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Forums - Gaming Discussion - Playstation All-Stars Is No Super Smash Bros. Brawl, It’s Better

It is an incredible game and completely different to smash brothers. It would like saying bioshock is the same game as black ops.



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cunger said:

If I don't care about Sony mascots what is my reason for spending 60 bucks on this game?

Wait 1 to 3 months and buy at half price.



Runa216 said:
fillet said:
It's just like toast.

People eat it, but it's not worth talking about.

If that's truly how you feel, then what the hell are you doing on a videogame forum dedicated to talking about videogames? 

Talking from a quality aspect. People don't discuss the quality of toast. I'm not saying I don't like toast, it's a metaphor that I thought conveyed my feelings towards PSABR quite well.

Nothing special, nothing terrible, just toast.



cunger said:
pezus said:

 

 

Note: Before anyone says it, the name of the site has nothing to do with my opinion. PASBR is literally the only time I have played my PS3 aside from the Uncharted games. Aside from those two titles, Sony barely ever registers as a blip on my radar.

My history and experience with Super Smash Bros. is decently storied. I was active in the tournament scene for a few years and well renown for my use of Ike, a low tier character. Truthfully, I was never particularly successful in tournaments, and almost all of the acknowledgment I received was from playing people in friendlies, where my penchant for self-scrutiny didn’t seem to creep up as much.

For all of its flaws, I love playing Super Smash Bros. Brawl and all of its fan-made variants. That would be hard to deny, considering it’s been the mainstay in my Wii for just under five years. Brawl PlusBrawl MinusProject M, and even Balanced Brawl provide unique and differing takes on improving a game that was hamstrung by the creator’s desire to spite a portion of his fans. Don’t get me wrong, I’m not the type that believes that games should only be competitively minded, I just don’t think that bad game design in the name of sending a “f*** you” to anyone is a good idea. Sakurai’s decisions enforced the falsehood that casual fun and competitive spirit could not coexist in the same game.

For months, the guys over at SuperBot Entertainment have been saying that PlayStation All-Stars is one of those games you have to give a legitimate shot before bringing the hammer down on. Admittedly, the game sounds kind of dumb on paper. Throwing supers to OHKO your opponents could easily strike some as too easy, while others would feel cheated by the idea that they couldn’t earn a kill by virtue of landing normal attacks.

In execution, the game makes sense. There’s a mix of Smash and regular fighting game fundamentals that propel the title beyond the constraints of either. Items that don’t skew the overall battle and hazards that are able to be avoided encourage playing the game at face value, rather than running to the options to minimize the level of random BS that can happen. While the cast of twenty seems paltry compared to the thirty-five to fifty character rosters we’re used to, each character’s essence is woven into the move sets in creative ways that display how each character would act in an all-out-fight. You’re not stuck with a lazy Captain Falcon/Ganondorf situation. The closest argument one could make for similar treatment would be the Coles, but Good and Evil Cole actually serve different purposes and have separate circle moves.

What makes the move sets work is that you’re not picking repetitive characters or clones. Radec, Ratchet, Jak, and Nathan Drake are all gun heavy characters, but there’s no overlap in how each of them function. Drake is probably the best of the four at close and mid range, Jak is the most mobile of the four, Ratchet has the widest variety of moves in terms of range, and Radec’s strength lies in the longest of ranges.

Similarly, you don’t find overlap in the action-based sword wielding characters either. Kratos’s chain swords have strong frame data that make him ridiculously safe at mid-range. When fighting Kratos, you either have to stay outside of his range, or keep directly in his face to punish his recovery frames. Dante’s sword attacks may be the best way to start up a combo, but using it in the way that a Kratos players uses his square attacks will make an otherwise mobile character very stiff and open to punishment.

 

I’m not a Melee apologist. I don’t look back on the title as some golden age for Smash, and one would be silly to not acknowledge that all three Smash titles were runaway successes. I understand that it’s in a developer’s best interest to keep games as accessible as possible. Anyone who militantly preaches otherwise is free to pay a studio’s worth of developers to create a game that doesn’t sell well, and then immediately fire them because the game didn’t cover production costs. That always goes over well. But accessibilty goes both ways, alienating any aspect of your fanbase is an egregiously bad move.

The last factor that I feel pushes PASBR over Brawl fundamentally is that the studio behind it actually cares whether or not people like the game. It might be a matter of circumstance; a fledgling studio has to worry about their title’s reception so they’re going to go out of their way to be more open and accommodating.

Regardless of the motivation, it just plain works. They took player feedback into deep consideration and the intricacies of the game’s combat engine were significantly tweaked from the game I previewed a few months ago. The beta served to create some of the smoothest net code I have seen in a fighter yet. There are some base connection issues that still need to be worked out, but it’s not the lag fest filled with impractical tactics that you are prone to find out there with other titles.

Don’t get me wrong, there are still some issues at the moment. As smooth as the netcode is, merely staying connected can be a pain for some users. Nerfing certain characters out of their level 1 setups seems a bit unnecessary if you’re going to leave flowchart characters like Raiden and Evil Cole in the game. If Raiden lands his forward square or Evil Cole lands his charged Giga Punch, you can kiss your life goodbye. AP levels will need to be adjusted in the future as well, but at least SuperBot is paying attention. What I find funniest is that Seth Killian stated that the final version of Evil Cole is after game designer Ed Ma “took the hatchet” to him, so one can only imagine what kind of ridiculous crap he was capable of beforehand.

The biggest problem SuperBot faces is the same thing they have been saying since day one: preconception. There are a number of die-hard Smash players who fell in love with All-Stars once they got their hands on it, people willing to give the game a chance are finding a simple-but-deep fighter that cares in a way that Nintendo just stopped doing.

__________________________________

Agree? Disagree?

 


I don't play Smash Brothers for deep tactical fighting mechanics. If that's my main concern there are many better fighters than PS Allstars out there. 

10. People who quote the OP. This annoys me more than it should. To the people who do this: why? It's obvious that your post, and everyone's post in the thread, is directed to the OP, so why quote the OP? I can understand quoting the OP if you want to acknowledge a specific group of text, but that's oftentimes not the case. It's usually just people who respond to the OP with a post that would have been perfectly fine without the quote.



Runa216 said:
happydolphin said:

I actually really liked that review. Didn't realize that was you.

See?  I'm capable of spewing things of value from time to time.

:)



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The article lost me at "a game that was hamstrung by the creator’s desire to spite a portion of his fans." From there, I couldn't remotely relate to this guy.



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F0X said:

The article lost me at "a game that was hamstrung by the creator’s desire to spite a portion of his fans." From there, I couldn't remotely relate to this guy.

There is some kind of resentment of Sakurai, and it isn't completely misplaced, though I agree that to call it spite is a big shift in blame. Lack of openness maybe, but spite is a strong way to say it, even most probably wrong.

But there is a basis in reality there, metaknight is overpowered, and it's know that that's Sakurai's pet character.



happydolphin said:
F0X said:

The article lost me at "a game that was hamstrung by the creator’s desire to spite a portion of his fans." From there, I couldn't remotely relate to this guy.

There is some kind of resentment of Sakurai, and it isn't completely misplaced, though I agree that to call it spite is a big shift in blame. Lack of openness maybe, but spite is a strong way to say it, even most probably wrong.

But there is a basis in reality there, metaknight is overpowered, and it's know that that's Sakurai's pet character.


Some basis. In reality, SSB is not meant to be about practiced combos or anything but bringing out the ab-lib nature of fighting (Sakurai has said as much). So articles like this tells me that he's doing a good job of flaunting fighting game convention. Those who want something else can go play a less interesting fighting game like PSABR.



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F0X said:

Some basis. In reality, SSB is not meant to be about practiced combos or anything but bringing out the ab-lib nature of fighting (Sakurai has said as much). So articles like this tells me that he's doing a good job of flaunting fighting game convention. Those who want something else can go play a less interesting fighting game like PSABR.

That's the thing, it isn't one or the other. I can't judge PSABR because I haven't gotten my hands on it yet, but if you find it uninteresting because of balance, then what about a balanced game that is also interesting?

If two new players pick up the controller, one picks metaknight the other link, odds are that one is going to have less fun in losing all the time.



cunger said:

I'm a huge Smash Bros fan and I also a huge fan of classic style fighters like Street Fighter IV, Tekken, Soul Calibur, and DOA. So please tell me why I should play this game instead of those? I play Smash Bros because it is unique and fun and filled with Nintendo history. I play classic fighters when I want my tactile fighting fix. If I don't care about Sony mascots what is my reason for spending 60 bucks on this game?

So what you're saying is that you play Smash Bros just because it's full of Nintendo history?  I play Smash Bros because it's a fun game, not because I like the characters.  

Playstation All Stars as well as Super Smash Bros would still be good games whether they were full of character mascots or not.  First time you ever played a Street Fighter, Soul Calibur, Tekken, DoA, etc, did you play the games because the game sold you based on a character from another franchise?  Maybe Soul Calibur, but otherwise, no.  These characters might come from a wide range of games, but that doesn't mean because you don't know of the characters it's not something worth playing.  If you've never played any of these games, then just like Bloody Roar(listing a game you didn't list,) it's like playing a new IP with unique characters.

King of Fighters '94 and all future titles is a series based on characters from thier other series.  Maybe people shouldn't have bought into that series because they never played the games they were based from.  What you're saying in your quote is the exact same thing.