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Forums - Politics Discussion - Donald Trump: How Do You Feel about Him Now? (Poll)

 

Last November,

I supported him and I still do - Americas 91 15.77%
 
I supported him and I now don't - Americas 16 2.77%
 
I supported him and I still do - Europe 37 6.41%
 
I supported him and I now don't - Europe 7 1.21%
 
I supported him and I still do - Asia 6 1.04%
 
I supported him and I now don't - Asia 1 0.17%
 
I supported him and I still do - RoW 15 2.60%
 
I supported him and I now don't - RoW 2 0.35%
 
I didn't support him and still don't. 373 64.64%
 
I didn't support him and now do. 29 5.03%
 
Total:577
irstupid said:
SpokenTruth said:

Your first paragraph makes some bad assumptions about responsibility and credit.  Your second paragraph basically agrees with me.

I never said Obama is responsible and deserves credit.  Especially given economies tend to be the realm of Congress, not the President.  I said it was a trend that began during his term exactly as you also noted. But by your same do "nothing but sat on his thumbs all day the unemployment would have naturally improved" statement, the unemployment rate would have continued to decline regardless of who was in the White House after Nov 2016. It was trending that way anyway.

Not necessarily. Think of it this way.

A NBA team went 0-82 one season and fired their coach. Obama was hired and the team then won 5 games the next year, 10 game the following, ect to a respectable win/loss season. That's great and all, but nothing worth building monuments around the state of him. They want a championship.

That same team continues to do well, but never manages to get past the first round of the playoffs. Still a playoff team and something a state should be happy with, but they want a championship as I said, so they fire him and hire Trump. There are three things that could happen.

1. The team gets worse and no longer makes the playoffs.

2. The team stays stagnant and continues to one and done in playoffs.

3. The team makes it out of the first round making it further and heck maybe even winning it all.

Right now Trump is doing #3. The economy is continue to improve, stocks continue to break records, and unemployment as well seeing record lows.

If Trump was such a disaster why is stuff no going in the opposite direction or jus staying stagnant. Why is stuff improving. It's not like Trump is sitting on his thumbs. He is making decisions and doing things that are getting people like you's panties in huge bunches. But none of those decisions has had a negative impact longterm on our overall GDP growth, unemployment decline, stock rises, ect. For every decision he has made, the stock and stuff may have a knee jerk reaction, but overall stuff has only continued to improve since he has been in office. And we are at record numbers on things. It's not like when Obama started where there was only one place to go and that was up. Most would think that when Trump came into office, the only place to go would be down, since he came into office when stuff was basically already at the top.

Because it takes years before any policy starts to make a difference.  Even during Bush years, it took years for his administration before we saw the result of policies that caused problems.  Now that you have these tariffs was about to happen.  You have instability in trade going on between US, Mexico and Canada.  We will see if these actual policy changes will benefit or have a huge detriment to our economy.  Not sure why people always believe things like the economy just blow up in an instant.  It take years of bad policy to shift an economyto good or bad.  By the time Trump serve out his 4 years we should start to see the results of things he has put into motion.



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SpokenTruth said:
irstupid said:

Not necessarily. Think of it this way.

A NBA team went 0-82 one season and fired their coach. Obama was hired and the team then won 5 games the next year, 10 game the following, ect to a respectable win/loss season. That's great and all, but nothing worth building monuments around the state of him. They want a championship.

That same team continues to do well, but never manages to get past the first round of the playoffs. Still a playoff team and something a state should be happy with, but they want a championship as I said, so they fire him and hire Trump. There are three things that could happen.

1. The team gets worse and no longer makes the playoffs.

2. The team stays stagnant and continues to one and done in playoffs.

3. The team makes it out of the first round making it further and heck maybe even winning it all.

Right now Trump is doing #3. The economy is continue to improve, stocks continue to break records, and unemployment as well seeing record lows.

If Trump was such a disaster why is stuff no going in the opposite direction or jus staying stagnant. Why is stuff improving. It's not like Trump is sitting on his thumbs. He is making decisions and doing things that are getting people like you's panties in huge bunches. But none of those decisions has had a negative impact longterm on our overall GDP growth, unemployment decline, stock rises, ect. For every decision he has made, the stock and stuff may have a knee jerk reaction, but overall stuff has only continued to improve since he has been in office. And we are at record numbers on things. It's not like when Obama started where there was only one place to go and that was up. Most would think that when Trump came into office, the only place to go would be down, since he came into office when stuff was basically already at the top.

Just to make sure I follow you here.  Box 1 (red) is irrelevant because it was going to get better anyway because it started from the bottom.  Box 2 (blue) is irrelevant because it's not winning the championship.  Box 3 (green) is relevant because it's record breaking.

All that despite it taking time for economy policy to actually impaact an economy.
All that despite the economy largely being controlled by Congress, not the president.
All that despite the fact it's an ongoing trend that goes back 8 years.

Of course you over-exagerated to prove your point.

I would have said anything before the 7.5% or so rate it not worth consider as it was just the market/world/rate/ect whatever you want to call it righting itself out.

It's like when a stock take a huge crash or dive. It drops so far due to over-reaction and that is not what it's true value really is. For that reason, the stock market now a days actually closes when there is a huge drop. The great recession one could say was like that. Beyond allt he businesses that went out of business, many other over-reacted and played it essentially safe by letting more go than needed, or froze hiring to be safe, ect. 

So then Obama improved from the 8-7.5 to roughly 5. That is great. Where ever you want to say it starts. the average per year historically is probably closer to 6 than 5 and he ended at five. So success.

But just look at your data. It looks to be leveling off at 5, until Trump takes office and then it takes a sharp hit down to 4.  WHY? Was it because still Obama's policies? If you're going to argue that, then you can't be spouting how Trumps' goal and only thing he has done in office is been repeal everything Obama has done. How can stuff be still improving due to Obama if all Trump has done is reversed Obama's legacy?

And don't say "oh, Obama's would have gone to this low 4" That is a baseless claim. Go look at historical data, and you will see how rare being in the 4's or lower is. If Trump was such a disaster, regardless of who was before him, this coveted and rare 4% should not be possible. Obama ended at great numbers. It would be almost expected that anyone following him would have worse numbers just on that fact alone. 



Unemployment went down during Obama’s term because people completely dropped out of the workforce lmao. That graph shows absolutely nothing, one statistic with no specifics. To claim the Obama terms had any kind of recovery is crazy! The federal reserve kept negative interest rates so the economy didn’t spiral out of control. What a laughable argument.



SpokenTruth said:
irstupid said:

Of course you over-exagerated to prove your point.

I would have said anything before the 7.5% or so rate it not worth consider as it was just the market/world/rate/ect whatever you want to call it righting itself out.

It's like when a stock take a huge crash or dive. It drops so far due to over-reaction and that is not what it's true value really is. For that reason, the stock market now a days actually closes when there is a huge drop. The great recession one could say was like that. Beyond allt he businesses that went out of business, many other over-reacted and played it essentially safe by letting more go than needed, or froze hiring to be safe, ect. 

So then Obama improved from the 8-7.5 to roughly 5. That is great. Where ever you want to say it starts. the average per year historically is probably closer to 6 than 5 and he ended at five. So success.

But just look at your data. It looks to be leveling off at 5, until Trump takes office and then it takes a sharp hit down to 4.  WHY? Was it because still Obama's policies? If you're going to argue that, then you can't be spouting how Trumps' goal and only thing he has done in office is been repeal everything Obama has done. How can stuff be still improving due to Obama if all Trump has done is reversed Obama's legacy?

And don't say "oh, Obama's would have gone to this low 4" That is a baseless claim. Go look at historical data, and you will see how rare being in the 4's or lower is. If Trump was such a disaster, regardless of who was before him, this coveted and rare 4% should not be possible. Obama ended at great numbers. It would be almost expected that anyone following him would have worse numbers just on that fact alone. 

How many damn times do I need to keep telling you that the economy is controlled by Congress, not the president? You are so hell bent on an agenda.

You posted a graph showing the unemploymet rate by President, not Congress.

If you were arguing Congress so bad then you would have highlighted that Congress was in power since 2014. So everything since 2014 according to you is 100% thanks to Republicans. 



He's shooting himself in the foot going after Harley-Davidson, as the reason Harley sales are up in Europe is because of the right-wing biker gangs of the SIOE.



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HouseEorl said:
He's shooting himself in the foot going after Harley-Davidson, as the reason Harley sales are up in Europe is because of the right-wing biker gangs of the SIOE.

Don't know what Trump said, but I did read an article a few days ago about a group of Harley Davidson owners in the US that are really upset that Harley is moving outside the US.

I don't know how loyal Harley fans are to it being a US company, but if they are anything like Ford and Chevy ownners, I would be scared of upsetting them. Bike or Car fanatics are very brand loyal and fight with other companies all the time over who is better and it becoming a foreign brand would be a big blow to many. 

So the question is, will Harley gain enough fans to overcomet he amount they lose. And the hardcore bike/car fans spend ALOT of money on their hobbies. Harley's are NOT cheap either. 



He's going too far, what he is doing with those families by taking their children away is cruel and plain wrong. It's one thing to protect his country from people that follow a dangerous religion by not letting them enter the US territory but it's an entirely different matter when he separates families and takes their children away. Especially latino families, they have nothing to do with terrorism.

I guess we are fucked no matter how an election goes. We either have some sell out that will have the appearance of a civilized person and be corrupt to the bone or some populist that Tweets anything he wants and has the moral abilities of an amoeba.

https://www.bbc.com/news/av/world-us-canada-44665112/migrant-mum-called-animal-for-breastfeeding



CrazyGamer2017 said:

He's going too far, what he is doing with those families by taking their children away is cruel and plain wrong. It's one thing to protect his country from people that follow a dangerous religion by not letting them enter the US territory but it's an entirely different matter when he separates families and takes their children away. Especially latino families, they have nothing to do with terrorism.

I guess we are fucked no matter how an election goes. We either have some sell out that will have the appearance of a civilized person and be corrupt to the bone or some populist that Tweets anything he wants and has the moral abilities of an amoeba.

https://www.bbc.com/news/av/world-us-canada-44665112/migrant-mum-called-animal-for-breastfeeding

Not all populists are uncivilized. Just the right wing authoritarian ones. Find a middle of the road populist like Eisenhower or left wing populist like FDR or Teddy Roosevelt and you have a guaranteed top 10 president. Such a shame there's been so few of them. America seems to love them, and they seem to be great for us, you'd think we'd see more of them.



Looks like the tariffs are killing a number of US businesses, including Harley-Davidson.

You have a child who claims to be about lowering taxes, putting up these big tariffs while dumping 200 billion extra into the military-industrial complex, shaking hands with militant countries like Israelis, Russians, the North Korean dictator, and Saudis while fucking the Western economy with these tariffs. It's not difficult to see which industry owns Trump.



I describe myself as a little dose of toxic masculinity.

irstupid said:
SpokenTruth said:

How many damn times do I need to keep telling you that the economy is controlled by Congress, not the president? You are so hell bent on an agenda.

You posted a graph showing the unemploymet rate by President, not Congress.

If you were arguing Congress so bad then you would have highlighted that Congress was in power since 2014. So everything since 2014 according to you is 100% thanks to Republicans. 

I actually thought you were better than this. 

He showed you a timeline by President because you appeared to be making claims about presidents having effects on the economy.  Is that no longer the case? 

(Note: if you really cared about this issue you might have noticed that the color changed on Election Day, not Trump's inauguration.  Did Trump enact his oh-so-efficacious policies on Day 1?  Did he do it before he even took office?  Is it literally his cult of personality buoying the job market?) 

Last edited by Final-Fan - on 01 July 2018

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