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Forums - General Discussion - Does National Health Care Really Work?

TheRealMafoo on 09 May 2009
MrBubbles said:

canadas medical system would be able to better support its population if they didnt have the US right next door offering piles of money to anyone willing to leave here and go work there. there is no mindless anti-americanism in that...

 

I would agree, provided every medical breakthrough the US created due to these Canadians were never allowed to be used in your medical system.



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Tyrannical on 09 May 2009
highwaystar101 said:
Here's a situation I imagine is all too common. A very poor isolated community, where no-one has money, has the army come and offer jobs to the people of the town. A few people decide to join up seeing it as a way to feed their families as it is easier than getting a job in the poor town. They go to Iraq and get involved in conflicts, many of them come back with serious injuries that require attention. without Government grants for healthcare or national healthcare who would they turn to? Because no-one else they know has little money anyway, not enough to spare.

 

 You must have the US confused with some third world country. Or perhaps some other part of Europe.



Yet, today, America's leaders are reenacting every folly that brought these great powers [Russia, Germany, and Japan] to ruin -- from arrogance and hubris, to assertions of global hegemony, to imperial overstretch, to trumpeting new 'crusades,' to handing out war guarantees to regions and countries where Americans have never fought before. We are piling up the kind of commitments that produced the greatest disasters of the twentieth century.
 — Pat Buchanan – A Republic, Not an Empire

highwaystar101 on 09 May 2009
Tyrannical said:
highwaystar101 said:
Here's a situation I imagine is all too common. A very poor isolated community, where no-one has money, has the army come and offer jobs to the people of the town. A few people decide to join up seeing it as a way to feed their families as it is easier than getting a job in the poor town. They go to Iraq and get involved in conflicts, many of them come back with serious injuries that require attention. without Government grants for healthcare or national healthcare who would they turn to? Because no-one else they know has little money anyway, not enough to spare.

 

You must have the US confused with some third world country. Or perhaps some other part of Europe.

You don't read before you post, do you?

 



Tyrannical on 09 May 2009
highwaystar101 said:
Tyrannical said:
highwaystar101 said:
Here's a situation I imagine is all too common. A very poor isolated community, where no-one has money, has the army come and offer jobs to the people of the town. A few people decide to join up seeing it as a way to feed their families as it is easier than getting a job in the poor town. They go to Iraq and get involved in conflicts, many of them come back with serious injuries that require attention. without Government grants for healthcare or national healthcare who would they turn to? Because no-one else they know has little money anyway, not enough to spare.

 

You must have the US confused with some third world country. Or perhaps some other part of Europe.

You don't read before you post, do you?

 

"All too common very poor isolated communities where no one has money" does not make me think of the US. In fact, none of what you stated makes any sense because the US is not like that. You seem to think nothing happens without government involvement, which in fact is far from the truth. Too much government is often the cause of problems, not the solution.

 



Yet, today, America's leaders are reenacting every folly that brought these great powers [Russia, Germany, and Japan] to ruin -- from arrogance and hubris, to assertions of global hegemony, to imperial overstretch, to trumpeting new 'crusades,' to handing out war guarantees to regions and countries where Americans have never fought before. We are piling up the kind of commitments that produced the greatest disasters of the twentieth century.
 — Pat Buchanan – A Republic, Not an Empire

highwaystar101 on 09 May 2009
Tyrannical said:
highwaystar101 said:
Tyrannical said:
highwaystar101 said:
Here's a situation I imagine is all too common. A very poor isolated community, where no-one has money, has the army come and offer jobs to the people of the town. A few people decide to join up seeing it as a way to feed their families as it is easier than getting a job in the poor town. They go to Iraq and get involved in conflicts, many of them come back with serious injuries that require attention. without Government grants for healthcare or national healthcare who would they turn to? Because no-one else they know has little money anyway, not enough to spare.

 

You must have the US confused with some third world country. Or perhaps some other part of Europe.

You don't read before you post, do you?

 

"All too common very poor isolated communities where no one has money" does not make me think of the US. In fact, none of what you stated makes any sense because the US is not like that. You seem to think nothing happens without government involvement, which in fact is far from the truth. Too much government is often the cause of problems, not the solution.

 

That was a case I used to back up about four posts I had previously posted, more or less right before this post. you can't post about that without acknowledging the post where I spoke about my housemates because this was a hypothetical situation to back up the point that they made about national health.



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Aquietguy on 09 May 2009
Thatmax said:

 

Thats pretty irrelivant. Discovering new medicine has nothing to do with the healthcare system.
Well it is relevant. It's our private system that is responsible for the latest R&D into new medicines and procedures. And it's our private for profit system creates an incentive to invest the millions it takes. Who's going to invest those millions if they won't get a return on it? So the rest of the world can thank America for the leading edge R&D. If it weren't for it most of the drugs and procedures we have today wouldn't exist. 

 

 



Tyrannical on 09 May 2009
highwaystar101 said:

That was a case I used to back up about four posts I had previously posted, more or less right before this post. you can't post about that without acknowledging the post where I spoke about my housemates because this was a hypothetical situation to back up the point that they made about national health.

 

 You can't make shit up that is ridicuously wrong, then claim it backs up some hypothetical point you made, and then get pissed that I don't care your UK flat mates are nurses, as if that makes then some type of policy expect on health care in the US.

I have used the US health care system, and am quite happy with it. Most people in the US do not want nationalized healthcare, and if the Democrats keep pushing it they are not going to get re-elected. That's why Bill Clinton shut up about it ten years ago.

Let me illustarate it with a picture. This is how most (as in numerical majority) Americans feel about socialized medicine.



Yet, today, America's leaders are reenacting every folly that brought these great powers [Russia, Germany, and Japan] to ruin -- from arrogance and hubris, to assertions of global hegemony, to imperial overstretch, to trumpeting new 'crusades,' to handing out war guarantees to regions and countries where Americans have never fought before. We are piling up the kind of commitments that produced the greatest disasters of the twentieth century.
 — Pat Buchanan – A Republic, Not an Empire

hsrob on 09 May 2009
Tyrannical said:
hsrob said:
Tyrannical said:

Now you're just being silly.

World class medical colleges produce world class doctors.

 

world class doctors ≠ world class health system.

 

 

 Good luck providing a world class health system without it. But if you're more comfortable beleiving the lies about the US health care system, go ahead. I have health insurance, I don't care. If I get sick, I know the quality of health care I will receive is top notch.

I didn't really think i needed to explain this point to it's very end.  OF COURSE you need world class doctors to make a world class health system but work class doctors alone do not make your system world class.  Training hard alone does not guarantee you success at the Olympics but it certainly is a vital part of the formula.

 



highwaystar101 on 09 May 2009
Tyrannical said:
highwaystar101 said:

That was a case I used to back up about four posts I had previously posted, more or less right before this post. you can't post about that without acknowledging the post where I spoke about my housemates because this was a hypothetical situation to back up the point that they made about national health.

 

You can't make shit up that is ridicuously wrong, then claim it backs up some hypothetical point you made, and then get pissed that I don't care your UK flat mates are nurses, as if that makes then some type of policy expect on health care in the US.

I have used the US health care system, and am quite happy with it. Most people in the US do not want nationalized healthcare, and if the Democrats keep pushing it they are not going to get re-elected. That's why Bill Clinton shut up about it ten years ago.

Let me illustarate it with a picture. This is how most (as in numerical majority) Americans feel about socialized medicine.

The hypothetical point is fairly sound IMO. The only way to deny that it isn't sound is by suggesting that your country does not have ANY poor towns/communities. Poor areas do exist in the USA, you may not live in one, but I'm pretty sure they exist.

I can guarentee that you are not seriously ill or injured to the point that you can't get a job and you are in and out of hospital every week. I'm very happy that you are not in this situation, so you can debate here about how great your system is.

If it wasn't for medicare I bet many of your poorer citizens who can't afford insurance or healthcare would be pushing for a national system of some sort.



TheRealMafoo on 09 May 2009
Tyrannical said:

 

lol, I love this pic.