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Forums - Gaming Discussion - Hypothetically Speaking.. What would happen if FFXIII Flops?

perpride on 23 September 2009

I think people are slightly underestimating the power of Final Fantasy :)



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Maelstrome on 23 September 2009
loves2splooge said:

FFXIII sales are going to be lower than usual in Japan because of the limited PS3 userbase over there. I also predict that FFXIII sales outside of Japan aren't going to be as hot as FF sales were in the past due to the declining interest in Final Fantasy and jrpgs in general. And it just makes sense. JRPGs have failed to grow up with their audience. FF7 may have been cool when you were a pre-teen or teen but guess what? All those pre-teens and teens who played FF7 are now in their twenties. You think a bunch of twenty-somethings are going to be just as hyped up for 60-hour cliched melodramas with tedious gameplay as they were in their pre-teens/teens? Plenty of those twenty-somethings moved on to western rpgs and FPS. And many of them are not coming back unless the jrpg dramatically changes. I myself have pretty much given up the genre (and I've given it a lot more chances than I should have) but yet I still have this hope that it will get better so I'll for sure end up buying FFXIII anyway. lol. But honestly, for the most part, playing those games feel like such a complete waste of time to me and not exactly the most enjoyable way to burn a whole bunch of hours.

Right now the genre has become more and more niche, appealing to a much more narrow dedicated hardcore fanbase. The FF name alone will sell a lot and I'd be shocked if it didn't outsell the top western rpg (worldwide, americas might be a different story) but it's not going to be like the FF7 and FFX days. Providing a cinematic gaming experience isn't as cool and novel as it was a decade ago.

As for what happens in the case of a flop, Square Enix may shift their focus to the DS. It worked for DQIX. That's pretty much where a niche genre like this belongs now given the large expenses for HD development. At least on the DS we have that whole illusion of nostalgia to make these kind of games seem better than they really are. We can try to convince ourselves that things were better with Chrono Trigger, FF6 and FF7 but we only think that because our memories are clouded by nostalgia and let's face it, it was much easier for us to be impressed back in our early years and when the jrpg experience seemed fresher to us.

while i largely agree with you, i myself as well as many i know go back and play older rpgs and overall find them more engaging and less cliche.

like i said i think se needs to move there focus. back on the snes and ps1 se developped way more rpgs than they do now. it doesnt have to be about ff anymore. it may just be time for something new.



Magnific0 on 23 September 2009
loves2splooge said:

FFXIII sales are going to be lower than usual in Japan because of the limited PS3 userbase over there. I also predict that FFXIII sales outside of Japan aren't going to be as hot as FF sales were in the past due to the declining interest in Final Fantasy and jrpgs in general. And it just makes sense. JRPGs have failed to grow up with their audience. FF7 may have been cool when you were a pre-teen or teen but guess what? All those pre-teens and teens who played FF7 are now in their twenties. You think a bunch of twenty-somethings are going to be just as hyped up for 60-hour cliched melodramas with tedious gameplay as they were in their pre-teens/teens? Plenty of those twenty-somethings moved on to western rpgs and FPS. And many of them are not coming back unless the jrpg dramatically changes. I myself have pretty much given up the genre (and I've given it a lot more chances than I should have) but yet I still have this hope that it will get better so I'll for sure end up buying FFXIII anyway. lol. But honestly, for the most part, playing those games feel like such a complete waste of time to me and not exactly the most enjoyable way to burn a whole bunch of hours.

Right now the genre has become more and more niche, appealing to a much more narrow dedicated hardcore fanbase. The FF name alone will sell a lot and I'd be shocked if it didn't outsell the top western rpg (worldwide, americas might be a different story) but it's not going to be like the FF7 and FFX days. Providing a cinematic gaming experience isn't as cool and novel as it was a decade ago.

As for what happens in the case of a flop, Square Enix may shift their focus to the DS. It worked for DQIX. That's pretty much where a niche genre like this belongs now given the large expenses for HD development. At least on the DS we have that whole illusion of nostalgia to make these kind of games seem better than they really are. We can try to convince ourselves that things were better with Chrono Trigger, FF6 and FF7 but we only think that because our memories are clouded by nostalgia and let's face it, it was much easier for us to be impressed back in our early years and when the jrpg experience seemed fresher to us.


1. What limited PS3 userbase? the PS3 installed base just grew 200K in the last 2 weeks and it'll keep going up. As FFXIII release gets closer the hardware sales boost will begin and once it hits the streets 250K PS3s in a single week is a mark very achievable. 5 million PS3 installed base by the end of the year is not out of the question (holidays, bundles).

2. Outside of Japan JRPGs have lost some strength because honestly, the commanding console which got most of them, first of all it hasn't got anything of the quality of a FF game, and second their userbase are a bunch of FPS lovers.

3. It won't flop. Quality sells, and if anyone knows how to adapt to the ever-changing market is Square-Enix. I'm sure they have developed a game that can be enjoyed by all kind of audiences, specially today's "hardcore" audience.

 



Magnific0 on 23 September 2009

One more thing, FFX sold MILLIONS with only a "limited" PS2 base and it sold very well I don't think only kids on their pre-teens bought it. FFX debuted on 2001 by the way, and 15-18 year olds who played and loved FFVII , I figured had nothing against FFX 5 years later when they were 20-23...



wenlan on 23 September 2009

FFXIII flops => mainly because of the poor sale # in Japan.

Microsoft will be the one that receives most of the blames and SE is the next.

Don't mean to raise the idea of protectionism here in the US forum... The truth is, a lot of Japanese gamers are pissed when SE announced FFXIII will goes to X360. A lot of people believe that's the main reason why SE announced FFvXIII to be "worldwide exclusive to PS3" so soon after the FFXIII announcement last year. Go read the posts at 2ch forum last year and you will find out.

Whether Japanese FF fans will boycott FFXIII remains to be seen. But come to think of it, maybe that's why Famitsu made such a lowball estimate on FFXIII sale in Japan........ I hope SE and SCEJ will do a better job promoting FFXIII at this year's TGS.



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ShadowSoldier on 23 September 2009
Aion said:
perpride said:
Final Fantasy XIII cannot flop. Unless people in the world just seriosley don't like quality video games anymore.

Wait do you mean in terms of sales or critical acclaim? Realistically, FFXIII can't fail in either department. But assuming it would:

- JRPG's would lose their flagship franchise.
- As a result, WRPG's would reign supreme.
- People like myself would be extremely sad and probably play half as much video games.
- Square Enix would be finished.
- Finally, I would lose both of my bets against S.T.A.G.E and that would be just depressing.

Completly agreed.

Seconded. Also I think the Wii would get the franchise and I'd hate to see that. Why I don't like Motion Controls and Sub-par graphics. (Not Trying to troll just my preference)



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Maelstrome on 23 September 2009
ShadowSoldier said:

Seconded. Also I think the Wii would get the franchise and I'd hate to see that. Why I don't like Motion Controls and Sub-par graphics. (Not Trying to troll just my preference)

the motion control is irrelevent. tos didnt use them i doubt a new numbered ff would. but as far as graphics go ever since 7, ff has always tried to push visuals. now they could easily make it look like a somewhat amped ffx but thats about it. im sure a numbered ff would do great on wii but only because of the fact its ff. now its a posibility that since the visuals couldnt be pushed as much they would push the other aspects of the game. that may just be wishful thinking though. all in all ive moved myself to dragonquest.

(why does my spellcheck not work here?)



Kenryoku_Maxis on 23 September 2009
perpride said:
Final Fantasy XIII cannot flop. Unless people in the world just seriosley don't like quality video games anymore.

Wait do you mean in terms of sales or critical acclaim? Realistically, FFXIII can't fail in either department. But assuming it would:

- JRPG's would lose their flagship franchise.
- As a result, WRPG's would reign supreme.
- People like myself would be extremely sad and probably play half as much video games.
- Square Enix would be finished.
- Finally, I would lose both of my bets against S.T.A.G.E and that would be just depressing.

FFXIII could very well fail in sales.  SE has placed way too much faith on this title.  Realistically, this title needs to sell over 2 million units just to make a solid profit.  And probably 3-4 million just to be a 'success'.  And even then, it's going to be less sales than DQIX will get, a DS title with a much lower development cost and international expectations.

Also, in reference to your points:

-Final Fantasy being 'JRPG flagship franchise' is arguable.  In Japan, its Dragon Quest.  In America, Final Fantasy already is losing dominance to series such as Namco's Tales series, Atlus titles such as Disgaea and of course, the machine that is known as Pokemon.

-WRPGs, while showing their own in quality games in recent years still aren't topping JRPGs in sales or sheer number of titles produced.

-Is Final Fantasy really half your Gaming line-up?  And will One failed game kill your gaming life?

-SquareEnix won't be finished by FFXIII.  It may be a good thing if FFXIII flopped.  They've been relying on FF for WAY too long, always making each next title more and more expensive and bigger, at the expense of all their other titles.

-Sure would.

Personally, I'm not rooting for FFXIII to fail, but SE DESPERATELY needs a dose of bitter medicine.  Their only idea of how to make money is 'throw more money into development' and 'make it with more FMVs'.  And I fear the only way their going to learn to change this practice is to have one of their flagship titles fail.



Six upcoming games you should look into:

 

  

outlawauron on 23 September 2009
Kenryoku_Maxis said:
perpride said:
Final Fantasy XIII cannot flop. Unless people in the world just seriosley don't like quality video games anymore.

Wait do you mean in terms of sales or critical acclaim? Realistically, FFXIII can't fail in either department. But assuming it would:

- JRPG's would lose their flagship franchise.
- As a result, WRPG's would reign supreme.
- People like myself would be extremely sad and probably play half as much video games.
- Square Enix would be finished.
- Finally, I would lose both of my bets against S.T.A.G.E and that would be just depressing.

FFXIII could very well fail in sales.  SE has placed way too much faith on this title.  Realistically, this title needs to sell over 2 million units just to make a solid profit.  And probably 3-4 million just to be a 'success'.  And even then, it's going to be less sales than DQIX will get, a DS title with a much lower development cost and international expectations.

Also, in reference to your points:

-Final Fantasy being 'JRPG flagship franchise' is arguable.  In Japan, its Dragon Quest.  In America, Final Fantasy already is losing dominance to series such as Namco's Tales series, Atlus titles such as Disgaea and of course, the machine that is known as Pokemon.

-WRPGs, while showing their own in quality games in recent years still aren't topping JRPGs in sales or sheer number of titles produced.

-Is Final Fantasy really half your Gaming line-up?  And will One failed game kill your gaming life?

-SquareEnix won't be finished by FFXIII.  It may be a good thing if FFXIII flopped.  They've been relying on FF for WAY too long, always making each next title more and more expensive and bigger, at the expense of all their other titles.

-Sure would.

Personally, I'm not rooting for FFXIII to fail, but SE DESPERATELY needs a dose of bitter medicine.  Their only idea of how to make money is 'throw more money into development' and 'make it with more FMVs'.  And I fear the only way their going to learn to change this practice is to have one of their flagship titles fail.

Come on now. Please don't tell me you actually believe that crap.



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Kenryoku_Maxis on 23 September 2009
outlawauron said:
Kenryoku_Maxis said:
perpride said:
Final Fantasy XIII cannot flop. Unless people in the world just seriosley don't like quality video games anymore.

Wait do you mean in terms of sales or critical acclaim? Realistically, FFXIII can't fail in either department. But assuming it would:

- JRPG's would lose their flagship franchise.
- As a result, WRPG's would reign supreme.
- People like myself would be extremely sad and probably play half as much video games.
- Square Enix would be finished.
- Finally, I would lose both of my bets against S.T.A.G.E and that would be just depressing.

FFXIII could very well fail in sales.  SE has placed way too much faith on this title.  Realistically, this title needs to sell over 2 million units just to make a solid profit.  And probably 3-4 million just to be a 'success'.  And even then, it's going to be less sales than DQIX will get, a DS title with a much lower development cost and international expectations.

Also, in reference to your points:

-Final Fantasy being 'JRPG flagship franchise' is arguable.  In Japan, its Dragon Quest.  In America, Final Fantasy already is losing dominance to series such as Namco's Tales series, Atlus titles such as Disgaea and of course, the machine that is known as Pokemon.

-WRPGs, while showing their own in quality games in recent years still aren't topping JRPGs in sales or sheer number of titles produced.

-Is Final Fantasy really half your Gaming line-up?  And will One failed game kill your gaming life?

-SquareEnix won't be finished by FFXIII.  It may be a good thing if FFXIII flopped.  They've been relying on FF for WAY too long, always making each next title more and more expensive and bigger, at the expense of all their other titles.

-Sure would.

Personally, I'm not rooting for FFXIII to fail, but SE DESPERATELY needs a dose of bitter medicine.  Their only idea of how to make money is 'throw more money into development' and 'make it with more FMVs'.  And I fear the only way their going to learn to change this practice is to have one of their flagship titles fail.

Come on now. Please don't tell me you actually believe that crap.

Uh...many of the same people who are heavy console RPG fans play both series.  I already know countless people who have passed up major Final Fantasy releases for Tales games, Disgaea sequels, Persona, Fire Emblem or the other major title I named, Pokemon.  Why else do you think many of the Final Fantasy remakes and sequels as of late have been of such low sales (aside from the obvious oversaturation)?  FFIVDS, FFTactics Advance 2, FFTactics Remake, etc.  These all underperformed beyond expectations.



Six upcoming games you should look into: