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Forums - Microsoft Discussion - 5th year of Xbox 360 : The Unreal Engine Effect.

gekkokamen on 26 February 2010

Good article, very informative. But it's not about engines alone, it's about work, talent and time.



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Lord Flashheart on 26 February 2010

Can everyone put the food away please.



Official member of the Xbox 360 Squad

Jeronimo66 on 26 February 2010

YOU GUYS KNOW MICROSOFT USES THIS ENGINE AS THEIR MAIN ENGINE FOR GAMES.

AT LEAST FOR THIRD PARTIES. HALO I DON'T THINK IS USING UNREAL.



selnor on 26 February 2010
Ultibankai said:
selnor said:
JaggedSac said:
Where did you read that Halo:Reach was using 4xAA, I have not heard that.

Secondly, Rare's engine that they created for Viva Pinata and used in BK:N&B is pretty darn good as well. Uses tessellation.

Based on the trailer that was ingame it's confirmed 4xMSAA. When asked, Bungie replied " Thanks to EDRam ". Also tessellation is impressive, but MSAA is astonishing to see 4xMSAA on consoles.KZ2 for instance uses 2xQSAA. QSAA has less than half the performance hit of MSAA but as a downfall blurrs textures alot. Which is why although MSAA is harder for a system to handle it's always the best option to go with if your PC or cnsole can handle it. Uncharted 2 is the only PS3 game to use MSAA. It uses 2xMSAA but not for shadows or effects.

Incorrect.  GT5:Prologue has 4xMSAA when running in 720p.  That's all I wanted to say... continue.

The AA in GT5p and supposedly in GT5 is only on the cars. Have you read the amount of complaints of jaggies in GT5P? They are everywhere on the net. Many places like Digital Foundry and Beyond 3d also reckon that AA being in GT5P is one reason why the scenery detail is low. You have to remeber to do MSAA requires alot of resources, processing power plus memory. Possibly a reason for only 120hertz physics?

However I'm talking about complete 4xMSAA ( shadows, textures, polygons etc. ) AA is quite complex.



Twistedpixel on 26 February 2010
BW_JP said:

really?

Alan wake was finished 4 years ago for PC.

 

Also, none of the games announced for 360 this year can hold a flame to uncharted 2 or killzone 2. Now that god of war 3 makes those 2 games look last generation, you can guess what it does to 360 exclusives.

 

 

If it was finished 4 years ago then what have they been doing for the past 4 years?

1. Masturbating.

2. Adding then deleting content for the hell of it.

3. Living the high life off Microsofts chequebook.

4. A combination of the above.

 



Do you know what its like to live on the far side of Uranus?

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FastFord58 on 26 February 2010

Ah quincux....the vaseline filter. I was unaware that quincux was the fault for some of the low-res(looking) texture work in KZ2.

I was also unaware of this whole eDRAM situation on the 360. Alan Wake is very impressive, especially given the amount of organic scenery in the game (trees, fauna). Reach again is very impressive based on scale alone.



"Man is born free but is everywhere in chains" - Rousseau

Jeronimo66 on 26 February 2010

OH YEA NICE READ SELNOR, DIDN'T KNOW ALL THIS.

LOOKING FORWARD TO SEEING HALO: REACH AND ALAN WAKE IN ACTION.

 



Alceste007 on 26 February 2010

Nice article Selnor, while I have been pretty happy with Mass Effect / Gears. I am looking forward to seeing how much further the graphics can go on the 360.



selnor on 26 February 2010
BW_JP said:
selnor said:
BW_JP said:
selnor said:
libellule said:
I m not sure those will beat the kings that Gears1/2 or Uncharted2 are

It is not a question about PS3 or 360, it is just that Halo Reach is focusing on upgrading from Halo3 gfx using a new engine able to run a lot of item on screen. I doubt it will become a graphical king contender.
Halo Reach could still be the prettiest Halo ever made and maybe the best one too.

Same goes for Alan Wake : a 4 (?) years game started for PC then going 360 exclusive is not gonna define the new graphical king.
Alan Wake may still be the GOTY 2010 with an insane atmosphere and story and particularly pretty lighting effect.

Neverthless, you are right on the "no specific engine for the 360" ... that is true.


Alan Wake started dev on 360 form day 1, just so you know. Also, I never referred to graphics as such. But technical capabilities. Graphics are 20 % of providing good tech. I was more referring to an engine as a whole. having 4xMSAA on a console game is astonishing. first time ever. And at no cost to the resources. Simly play Crysis on an uber PC and see the FPS difference between changing MSAA up and down to see the performance hit.

Both Alan Wake and Halo Reach as Engines are truly ahead of UE3 by miles and miles.

really?

Alan wake was finished 4 years ago for PC.

 

Also, none of the games announced for 360 this year can hold a flame to uncharted 2 or killzone 2. Now that god of war 3 makes those 2 games look last generation, you can guess what it does to 360 exclusives.

 

 

Your talking from purely a visual asspect. That does not in anyway show the power or capabilities of a system. KZ2 used 2xQSAA for example. Which is why alot of people will say about poor textures in it compared to Uncharted 2. If for instance KZ2 used 4xMSAA its likely the framerate would be unplayable. There is a huge performace effect from using QSAA to MSAA. And even more so when only 2xQSAA is used as opposed to 4xMSAA.

No. God of war 3 uses a proprietary anti-aliasing algorithm that is _almost_ as good as 64xMLAA, I'm not sure what that is in MSAA, but its higher than 16x.

 

Again this method is not just a PS3 ability. Also available on 360. But the drawback again is blurring of textures. Many tests have showed this. Also it has issues with lighting and sahdows, similar to Quincunx. MSAA is still the standard for the best overall picture quality. Foliage, Shadows, Textures and polygons.



Jeronimo66 on 26 February 2010

I hope the next xbox uses realistic reflections aka ray-tracing the reflections in todays games are created, sorry to burst anyones bubbles, but that is the next breakthrough in graphics, games will look life-like, can't wait to see the specs on the first processor thats going to be capable of that.