What does maxing out mean? That's the problem. There is no clear definition.

Every piece of HW can theoritically be maxed out easily - just overwhelm the engine.

And depending upon the game that means different things. I could have amazing graphics with few moving objects and simpified physics or average graphics with amazing physics - which is maxing out the console more?

This whole notion is a bit meaningless. You could max out both the PS3 and 360 with CoD4 tomorrow if you overloaded the engine - on PC where editors are common its easy to fill a map with stuff to see how far you can push your PC before it crumbles. 360 and PS3 are no different.

IMHO it's really about optimization - what, per major genre/engine type, is the theoretical upper limit with well optimized code while still having satisfactory frame rate, etc?

Also, why are there never any Wii maxed out threads?

Imperial said:   I'm one of those people who expect exclusives to look better than multiplatforms because of the obvious technical limitations the developers face when doing either , you of all people should know that , it counts for both consoles. We can argue endlessly on particular games but if we look at the bigger picture , the PS3 wins cummilativley , always setting the new standard. You obviously don't realise this because of your blind dedication to the 360. Despite my strong affiliation with the playstation brand , I still know what's what.

...Says the guy with the Sony Defense Force signature.

You know, you'd hope that a much more expensive system would have a slight edge on graphical capabilities.

mrstickball said: Imperial said:   I'm one of those people who expect exclusives to look better than multiplatforms because of the obvious technical limitations the developers face when doing either , you of all people should know that , it counts for both consoles. We can argue endlessly on particular games but if we look at the bigger picture , the PS3 wins cummilativley , always setting the new standard. You obviously don't realise this because of your blind dedication to the 360. Despite my strong affiliation with the playstation brand , I still know what's what. ...Says the guy with the Sony Defense Force signature. You know, you'd hope that a much more expensive system would have a slight edge on graphical capabilities.

Totally agree!

 

P.S, mrstickball just owned Imperial lol,

P.P.S, Forza 3 proves the 360 is not maxed out at all whilst also looking better than ps3's best games (GT5:P etc)

mrstickball said: Imperial said:   I'm one of those people who expect exclusives to look better than multiplatforms because of the obvious technical limitations the developers face when doing either , you of all people should know that , it counts for both consoles. We can argue endlessly on particular games but if we look at the bigger picture , the PS3 wins cummilativley , always setting the new standard. You obviously don't realise this because of your blind dedication to the 360. Despite my strong affiliation with the playstation brand , I still know what's what. ...Says the guy with the Sony Defense Force signature. You know, you'd hope that a much more expensive system would have a slight edge on graphical capabilities.

Hmmm, and the one thing E309 has shown is all that extra money spent on a PS3 certainly isnt becasue it's more powerful. It's clear if you scout the internet in alot of different forums, that the 360 certainly at the very least holds it's own in graphics against the PS3. In many respects the 360 outdone PS3 at E3. Not only did M$ have full playable demos of Forza 3, Splinter Cell and Alan Wake but more importantly for me is the multiplat games that looked as good and better than some exclusive games. Like LP2, AC2 and Dirt 2.

cleaner475 said: rckrz6 said: flame bait.. why do you post this Your always saying that and to be honest its getting a bit boring -almost all threads these days someone posts 'flamebait' on it - Whats the point of ahving any discussion at all - don't post at all if you can't understand what the whole point of a forum is

I understand both sides here. Why rckrz6 posted flamebait and why other people are complaining for it. I don't think this is full blown flame bait, but what makes it a little like flamebait is why this thread was started. It's not for discussing console architecture and making comparisons. This thread was started to point out a person who believes the same thing alot of sony fans do. The ps3 is more impressive graphically than the 360. Therefore throwing fuel at sony fanboys to just clamor "it's settled, PS3 is graphics king!!!!" Then the sony boys will clamor ps3 the best this gen on the basis of graphics. The lalst two sentences are the result of flambaiting. Even if this thread was just to dicuss two consoles' technology, we all know the animosity it would spark from both sides so one would be hard pressed to go through with it.

Personally, I believe the graphics get's pointed out too much and incorrectly. This isn't a valid point. It has not been proving the ps3 is more powerful than the 360. Personally, I think it's slightly more powerful, but this is very slight and not even discernable to the untrained eye, and impossibly to the gaming eye. Yet, it's always pointed out. I think the ps3 has a few more graphically impressive games but this is only because sony has made this one of it's selling points. Sony themselves are pushing this and are probably instructing some of their major developers to try to get the maximum graphical output that their respective games and circumstances allow. They could also be aquiring developers who are vested in trying to make technically superior games.

Even if ps3's graphical superiority is proven without a shadow of a doubt sometime this gen, I don't believe it should be pointed out that much, especially by sony fanboys. Last gen the ps2 was clearly the inferior console in terms of graphics and the sony fanboys downplayed but also correctly pointed out how important graphics are to a great game. Which is very little. So to be so ecstatic over the perceived notion that the ps3 is graphically superior and using this to claim it's the better console is hypocritical. From now on, unless a sony fan reveals that last gen they regarded graphics as importantly as they do now, and hated the xbox for being more powerful; they should not be able to brag about the ps3's perceived power.

Either that, or admit that they don't mind graphics much as long as it's current gen graphics and therefore can't clamor x 360 game sucks because it doesn't look as pretty as x ps3 game. You guys have proven that you can go a whole generation playing graphically inferior games and love them. Graphics should not deter anyone from writing off a great game or purchasing one regardless of what console it is on. Especially this gen when the gap between graphics is so much smaller.

On related news, I'd just like to say that my dishwasher is maxed out, but my refrigerator isn't.

selnor said: BMaker11 said: Imperial said: selnor said: BMaker11 said: NoCtiS_NoX said: http://www.oxm.co.uk/article.php?id=11181   EA: 360 maxed out, PlayStation3 isn't Soderlund's comments came during E3, as he spoke to OXM about Microsoft's E3 presence. "I like the Natal," he says. "That's cool. It's an interesting device, so I'm truly impressed by Xbox. It's my personal favourite console... I think Microsoft is on a roll right now. They're doing really well. If I was Sony, I would have a headache, to be honest." However, he then goes on to say "Sony has a lot of good games this year. If you go to their booth, there's a very consistent, high quality product line-up and that will help them. I do think that we'll see developers inside the organisation getting to understand the PS3 better and I think that we're getting more power out of PS3 right now... I think that we've maxed out the 360 but we haven't maxed out the PS3." Do you guys agree? Discuss. I guess you haven't been here very long. If you were, you'd know that everyone on VGC are experts on the consoles and know when a system is maxed out (without even developing for the system), and that developers don't know shit (who have been developing for the consoles for years). Add in a little bit of "When was the last time they made a good game?" and then NO developer has any credibility, because the quality of a game is subjective. Add a dash of "I think" and "there's no way they're right", then VGC members actually become the developers themselves! So of course they don't agree @selnor How do you know those games *aren't* pushing the 360? And secondly....no. Uncharted 2 and Heavy is all I have to say Major LOL. Uncharted 2? KZ2 looks beter than Uncharted 2. And Heavy Rain is a mix. Sometimes it looks great ( particualrly indoors ) but outdoors it's pretty avarage. Also main characters are highly detailed, but others are meh. Niether game gets my vote for E3. Best graphics at E3 IMO were, ( BEST GRAPHICS FULL STOP) AC2 < (UNCHARTED 2) Doesn't even matter, it's multiplatforms Alan Wake < ( Heavy Rain) Forza 3 <(GT5) Lost Planet  <(Killzone 2) Doesn't even matter, it's multiplatform Dirt 2 <(GT5) Doesn't even matter, it's multiplatform Splinter Cell Conviction and Uncharted 2 look like great games but both graphically are pipped by the above. Your claiming the Uncharted 2 (developed by one of the best developers on the planet , Naughty Dog) is inferior to multi-platform Assasins Creed 2 ? Even though those games are multplat, your counterargument still stands OK, so your one of these people who dont except some multiplat games look better than exclusives. LOL. PS3 owners will try and squirm anyway possible. KZ2 in no way looks better than Lost planet 2. Assains Creed 2 >>>>Uncharted 2. Easy. GT5 has had no gameplay shown. Even the replay mode stuff in the 2nd half of GT5 trailer doesnt look as good as the replay stuff from Forza 3. Dirt 2 again gameplay was shown, looked phenominal. And Alan Wake>>>>>>>>>> Heavy Rain. The lighting in Alan Wake was simply on another level to any game. This is my opinion, but I'm far from alone on this. Also to those saying PS3 has always been in front with graphics. I think you take to much Marajuana. Uncharted was the pinnacle for PS3 at one point. Before that Gears 1 ruled the roost. It's arueable when Gears 2 dropped that it was the leader untill KZ2. But E309 certainly shows how much BS Sony talked about the power difference over 360. I said all along that there would eventually be bugger all in it. And E309 shows just that. I bet Uncharted 2 or Heavy Rain will not get the most media Graphics awards of E3. Although I have nothing left to bet with.

'Killzone 2 in no way looks better then Lost Planet 2'? 'Assassins Creed 2 looks better then Uncharted 2'?

The only area I think LP2 has even a remote chance of eclipsing KZ2 is perhaps in scale. The monsters shown were huge.

Take a look at the E3 demo video LP2 doesn't look that special. Textures and animation need improvement.

Assassins Creed 2 doesn't even look in the same league as Uncharted 2 at the moment. There are still noticable clipping and graphics issues evident in the AC2 trailer shown and nothing in it managed to 'wow' me. Uncharted 2 had a thread posted the other day on here because people were so impressed with it's graphics, most noticeably the huge draw distances and sheer amount of action on-screen. It looks like its going to have far higher production values.

You refuse to agree that GT5 looks the best, so I'll ignore that section.

I agree with you that Alan Wake looks better then Heavy Rain.

 

BTW, has anyone seen the gameplay video of lost planet 2 in HD??? Despite this being a multiplatform game, this game's level of detail is mindboggling. The grass, the rain, the lighting and the physics of the natural elements of the terrain. They move as they would in real life!!!

Also, check out the new castlevania, also multiplat but it looks insanely amazing. It looks more detailed more realistic and is done at a much grander scale than god or war 3. For anyone who will object for my comparison of castlevania to god of war; they've changed the art direction of the franchise and made it more like god of war.

Imperial said: waron said: Heavy Rain better looking than Alan Wake? good luck. we will talk when you will pick actual game and not 9hour long QTE. also Forza 3>>>>>>GT5P. GT5 will be released maybe next year and that CGI didn't even looked as good as ingame Forza 3 video made by team Blackjack. and yes Lost Planet 2 is THE BEST loking action game this generation. and lol at comparison Assassins Creed 2 and Uncharted 2 - i guess than i can compare Forza 3 and Calling All Cars since you're comparing sandbox game and game like Uncharted 2. To each his own , I won't argue against your opinion no matter how inferior it is to mine.

oh and Alan Wake is a sandbox game as well so this comparison is even more ridiculous. but hey if we are comparing games then:

graphics: Forza3>>>>>>>>Modnation Racing

Shadow Complex>>>>>>>>Fat Princess

1vs 100 >>>> Agent - well pretty much everything beats a sign so...

Milo>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>every minigame sony showed with their wiimote ripoff

exploration and gameplay aspect: Alan Wake>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Heavy Rain

mrstickball said: Imperial said:   I'm one of those people who expect exclusives to look better than multiplatforms because of the obvious technical limitations the developers face when doing either , you of all people should know that , it counts for both consoles. We can argue endlessly on particular games but if we look at the bigger picture , the PS3 wins cummilativley , always setting the new standard. You obviously don't realise this because of your blind dedication to the 360. Despite my strong affiliation with the playstation brand , I still know what's what. ...Says the guy with the Sony Defense Force signature. You know, you'd hope that a much more expensive system would have a slight edge on graphical capabilities.

So Killzone is only slightly superior to everything on the 360 , I think not ?

The increased cost offers alot of benefits for free you'd have to pay for on the 360.

 

I need Wi-FI  , got that for free .

I prefer to play my games online ,got that for free.

I prefer to watch BR movies , built in.

Prefer Larger HD size , very cheap.

Prefer superior technology , well worth the price.