Forums - Politics Discussion - The Russian Debate

I've watched this on x2 speed, It's a calm debate between two democrats that's worth watching. I'll post my opinion on the points discussed later if there is enough interest in this topic. 



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This is what I like about TYT, they are progressives but do have open debates about matters where they disagree. I think Kyle is completely delusional and naive when it comes to the matters of Russian collusion but it's good that they have the debate.



Link?



Honestly, I can't believe it has been going on for so long as a major development in american media and politics.....

What were russia involvment ? A few targeted ads on facebook that were ridiculously low in numbers compared to the money spent by the two candidates, some bots on Twitter, the hack of the democratic commitee and some mail of Podesta, which faled too dig something important.

In comparison of that, the USA has decades of history of meddling with other country politics, by military actions, by sanctions, by financing coup d'etat and other coloured revolutions. Clinton herself tried to boost up Russian opposition, and medlde in Russian politics as the US did in Ukraine.

The US got a taste of their own medicine, and on a so little scale and so little level, that it is really ridiculous to see the reactions. You reap what you sow.



Lucas-Rio said:

Honestly, I can't believe it has been going on for so long as a major development in american media and politics.....

What were russia involvment ? A few targeted ads on facebook that were ridiculously low in numbers compared to the money spent by the two candidates, some bots on Twitter, the hack of the democratic commitee and some mail of Podesta, which faled too dig something important.

In comparison of that, the USA has decades of history of meddling with other country politics, by military actions, by sanctions, by financing coup d'etat and other coloured revolutions. Clinton herself tried to boost up Russian opposition, and medlde in Russian politics as the US did in Ukraine.

The US got a taste of their own medicine, and on a so little scale and so little level, that it is really ridiculous to see the reactions. You reap what you sow.

You're right about USA's history in meddling with other countries politics.
Though in regards to what Russia did in 2016, there is the DNC hack, and this came up a few days ago: https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/elections/russians-penetrated-u-s-voter-systems-says-top-u-s-n845721
"Russians penetrated U.S. voter systems, top U.S. official says"
"We saw a targeting of 21 states and an exceptionally small number of them were actually successfully penetrated."

I don't know what that means exactly. I've always been under the impression that no actual votes were tampered with, and that still appears to be the case.
"There is no evidence that any of the registration rolls were altered in any fashion, according to U.S. officials."

Last edited by Hiku - on 10 February 2018

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The only reason Russia is even a topic at this point is because Trump won.

If everything had went according to plan for the powers-that-be and Hillary Clinton was the one in the White House, does anyone honestly thing we'd be hearing a peep about any of this stuff?

Especially all the text messages and communications that have now come to light between the FBI, Obama's DOJ and the Clinton campaign showing a clear orchestration in monitoring and trying to get any dirt they could on the Trump campaign at the time, including colluding with foreign sources and spy agents, the very thing that they accuse Trump of doing!

The only thing the Russians did in regards to the 2016 elections was they hacked members of the DNC and released a bunch of emails via Wikileaks that basically confirmed what everyone already knew - the DNC and their buddies in the media and government were in the tank for Hillary all along, and it blew up in their faces when Trump won.



On 2/24/13, MB1025 said:
You know I was always wondering why no one ever used the dollar sign for $ony, but then I realized they have no money so it would be pointless.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pDXZ5dmTRVQ



Bet with PeH: 

I win if Arms sells over 700 000 units worldwide by the end of 2017.

Bet with WagnerPaiva:

 

I win if Emmanuel Macron wins the french presidential election May 7th 2017.

Here is Robert Mueller stating Saddam had WMDs and had the will to use them against the U.S. and her allies:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4FWSnMNt0bM

This is Iraq WMD lies 2.0 and my mind is blown people are falling for it. Do we forget how much the Democrats worshipped Russia in 2012?

Romney, who calls Russia our "No. 1 geopolitical foe," doesn't seem to realize it's the 21st century. #RomneyNotReady


- The Democrats -

After all, you don't call Russia our No. 1 enemy -- not Al-Qaida, Russia -- unless you're still stuck in a Cold War mind warp.


- Barack Obama at the 2012 DNC - http://www.npr.org/2012/09/06/160713941/transcript-president-obamas-convention-speech

You (Romney) said Russia (was our no. 1 enemy), in the 1980s, they're now calling to ask for their foreign policy back because, you know, the Cold War's been over for 20 years. But Governor, when it comes to our foreign policy, you seem to want to import the foreign policies of the 1980s.


-  Barack Obama during 2012 Presidential debate https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QS2a44F5TgM)

"Mitt Romney talks like he's seen Russia by watching Rocky IV.


The DNC even made a poster mocking Romney about watching Rocky IV to get his foreign policy: https://theintercept.com/wp-uploads/sites/1/2016/09/romneykerry.jpg

- John Kerry at the 2012 DNC https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UgUyqLrgO7Q

Its someone dated to be looking backwards.


- Then Secretary of State Hillary Clinton on Romney's views on Russia http://www.redstate.com/erick/2014/03/04/hillary-clinton-mocked-romney-on-russia-then-goes-to-hitler-comparisons/

Vice President Joe Biden assailed Mitt Romney as “fundamentally wrong” and “totally out of touch” on foreign policy in a campaign speech Thursday — contrasting that to a record of President Barack Obama’s tough but right choices.

Drawing contrasts between President Barack Obama and comments Romney has made on the campaign trail in 2008 and this year, Biden attacked the former Massachusetts governor for being “one of a small group of Cold War holdovers,” for naming Russia as a major threat to the United States and at times referring to Soviets.

"I don’t know whether it’s a slip of the tongue or a mind-set … Everybody slips. I never do, but everyone does,” Biden said in a self-deprecating nod to his own gaffes.[/quote]

-  Then VP Joe Biden http://www.politico.com/story/2012/04/biden-assails-mocks-romney-on-foreign-policy-075653

VLADIVOSTOK, Russia — President Vladimir V. Putin of Russia sauntered into American presidential politics on Thursday, praising President Obama as “a very honest man” and chastising the Republican nominee, Mitt Romney, for describing Russia as “without question our No. 1 geopolitical foe.”[/quote]
- The New York Times September 2012 archive.is/IsUS9

After the election I have more flexibility.


- Obama to Russia/Putin https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XsFR8DbSRQE

Trade With Russia Is a Win-Win. By making Moscow a normal trading partner, Congress would create American jobs and advance human rights.


- Secretary of State Hillary Clinton https://www.wsj.com/articles/SB10001424052702303836404577475061208876588



NightDragon83 said:



The only thing the Russians did in regards to the 2016 elections was they hacked members of the DNC and released a bunch of emails via Wikileaks that basically confirmed what everyone already knew - the DNC and their buddies in the media and government were in the tank for Hillary all along, and it blew up in their faces when Trump won.

It should be noted there's no proof Russia even did it. The FBI never investigated the servers. It was "investigated" a third party that is pro-Democrat and anti-Russia.

I think Russia hacking the DNC is an even bigger lie than WMDs.



NightDragon83 said:

Especially all the text messages and communications that have now come to light between the FBI, Obama's DOJ and the Clinton campaign showing a clear orchestration in monitoring and trying to get any dirt they could on the Trump campaign at the time, including colluding with foreign sources and spy agents, the very thing that they accuse Trump of doing!

Maybe it's "clear" if you get your news from Fox News, Infowars, etc who omitted context that came out mere hours later on other news outlets that made their theory look very unlikely.

"People familiar with the matter strongly dispute the assertion that the text message referenced the Clinton email probe. The text message, they say, was actually referencing Obama's desire to be kept abreast on the FBI's investigation into Russian election meddling.

One former Obama official told CNN that the idea the text message was about the Clinton email investigation was "total nonsense," noting that the theory did not conform with the timeline of events.

Indeed, the text message was sent on September 2, 2016, months after the bureau had closed its investigation into Clinton, and before it reopened that investigation. But September 2, 2016 was just days before Obama confronted Russian President Vladimir Putin over Russia's meddling in the presidential election."


Guess what Obama did just 3 days after that text?
He confronted Putin about Russia's meddling in the 2016 election. So it is far more likely that the text was about the Presiden't interest in the FBI's Russia probe, rather than an investigation that was closed months ago.

Also, this text comes from the same guy who just weeks ago reported on the totally ridiculous (joke) text about a secret society, supposedly plotting against Trump.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qKWEl8ZosyM

It was so stupid that even the Fox News reporter looked stunned.
Turns out it appears to have been a joke. Duh. Same guy again. No surprise that he once again omitted important context.

As for "The only reason Russia is even a topic at this point is because Trump won", perhaps. But just like the DNC leaked emails, it's good for the public to know.
As for what they did, there was also lot of fake news bots on Facebook, Twitter, etc and just a few days ago it was revealed that they actually penetrated some voting systems: https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/elections/russians-penetrated-u-s-voter-systems-says-top-u-s-n845721
"Russians penetrated U.S. voter systems, top U.S. official says"
"We saw a targeting of 21 states and an exceptionally small number of them were actually successfully penetrated."

I don't know what that means exactly. I've always been under the impression that no actual votes were tampered with, and that still appears to be the case.
"There is no evidence that any of the registration rolls were altered in any fashion, according to U.S. officials."

Last edited by Hiku - on 10 February 2018