Punch-Out and Sin and Punishment are the very fucking DEFINITION of hardcore.

Punch-Out was a game that was hard enough that all the kids on your block would revere you as a god if you could beat it.

Sin and Punishment is probably one of the harder games out there.

And both of these games are harder than 90% of the "hide behind a rock and watch your lifebar refill" cakewalk bullshit that passes for hardcore these days.

Hardcore was when you fucked up three times and had to start the game over. People need to learn to give credit where it's due.

i played punch out in nintendo age, i managed to beat it once because getting to tyson was a pain in the but,  and being "hard" doesn't mean its hardcore.... hell you can make tetris unbeatable and that doesn't mean its hardcore

where is the epic storydriven experience, blood, and pixel perfect enviroment.

seriously i only heard about sin and punishment when they announce 2, which had a blond kid with rocket launcher of something like it.

it looked a kid wakes one one day and have to save the world had a kh deyavu.

if sin & punishment its hardcore what its kh?

Now I'm sure he's either being sarcastic or a very stupid troll.

You cannot be serious.

Are you saying no NES game was ever hardcore, then?

Since when does a story make a game hardcore?

Sin and Punishment is an on-rails shooter, Kingdom Hearts is a brawler with RPG elements.

Generally games are easier to play these days. Nintendo specifically are more inclined to soften difficulty because of their audience but it would be ignorant to assume SMG shouldn't be easier simply because adults play it. It's a game for kids first and foremost and besides we are older and Mario was more difficult from our perception years ago.

don't listen to him he just goes into every thread saying the same thing that high budget epic games are the only games that exist and the rest is garbage.

You have the word "hardcore" confused with "games insecure little boys play to feel like grown-ups".

Indeed, he thinks Final Fantasy is the most hardcore franchise out there

Do you guys know what is a really hardcore game?

God Hand.

God Hand is a really hardcore game.

Also the chief reason I don't take review scores seriously anymore.

We get more reasons to not take reviewers seriously every day, like overlooking horrible driving controls in GTA4 and giving it a perfect score anyway. A PERFECT score should mean ZERO room for improvement.

My take on the situation is that "hardcore" does not define a game but a player. Most wouldn't consider Solitaire a "hardcore" game, but someone who plays 200 games of it in a single sitting is pretty damn hardcore.

I can understand saying that a game has attributes which typically appeal to only players of the hardcore nature, but "story" actually makes a game LESS hardcore, given that the game is attempting to offer you something other than the gameplay and your own grim determination to keep you playing.