Forums - Nintendo Discussion - Wii U Discs Will Be 25GB In Size

SvennoJ said:
Kynes said:


That was a way to try to justify the superiority of Blu-Ray discs. DTS and AC-3 are lossy algorithms, but have such a high quality in their highest bit rates available,  that are indistinguishable from the uncompressed sound.

But the game is the production stage, that's where the sounds are mixed, reverberation and other effects are added and projected over 5.1 or 7.1 channels. To get the best results you need lossless compressed audio, preferably in 24bit 96khz to give you enough headroom to do all the calculations. You can downsample it after all the mixing is done and all effects are added. However outputting it in 24bit 96khz is still preferable if your amp is going to apply extra filters and effects as well.

For textures compression doesn't matter as much as resolution. If the WiiU is going to do 1080p then you better get some higher res versions of textures for up close, requiring a lot more space.

25gb should be enough without too much pre rendered fmv. The Witcher 2, although not so high quality in the sound department, has pretty good texture detail for 1080p and is about 15gb. But if you add tons of high quality pre-rendered fmv in 2D and 3D versions then a 12gb game quickly turns into 41gb, see Killzone 3.

Anyway the chances that 3rd party devs are going to do HD sound mixing and make higher res textures for WiiU ports is pretty much 0. Nor do I think Nintendo will do it themselves. Stylized graphics is their strong point, not detail, same for sound effects. But it's nice to have 25gb available for ps4 / nextbox ports.

Keep in mind that the Blu-ray drive in the PS3 is slow (only 2x) and developers have used redundant data for most games as a way to reduce seek times and disc spins.  If the optical drive in Wii U is faster (and I see no reason why it won't be as even the cheapest of the cheap BD drives are 4x with most being 8-12x now with still 18 months to go) then the volume of redundant data will be reduced greatly - likely to no redundancy needed at all.

Witcher 2 is also coming to the X360 now.  We'll see how much of an impact the lower capacity has on the graphics, content and audio and how the faster drive speed of the X360 reduces redundant data.

[PS3 - 9 MB/s || X360 - 16.2 MB/s]



The rEVOLution is not being televised

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Its a good thing I have a 1TB External HDD I can use for Wii U



radiantshadow92 said:
Linkasf said:
Play4Fun said:
radiantshadow92 said:
Viper1 said:
radiantshadow92 said:
wow @ the 8gb of storage -_-. Not for me thats for sure.

So buy a 2 TB HDD for $50 when it launches.

Thats a waste of money when they could just put it in and charge the same ammount themselves. The more news that keeps coming out about the wiiu, the less i am intised to buy it.


Oh please. You were never 'enticed' by it in the first place.

Don't mind him. He just comes into the Nintendo threads to downplay little things like storage space (he's living in the past, Storage shouldn't be a problem anymore).

i dont understand why you guys have to get so pissy about everything. Its quite pathetic. I go to the forums to add my thoughts and any discussion is fine, but shit like this really makes me not want to post anymore. Thats just the way it is on the nintendo forums, you cant post anything that against the the almighty 8gb nintendo system lol

So you're saying that I'm defending Nintendo eh? Actually, I hate the whole giant screen on a controller or portable device.

Yeah I've noticed that you have been posting on these boards, and what ever you say is mostly negative. You don't see me for example going to the Sony boards complaining that there are a lack of games that I would like to play now do you? Or better yet, I'm not going to that board complaining that the PS3 has a lack of 2 GB of RAM because I want it to be that way.

If you don't like a console (sad to hear that really) because it is made by a certain company, then stop coming to the boards of said company. I don't see how your comments add a damn discussion at all. They just add flame wars to the "discussion," if you wanna call it that anymore.

Oh and about not posting anything against a console system, I've seen it mostly happen on your precious Sony forum plenty of times, and 200 of you would post in that thread, defending your console, because you have nothing better to do.

And and at the bolded part, don't post anymore if you aren't going to say something postive about something for once about your competitor console.



darthdevidem01 said:
NightDragon83 said:
darthdevidem01 said:

This may be fine now....but by 2018 I think even 25GB may not be enough.

'm pretty sure that by the time 2018 rolls around, Nintendo will be showing off the Wii U's successor, and I seriously doubt game developers will get to the point that they require multiple 25GB or Blu-Ray discs for games.

Devs already need multilayered bu ray discs for PS3 games.....don't doubt that within 3 years 25GB, nay 50GB may be too small.


No they don't.

It all comes down to compression...

Take a PC game for instance, something like... Dragon Age Origins perhaps?  Takes up about 6-7gb on a disc, install size? 15gb+.

Compression is a very interesting thing however, some files say... a .bmp texture can be compressed to a fraction of it's size, however because it's only a fraction of it's size it takes less time to transfer that same texture from disc to the system so it can be decrompressed.
However the down side of compression is that it takes up valuable CPU cycles to decompress... Every single CPU cycle is important on a console as it's a very limited resource. (The PS3 is no exception.)
The more compression you use, the more CPU cycles you require in order to decompress it.

The PC can get away with it because installation of games allows textures (And other data) to be decompressed whilst installing, so it doesnt have to be done on the fly.
With that in mind the PC probably won't be moving on from the regular DVD for a long time to come.

The biggest advantage the Wii U has that will give it an advantage (A massive one) is the System Memory and GPU, it will initially allow the Wii to run current games at the full 1080P resolution, the current Xbox and Playstation's games are mostly rendered at 720P or lower and then upscaled to 1080P which looks down right horrible. (This coming from someone who games at a 5760x1080 Eyefinity resolution.)

25gb will be more than plenty for the next 5+ years of the consoles life, in the worst case a decent amount of compression should push it upwards of 40-50gb.



--::{PC Gaming Master Race}::--

8GB? For an 8th gen console. MP3 players have more than that these days. I mean how expensive would say 32GB of flash been? That would be acceptable.



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blazinhead89 said:
8GB? For an 8th gen console. MP3 players have more than that these days. I mean how expensive would say 32GB of flash been? That would be acceptable.

Four times as much



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Viper1 said:
SvennoJ said:
Kynes said:


That was a way to try to justify the superiority of Blu-Ray discs. DTS and AC-3 are lossy algorithms, but have such a high quality in their highest bit rates available,  that are indistinguishable from the uncompressed sound.

But the game is the production stage, that's where the sounds are mixed, reverberation and other effects are added and projected over 5.1 or 7.1 channels. To get the best results you need lossless compressed audio, preferably in 24bit 96khz to give you enough headroom to do all the calculations. You can downsample it after all the mixing is done and all effects are added. However outputting it in 24bit 96khz is still preferable if your amp is going to apply extra filters and effects as well.

For textures compression doesn't matter as much as resolution. If the WiiU is going to do 1080p then you better get some higher res versions of textures for up close, requiring a lot more space.

25gb should be enough without too much pre rendered fmv. The Witcher 2, although not so high quality in the sound department, has pretty good texture detail for 1080p and is about 15gb. But if you add tons of high quality pre-rendered fmv in 2D and 3D versions then a 12gb game quickly turns into 41gb, see Killzone 3.

Anyway the chances that 3rd party devs are going to do HD sound mixing and make higher res textures for WiiU ports is pretty much 0. Nor do I think Nintendo will do it themselves. Stylized graphics is their strong point, not detail, same for sound effects. But it's nice to have 25gb available for ps4 / nextbox ports.

Keep in mind that the Blu-ray drive in the PS3 is slow (only 2x) and developers have used redundant data for most games as a way to reduce seek times and disc spins.  If the optical drive in Wii U is faster (and I see no reason why it won't be as even the cheapest of the cheap BD drives are 4x with most being 8-12x now with still 18 months to go) then the volume of redundant data will be reduced greatly - likely to no redundancy needed at all.

Witcher 2 is also coming to the X360 now.  We'll see how much of an impact the lower capacity has on the graphics, content and audio and how the faster drive speed of the X360 reduces redundant data.

[PS3 - 9 MB/s || X360 - 16.2 MB/s]

Redundant data and installs will still be neccesary due to the way blu-ray operates. blu-ray will always have longer seek times then dvd since dvd uses cav (constant angular velocity), while blu-ray uses clv. (constant lineair velocity)

Dvds always spin at the same rate, resulting in faster reading at the outer edge (the 16.2 mb/s), but slower at the inner edge (8 mb/s) Blu-ray always reads at the same data rate by spinning the disk faster when reading the inner edge. Changing the velocity of the disk when seeking to another track takes extra time. Maybe Nintendo will use a proprietary blu-ray disk drive that uses cav, better suited for gaming.

For the witcher 2 on 360, the textures will most likely be downsampled due to memory limitations and 720p max anyway. That will save a ton of space. It will still need redundant data or use hdd cache, the 15gb is all on hdd installed from 2 dvds. Maybe they'll put it on 2 dvds, there's no reason not to. The Prologue and chapter 1 on disk 1, chapter 2 and the smaller chapter 3 on disk 2.

The witcher 2 would be nice as a launch title for WiiU though. Have all the info, mini games and configurable shortcut keys on the controller and the game on tv with high res textures, yes please.



USB Hard Drive? Nice.. i'm gonna buy a 500gb then, even if it isn't needed... they are pretty freaking cheap these days anyway




Lots of great posts in this thread, and radiant shadow... I mean for MODs' sakes complaining because you need to get a 1TB HD drive. And making that a reason for not getting a console? EHDDs are reasonably priced for anyone serious in downloading considerable amounts of content. You pay for what you want, not more. Add to that I hate the PS and XBOX bundles, with their different SKUs, so much better like this, power to the player.

Edit: Removed the flaming and curse word. Not a good thing to do no matter what. Play4fun's reply hit it much better than mine anyway.



blazinhead89 said:
8GB? For an 8th gen console. MP3 players have more than that these days. I mean how expensive would say 32GB of flash been? That would be acceptable.

Tha would add about $20 to the price of the console.



The rEVOLution is not being televised