Forums - Politics Discussion - What does Putin want with Ukraine

What is his end state

Annex Ukraine As a whole 337 40.60%
 
Annex Crimea 286 34.46%
 
Defend Russian People Fro... 184 22.17%
 
Total:807
Nem said:


Did you miss the part where the russian president fled from the country? Yes, there is plenty wrong with the russian parliament. Its a scham. The elections are fixed aswell, so nope. Its still a dictatorship in practice. It just tries to look like its not, and badly at that.

So much shit that isn't even funny! )))
http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/thread.php?id=179695
Come here please, we can speak! )




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Sharu said:
Nem said:
 


Did you miss the part where the russian president fled from the country? Yes, there is plenty wrong with the russian parliament. Its a scham. The elections are fixed aswell, so nope. Its still a dictatorship in practice. It just tries to look like its not, and badly at that.

So much shit that isn't even funny! )))
http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/thread.php?id=179695
Come here please, we can speak! )



Well, thats what i heard from the news. Not my fault if its innacurate. Though i would like to be enlighted on your side of the events.

Though i especially would like for you to explain to me how it isnt a dictatorship, because Putin just keeps swapping between the president and prime minister positions to stay in power. I would like to see you say he doesnt have control over the powers of both those positions.

I will copy this post and post it on the other thread if its more confortable for you. I am most interested in hearing your version of the story. :)



kowenicki said:
allblue said:
kowenicki said:
Oliver4p1 said:

I am with Putin and anti NWO NATO and im from UK

They have more right to defend russian citizens from a far right kiev government than USA and EU have to remove Syrias legitimate leader.

Born in the UK?

In any event that doesnt give you the right to call peope stupid and retards.

 

American imperialism, anybody who goes against it is against freedom and sovereignty, am I right? Why don't you just straight up confessed that american/western superiority mindset of yours? 

Sorry, whats your problem?  I was asking him if he was born in the UK, since his stance was odd for someone that was.  If you agree with him them I'd suggest your stance is also odd if you are English.  Before you get on your high horse... odd doesnt mean wrong, it means odd, out of the ordinary.  The majority of English residents would prefer to allign themselves with Nato over Putin.

Unfortunately HE was banned for his abusive and mindless post, so he couldnt respond.

allblue said:


NATO is an american slave and you know it. The vast majority of English would stand with Britain, NOT EU and certainly won't be a

political slave to Washington. Ukarine is nothing but another proxy state in the making for the American government, we had

no obligation to go to middle east and we have no obligation to align ourself with the American interest. What happens in Ukarine,

happens in Ukarine. 

America invaded how many countries and installed how many puppet governments in the past 20 years? Such hypocricy and here a

BRIT is supporting it. What is your excuse?

Nothing to dispute eh? I guess I was spot on. 

Always flutters me to see imperialism is alive and well advocated today. 



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Nem said:
Mnementh said:
 

Is something wrong with the elections for russian parliament in a way that it isn't wrong in the US for example? Sure, Russia has guided democracy, as the US and most european countries. Propaganda, some hurdles in the laws for the elections, discrimination for some groups of people (like less election machines in regions with more blacks in the US) happens in all these countries. So I would learn to know, if Russias democracy is in any way less "proper" than the democracy we have.

The same problem faces the next election for Ukrainian parliament. Parties that were strong in the south or the east at the last elections of Ukraine are forbidden outright in Kiew now or are facing repressions, like frozen bank accounts, plundering of flats of politicians or aggression against them. That's including the winners of the last election, the Party of the Regions. That's no base for 'proper' democracy.


Did you miss the part where the russian president fled from the country? Yes, there is plenty wrong with the russian parliament. Its a scham. The elections are fixed aswell, so nope. Its still a dictatorship in practice. It just tries to look like its not, and badly at that.

Did you know Iraq had elections aswell? Saddam won every time. How convenient. I guess the people loved him. lol

The difference in russia is that the oil and gas are making the country rich for now. While that money keeps running the people wont revolt.

What is your concrete stuff you say about the elections? What do accuse them to do? All you do is throwing fog grenades, nothing concrete. I know how elections can be manipulated, you seem to have no idea.



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Mnementh said:
Nem said:


Did you miss the part where the russian president fled from the country? Yes, there is plenty wrong with the russian parliament. Its a scham. The elections are fixed aswell, so nope. Its still a dictatorship in practice. It just tries to look like its not, and badly at that.

Did you know Iraq had elections aswell? Saddam won every time. How convenient. I guess the people loved him. lol

The difference in russia is that the oil and gas are making the country rich for now. While that money keeps running the people wont revolt.

What is your concrete stuff you say about the elections? What do accuse them to do? All you do is throwing fog grenades, nothing concrete. I know how elections can be manipulated, you seem to have no idea.


You should accompany the discussion on the other thread. It answers those questions. 

Its not a fog grenade either dude. This guy changed the laws so he could stay in power.



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Nem said:
Sharu said:
Nem said:
 


Did you miss the part where the russian president fled from the country? Yes, there is plenty wrong with the russian parliament. Its a scham. The elections are fixed aswell, so nope. Its still a dictatorship in practice. It just tries to look like its not, and badly at that.

So much shit that isn't even funny! )))
http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/thread.php?id=179695
Come here please, we can speak! )



1. Well, thats what i heard from the news. Not my fault if its innacurate. Though i would like to be enlighted on your side of the events.

2. Though i especially would like for you to explain to me how it isnt a dictatorship, because Putin just keeps swapping between the president and prime minister positions to stay in power. I would like to see you say he doesnt have control over the powers of both those positions.

I will copy this post and post it on the other thread if its more confortable for you. I am most interested in hearing your version of the story. :)

1. LOL. First rule: stop believing in propaganda. From which side is of no importance. Read news from all over the world and try to match the complete different pictures they paint of events.

2. That is critcism to the democracy? He did that, because the russian constitution doesn't allow to stay president forever. I'm from germany, our constitution doesn't forbid such things. People can stay chancellor as long as they want and are elected. And some were chancellor a long time: Adenauer, Kohl. Are we a better or worse democracy? At least the russian constitution tried to avoid that. More to the point: in china the government is exchanged on a regular schedule. Are they in your opinion the better democracy because of that?



3DS-FC: 4511-1768-7903 (Mii-Name: Mnementh), Nintendo-Network-ID: Mnementh, Switch: SW-7706-3819-9381 (Mnementh)

my greatest games: 2017, 2018, 2019

Predictions: Switch / Switch vs. XB1 in the US / Three Houses first quarter

Mnementh said:
Nem said:
 


1. Well, thats what i heard from the news. Not my fault if its innacurate. Though i would like to be enlighted on your side of the events.

2. Though i especially would like for you to explain to me how it isnt a dictatorship, because Putin just keeps swapping between the president and prime minister positions to stay in power. I would like to see you say he doesnt have control over the powers of both those positions.

I will copy this post and post it on the other thread if its more confortable for you. I am most interested in hearing your version of the story. :)

1. LOL. First rule: stop believing in propaganda. From which side is of no importance. Read news from all over the world and try to match the complete different pictures they paint of events.

2. That is critcism to the democracy? He did that, because the russian constitution doesn't allow to stay president forever. I'm from germany, our constitution doesn't forbid such things. People can stay chancellor as long as they want and are elected. And some were chancellor a long time: Adenauer, Kohl. Are we a better or worse democracy? At least the russian constitution tried to avoid that. More to the point: in china the government is exchanged on a regular schedule. Are they in your opinion the better democracy because of that?


Dude, the conversation is going on in the other thread.

The information that reaches me is the one available to me through TV and internet. Did you miss the part where i was very interested in hearing the version the russian side?

Just stop it. I'm not interested in debating with you if you are gonna spew around attacks on character.

And really... Germany is the example of things never going wrong? Hitler was elected democraticly, in case you didnt know. Once there guess what he did? He made himself dictator. Shocking! Nothing like what Putin is doing!

Regardless as i told the other poster, domestic issues are not my concern. My concern is when he starts bringing war to the western countries.



Nem said:
NeoRatt said:
Russia is simply looking to secure access to the only warm water naval base they have to access western Europe, the Mediterranean, and Red Sea.

If the new Ukraine government was smart they would offer Russia a lease extension from 2047 to 2147 to keep the naval base there and guarantee Russian culture (language and other cultural norms) is supported by the government in exchange for a permanent withdrawl of occupying troops from the peninsula.

Right now the west seems to think that Russia has to lose. They have to look for a way for Russia to claim a victory.


I dont know if you understand this, but Russia has no claim to it. If they want it, there is only two possible ways the international community will accept it.

1. Ukraine sells it to them for a price.

2. Democratic referendum.

 

I worry that this will escalate into something worse. It might be inevitable that democracy and comunism clash in war until one goes. China is beeing very clever staying out of this. I would rather comunism issues be solved with internal disputes. Thats not gonna happen until the oil/gas runs out though.

Zimmerman's handywork troubling us to this day. What a devious character.

USA had no reason to enter Iraq.  But, they did because of oil...

Western nations had no reason to enter Libya...  But they did because of oil...

Western nations have watched and for the most part ignored stuff in Cambodia, Congo, Somalia, Central Republic of Africa, etc...  Where no one cares if the people die or are repressed.

Russia has just as much rights to look after their interests as western nations think they do.



kowenicki said:

Sorry, whats your problem?  I was asking him if he was born in the UK, since his stance was odd for someone that was.  If you agree with him them I'd suggest your stance is also odd if you are English.  Before you get on your high horse... odd doesnt mean wrong, it means odd, out of the ordinary.  The majority of English residents would prefer to allign themselves with Nato over Putin.

Unfortunately HE was banned for his abusive and mindless post, so he couldnt respond.


Although, I'm pretty damn close to understanding your character, I'm still interested hearing an answer straight from you, so I'll ask. What makes it ok for the US to go around intervening, taking down and installing puppet governments, invade a whole country on a false premise of nuclear weapons but not when another country does it in the interest of protecting their own backyard and millions of ethnic people in that country?

Do you think imperialism is justified?

If there's no reply I'll just assume that there's no convenient answer.



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We have some news that this night the golden fund of Ukraine was put into a plane in Borispol Airport and that plane flew to USA. If that news are true - all this 'revolution' thing just becomes simple robbery in the end. ((( Sad.