Forums - Gaming Discussion - Is there a Place for Nintendo as a 3rd Party Developer?

Am I making a good argument?

Yes! Nintendo would be doomed as 3rd party! 50 29.59%
 
No, Nintendo would kick ass as 3rd party! 51 30.18%
 
lulz didn't read ^^ 34 20.12%
 
Rezzzzults 34 20.12%
 
Total:169
hsrob said:
DanneSandin said:
hsrob said:
I'm not really sure those examples prove anything, they're not even close to the best offerings on their respective consoles. Mario Kart 8, 3D World and Smash Bros are. Nintendo's big franchises would make a killing on any console.

Never mind that in this hypothetical future those orphaned Nintendo fans are going to have to game on something, so the games should at least sell as much as they did on Wii U. Unless we are to assume that all Nintendo's fans are going to up and evaporate with the hardware.

Ecxuse me? http://www.metacritic.com/search/all/littlebigplanet/results?sort=score LBP has a metacritic of 95! It's one of THE best reviewed games on PS3! And what placement did it have in the top 30 PS3 games? Minecraft didn't get bad reviews either: http://www.metacritic.com/search/all/minecraft/results?sort=score And neither did Lego Marvel http://www.metacritic.com/search/all/Lego-marvel-super-heroes/results?sort=score Or what about Rayman Legends? http://www.metacritic.com/search/all/rayman-legends/results?sort=score These games all got good to GREAT scores.

What are you basing your comment "Nintendo [...] would make a killing on any console"? Just because it's Nintendo? Sure, most Nintendo fans would get PS5 or Xbox... two?.... if Nintendo didn't make their own console any more and had offerings on those systems, but how many else WOULD buy them? A lot of times talking is just that; talking. A lot of them people who wants Nintendo games on other consoles are just talking, and wouldn't buy the games. And the majority of gamers wouldn't give a rats ass. A small minority of existing PS4/XOne gamers would buy Nintendo games if they were on their prefered c onsole.

You've just had to cherry pick from your own post to help make your point, you use LBP as your primary example when it must have been clear I was particularly alluding to this gen. As for the other examples that you have thrown in, how did they sell on Nintendo's console? Rayman, Marvel, where do they feature in Nintendo's top selling titles? What about the PS4 games in the OP? Calling Minecraft 'kiddie' is a stretch at best and the other two were still reviewed significantly lower the the flagship Nintendo titles thus far this gen. That alone could be enough reason to explain why they haven't sold that well. It's not proof that there isn't a market for kiddie games on Sony consoles and it's certainly not proof that there's no market for Nintendo games on Sony consoles.

I picked a few titles at random from that list. The only game (afaik) on that list that got mediocre reviews is knack. Those games that did show up on Wii U/3DS (like Lego Marvel) probably didn't do so well since they have to compete against similar games. Rayman vs Mario? I think most would buy Mario. And why can't we talk about sales from last gen? An install base of 80m+ for both PS3 and X360, and not a single Nintendo like game in the Top 10 best selling lists (except Kinect Sports). The best selling none-bundled Nintendo like games sold 5-7m (LBP and Minecraft). That's pretty good numbers, and NSMB would probably sell something similar, or more, on PS4 and X1. But what about Kirby? What about Donkey Kong? ANimal Crossing? Kid Icarus?

Another significant issue with attempting to draw parallel's between these titles that have been arbitrarily designated 'kiddie' is that Nintendo's kiddie titles are first party, whereas the majority of Sony's are not.  Look for the best rated and top selling games on any console and first party games are always heavily represented.

LBP is 1st party, isn't it? And top rated as well.

The most common complaint you hear about Nintendo games from non Nintendo console owners is, "I wish it was on console X, it's a great game but I'm not buying a system for 1-2 great games." Now while that's no guarantee of sales it raises the possibility that there exists an untapped market for some Nintendo games amongst the Nintendo non-faithful.

And I argue that that crowed is either just talking the talk but won't walk the walk if given the chance. And remember, they are the minority of tall the gamers. Do you think the people getting CoD would give a shit about Mario?

They would make a killing because given the install base they have always made a killing. Mario, Zelda, Animal Crossing, Smash Bros, Pokemon, Mario Kart. Increase the install base and you will increase the sales, by how much is anyone's guess.  Increase the install base by 4-5 fold and what do you think will happen? It's not going to increase sales 4-5 fold but it's bound to have a big impact.

I'm arguing that the increase in sales wouldn't be that much, and I base that on previously released games. And let's remember that Nintendo have more games than those heavy hitters. What about the smaller games?

In the end it's all supposition, but I'm not quite sure why you believe yours to be so much more reliable than mine or anyone else's. We've never actually seen how well a Mario 'kiddie' game could sell on a non-Nintendo and while we can attempt to draw parallels and analogies, it's naive to think that it allows us to draw any solid conclusions on either side of the debate.

No, I don't have any solid conclusions =) Just some speculation that I've tried to base in real numbers.

Anyway, no more debating for me tonight, past bedtime :)

Sleep tight!





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They are a console game developer, they would be great on PS xbox and pc. Personal reason are why people doubt it for the most part.

Nintendo would greatly benefit from releasing on other platforms, the user base and potential will be why they eventually go multi plat. They have the resources and capability to really turn the 3rd party scene on it head.

Business case is there for it, they have the financials to do it. They have the skill and talent. Only missing part is the will which will come with new leadership and its crumbling user base which is already happening with the wii..



DanneSandin said:
sabastian said:
I say an astounding YES !

I say this with 3 reasons in mind.

1- Their resume of games are heavily geared to the kid gaming community. That 5-16 age range will be pure gold to them sales wise on say a Playstation 4/ XB1 console.

2- Most gamer's own 2 consoles. With a move towards a 3rd party software focus, the big N now does not have to focus o console sales. With the PS4 selling almost 20 million and the XB1 at approx 11 million consoles sold, the big N would see healthy software sales on both consoles.

3- With the power of the Playstation 4, the big N can now shift their focus to 2 main focuses. they can now go back to making great games and now they do not have to focus on creating too much new IP's. Their stable of established franchises along with a massive backlog will ensure them successful as a multi platform developer.

But what am I thinking, the big N will NEVER go 3rd party. It makes way too much sense.

1- I have already disproven this in the OP: "kiddie" games don't sell well on the new systems.

2- Most gamers DO NOT own 2 consoles: only "hardcore" gamers do. And that's the minority of every one owning a console.

3- Woth the power of PS4 comes higher production  costs of making a game, and marketing one. That means less money from each copy sold. Nintendo would have to sell a lot more games to make up the difference, and as I showed in the OP, there really isn't a market for those kind of games...

I've mentioned this before but you are focusing too much on consoles. Even if most gamers don't own 2 consoles, almost all of them own at least 2 platforms often console + PC. There are PC gamers out there buying 3rd party games as well.

Oh and on your 3rd point... that's just incorrect. If anything PS4 would cost less to develop for considering it is supposed to be easy and so similar to PC which is the standard platform for developers. And there is absolutely no way the marketing cost would go up. Marketing companies don't add on a PS4 game surcharge to their costs



Bet Shiken that COD would outsell Battlefield in 2018. http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8749702

padib said:
Nintendo games would fail on Sony and MS platforms for the same reasons as the U is failing in today's market (incidentally shaped by Nintendo's competition).


Is this a serious statement or just a joke that went over my head?



I bet the Wii U would sell more than 15M LTD by the end of 2015. He bet it would sell less. I lost.

DanneSandin said:
gergroy said:
So, the op is assuming people that have bought nintendo consoles would not be willing to buy Xbox or playstation to play nintendo games?

Most of them would probably buy a new console, but with higher production costs and more merketing behind every game, would that loyal fan base be enough if Nintendo went 3rd party? Clearly, going by similar games sold on PS and XB, the market isn't huge for Nintendo like games on those systems.


No, I am sure nintendo would have a very sizable market to work with.  A loyal fan base with a larger base of owners from which to grow that fanbase would almost assuredly mean more software sells.  I am not actually one that says nintendo needs to go third party, as I think they are fine as they are, at least at the moment.  However, that doesn't mean I can't see the potential for growth such a move would make.  Hardware has never really been nintendos strength...



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Ehh Im fine if they go 3rd party
just make a deal with sony for marketing and put it in a ps4 bundle
like zelda or smash
should sell1-3 million by that



Bets:

(Won)Bet with TechoHobbit: He(Techno) says 10 million by January 1,2014 I say 9 million by then. Winner gets 2 weeks of sig control.

(Lost)Bet with kinisking: I say Ps4 will win April NPD while he says Xbox One will win it; winner gets 1 week of avatar control.

Raichu's First Series:

First RPG?

First Fighter?

First Racer?

First Shooter?

First MMO?

First Horror?

Official Ni No Kuni Fanboy:

Familiars Captured:37

Game Beaten: 2 times almost

Times I got teary during some scenes: 3

Most Nintendo fans own a Playstation or XBox in addition to their Nintendo console, so I don't really think a whole lot would change in this hypothetical.

They would simply just get their Mario/Zelda/Mario Kart/DKC/etc. fix elsewhere.



DanneSandin said:
sabastian said:
I say an astounding YES !

I say this with 3 reasons in mind.

1- Their resume of games are heavily geared to the kid gaming community. That 5-16 age range will be pure gold to them sales wise on say a Playstation 4/ XB1 console.

2- Most gamer's own 2 consoles. With a move towards a 3rd party software focus, the big N now does not have to focus o console sales. With the PS4 selling almost 20 million and the XB1 at approx 11 million consoles sold, the big N would see healthy software sales on both consoles.

3- With the power of the Playstation 4, the big N can now shift their focus to 2 main focuses. they can now go back to making great games and now they do not have to focus on creating too much new IP's. Their stable of established franchises along with a massive backlog will ensure them successful as a multi platform developer.

But what am I thinking, the big N will NEVER go 3rd party. It makes way too much sense.

1- I have already disproven this in the OP: "kiddie" games don't sell well on the new systems.

2- Most gamers DO NOT own 2 consoles: only "hardcore" gamers do. And that's the minority of every one owning a console.

3- Woth the power of PS4 comes higher production  costs of making a game, and marketing one. That means less money from each copy sold. Nintendo would have to sell a lot more games to make up the difference, and as I showed in the OP, there really isn't a market for those kind of games...


1- ""kiddie" games don't sell well on the new systems " Well in that case, the big N can make games for the ps3. Its not a new system and there still selling well.

 

2- "Most gamers DO NOT own 2 consoles " Ask any Nintendo gamer that question. I bet over 80% of them either own a playstation or Xbox system. 

 

3- Again your wrong. Most Nintendo games dont really cost as much as those AAA playstation/ Xbox games. And even so, Just because its a next gen system dosent mean that a game has to have a high production cost. Heck, the ps4 is flodded with Indle games and im sure those cost little to make.



The odds of me purchasing any Nintendo game would increase no lesser than 100%, if Nintendo started doing 3rd party dev. However, I'm not in the camp that is concerned for Nintendo. They've had poor performance from machines in the past and rebounded brilliantly. So, they're by no means out of the picture permanently.



I'm new to this thread and don't feel ashamed of posting here and having ignored those last 8 pages.

I think your analysis is wrong. First of all, I don't think you should judge how well games did based solely on where they rank on the software list for their platform - you should rather look at how much the game itself sold. Nintendo shouldn't care about Zelda only finishing 26th or something on a console if it sells a good 4-6 million units.

Also, I don't think it's fair to judge how big of a market there is for these games with Kinect Adventures, LittleBigPlanet and stuff. Other than Minecraft, Nintendo games have FAR more appeal than any of those titles and would certainly interest way more people.

With that said, I still think they would be either doomed or far worse than they currently are doing if they went third-party. I think it would get them a lot of money in the short-term, but after the first few years, their games would start to become niche offerings in the middle of all the other heavy hitters - when they're exclusive games with little competition they naturally attract a lot more interest. Another reason why they would lose appeal is because the games would obviously not be as good as they are currently (I doubt Nintendo would retain their quality when developing for other systems).