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Forums - Gaming Discussion - DICE: No successful shooters on Wii due to difficult control scheme

So what it really translates to is the fact that they don't want to be bothered to learn how to do something different, so instead they'll just make something look pretty, and get suckers to gobble it up. Way to make mediocrity, DICE...



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Well I am going ot be fair here and say that he could potentially be talking about turning in a FPS and not so much aiming. Since the Wii mote does not recenter by its very nature it loses the springiness nature a mouse brings and constant calibration of dual analog for turning.

So if you aim in the upper left you start turning upperbleft and have to readjust your aiming to get a shot off. Essentially breaking the screen from the aiming and creating two different entities for control....Something that neither the mouse nor dual analog do. So to him it maybe it is a convuloted system that goes againstcommon sense and thus difficult to control and program for.



redspear said:
Well I am going ot be fair here and say that he could potentially be talking about turning in a FPS and not so much aiming. Since the Wii mote does not recenter by its very nature it loses the springiness nature a mouse brings and constant calibration of dual analog for turning.

So if you aim in the upper left you start turning upperbleft and have to readjust your aiming to get a shot off. Essentially breaking the screen from the aiming and creating two different entities for control....Something that neither the mouse nor dual analog do. So to him it maybe it is a convuloted system that goes againstcommon sense and thus difficult to control and program for.

That could be what they are thinking.... but it is perfectly solvable... in fact I think The Conduit has an option that does it, where however much you turn the Wii remote, the camera doesn't move.... turning is operated by the control stick (back to proper goldeneye roots) and it doesn't say where strafe is mapped to, but the only logical place IMO is tilting the nchuck, which would be awesome if true.

 



Well my personal experience with FPS on the Wii resumes to Prime 3 and Red Steel, but I found the controls on them superb, the Wii is perfect for shooters since your movements are much more fluid than with analog controlers, and it's up to par with the KB+mouse combo for pc's (And I've played most FPS's on PC since Wolf3D).
Also it doesn't need auto-aim for that same reason, so i'm guessing DICE just doesn't have much experience working with the layout of the wii controls, or they just don't want to learn how.



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I'm curious. Having not played CoD:WaW on the Wii... how does it handle sidestep and turning both? Which one of those is on the nunchuk, and which one is on the Wiimote? (I kinda assumed sidestep would be on the nunchuk)

Is the Wiimote control (is it sidestep or turning?) easy to use in places where a lot of strafing or turning fast is needed? Like in a multiplayer game where you shoot at fast targets and not molasses-y AIs?



 

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Procrastinato said:

I'm curious. Having not played CoD:WaW on the Wii... how does it handle sidestep and turning both? Which one of those is on the nunchuk, and which one is on the Wiimote? (I kinda assumed sidestep would be on the nunchuk)

Is the Wiimote control (is it sidestep or turning?) easy to use in places where a lot of strafing or turning fast is needed? Like in a multiplayer game where you shoot at fast targets and not molasses-y AIs?

I don't know for CoD personally... but this was my intitial thought at problems with fast paced FPS not long after the Wii launched (before I had played an FPS on it)

I believe the standard on Wii shooters follows that of the dual analogue shooter.... which is that the control stick is for forward/backward and strafing (or sidestep as you call it) while the IR pointer always has to have a bounding box or something similar to enable you to look up/down and to turn left/right.

After actually playing Metroid Prime 3 (only 3-4 months back), this does in fact work really well, but then MP3 isn't a fast paced multiplayer focussed shooter.

---------

What I thought of about a year and a half ago after playing RE4:Wii though, in addition to playing SSX Blur.... is that instead an FPS could control like this:

Control Stick up/down = Move forward/backward (obviously)
Control Stick left/right = Turn left/right (like the default in Goldeneye)

Nunchuck tilt left/right = Strafe left/right.
(This idea was from being able to do this to turn the board in SSX Blur)

The strafe and turn could be easily interchangeable of course, so you could still have strafe on the stick, and turn to the tilting of the nunchuck... but it seems more natural to me that tilting would be strafe.

The bounding box idea would still be needed to be able to look up/down. But for most FPS I know you don't need to look up/down moe than the screen allows very often, which means the bounding box could be the same size as the screen.
With the huge bounding box, you can freely aim anywhere on the screen and the character will not move..... but if you point off the screen the camera will rotate in that direction (so point up/down = look up/down, and point left/right = turn left/right) however you don't NEED to use the pointer to be able to turn, which would make it easier to aim and circle strafe at the same time.

 



i think he will change his tune, when ea says do a wii port of dice's games.



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Kasz216 said:

I mean.  It's not up to mouse.... but i'd say the numchuck is superior to Keyboard.

That's me though.

I could see the Wiimote being better for games that involve LOTS of strafing and moving around, aka highspeed shooters.

I concur with this sentiment: what you lose in aiming accuracy coming from a mouse, you gain in movement accuracy with the nunchuck so it is, at worst, a wash.

Also, in the long run, I might actually prefer the 'inaccurate' Wiimote to some degree since it makes preternaturally accurate shots a bit trickier. Of course i can't say that with any real authority since I haven't played enough FPS games w/ well-implemented controls on Wii (primarily because enough don't exist) but it leaps and bounds better than dual analogue something I, admittedly, loathe in FPS' due to their acutely cumbersome nature.




exindguy said:
Kasz216 said:

I mean.  It's not up to mouse.... but i'd say the numchuck is superior to Keyboard.

That's me though.

I could see the Wiimote being better for games that involve LOTS of strafing and moving around, aka highspeed shooters.

I concur with this sentiment: what you lose in aiming accuracy coming from a mouse, you gain in movement accuracy with the nunchuck so it is, at worst, a wash.

Also, in the long run, I might actually prefer the 'inaccurate' Wiimote to some degree since it makes preternaturally accurate shots a bit trickier. Of course i can't say that with any real authority since I haven't played enough FPS games w/ well-implemented controls on Wii (primarily because enough don't exist) but it leaps and bounds better than dual analogue something I, admittedly, loathe in FPS' due to their acutely cumbersome nature.

I wouldn't say it was a wash.  I'd think better aiming beats better manueverability in most if not all FPS.

I just think a mouse+Nunchuck type setup would probably work best for shooters.

 



Kasz216 said:
exindguy said:
Kasz216 said:

I mean.  It's not up to mouse.... but i'd say the numchuck is superior to Keyboard.

That's me though.

I could see the Wiimote being better for games that involve LOTS of strafing and moving around, aka highspeed shooters.

I concur with this sentiment: what you lose in aiming accuracy coming from a mouse, you gain in movement accuracy with the nunchuck so it is, at worst, a wash.

Also, in the long run, I might actually prefer the 'inaccurate' Wiimote to some degree since it makes preternaturally accurate shots a bit trickier. Of course i can't say that with any real authority since I haven't played enough FPS games w/ well-implemented controls on Wii (primarily because enough don't exist) but it leaps and bounds better than dual analogue something I, admittedly, loathe in FPS' due to their acutely cumbersome nature.

I wouldn't say it was a wash.  I'd think better aiming beats better manueverability in most if not all FPS.

I just think a mouse+Nunchuck type setup would probably work best for shooters.

 

As my second paragraph noted, I think that I'd probably prefer the less accurate aiming in the long run--I certainly have no complaints with it thus far.

I also still have (not so) fond memories of playing countless matches of Quake et al and, instead of being able to just barely crane my neck out, instead 'sliding' too far into the line of fire and having my head taken off, which is only partially remedied by PC games where you can tilt a hair out (but I'm fairly certain being able to glide just a hair out with analog would change that equation drastically).