resulting price increase has also resulted in more reserves becoming commercially exploitable.

Edit: Here is the outlook of world energy consumption by the petrol chain BP:

As you can see, the share of oil (and coal) in the power production is shrinking. Oil was already shrinking for decades, but coal is also going down now, and probably will only survive on the long term as a niche fuel for barbecues.

However, even if we would switch all our power production and all our vehicles away from oil, we would still need millions of barrels of the substance. That's because a whole branch of chemistry is based on it (it's not called petrochemistry for nothing), used mainly for the production of plastics and other synthetics, but also some medicines. But just like the cars do already, they could switch to oils from vegetable sources instead if necessary.

Last edited by Bofferbrauer2 - on 31 March 2019

Lol you can't seriously think that oil produces more energy om earth than the sun gives us. We produce less than a 100th of a percent of energy on earth than the sun gives us.

There are plenty of alternatives for oil,and if we really want to use oil there is still a shit ton of oil underneath the North Sea.
Climate change ruins harvests by quite a good amount. We are slowly seeing concequences of climate change aside from quite a few species which went or are extinct because of it. But even a shortage of food isn't neccesary if people would grow crops in greenhouses like the Dutch do. It costs 90% less water per crop and the yields per square meter and stability are much higher.

Our biggest enemy however is still pollution of the water supply. Clean fresh water is in short supply and with more evaporation in hotter zones desserts will stretch out and area's will be impossible to live in. Also the Netherlands and some other places already lay below sea level. Imagine the world economic crisis if Europe is main import and export country is flooded for half of its landmass like two or 3 meters below sea level.

Also the emission of carbondioxide accidifies oceans, since it stores roughly 30% of the carbondioxide we happily emit. Warmer oceans also bleach corals which are already less resiliant due to accidification and fishing and pollution. We will live to sea the day that the great barrièr reef is almost completely bleached at this rate. Which is essential for a huge part of South East Asia is fishing industry.

https://www.google.nl/amp/s/www.carbonbrief.org/ocean-acidifiction-decline-of-great-barrier-reef-likely-to-be-worse-than-feared/amp

So no enhanced climate change is not nor will be inconsequential to everyone. Sure some nations will not really experience it,but the question is whether we want to stop it, by sacrificing luxirues to live more sustainable.

Since actions speak louder than words and almost no country has remotely the intention to live by the Paris agreements I would say we that humankind doesn't think its worth it.



Please excuse my (probally) poor grammar

Climate change will be irreversible by 2030. I'm sure we can keep up oil by then. Oil will run out after we are done destroying ourselves, not the planet, through climate change. All of the old generations will die and we'll be left to deal with the fallout. I just hope that we somehow figure out fusion, incorporate solar and wind all around and reduce the effects before they become irreversible. Finding a new source is what humans are really good at, but if we are battling storms, droughts, floods, earthquakes, etc, we won't have time for all of that stuff.



Just a guy who doesn't want to be bored. Also