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Forums - General Discussion - BAILOUT REJECTED

http://money.cnn.com/2008/09/29/news/economy/bailout/index.htm?cnn=yes

Thank God.  Printing MONEY is NOT the answer.



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I beat you to it:

AP: House appears to reject massive bailout plan



Appearing, and HAPPENING are different.



It'll be passed very soon though. They'll take out or put in a few provisions to satisfy 12 or so borderline voters and it'll pass.

Not that I want it to. Economic intervention by the government is inefficient and doesn't allow the free market to correct its mistakes.



Correction....hell its gonna take alot for correction here. Banks are not lending money, how the hell is there gonna be correction? Banks are not gonna say "well it didnt pass, guess we should lend now" Now, they are gonna hold their money. As you should know, since you know about free market, most companies do not have large cash reserves and work alot on credit lines. When credit line runs out, what happens? They don't have the resources to pay their workers, expand, etc. Also, small business, the core of an economy, are gonna have a horrible time getting reasonable loans. They are now, its only going to get worse. How do you propose ti will correct itself?

Plus, its not just printing money, they are selling bonds.



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Soleron said:

Not that I want it to. Economic intervention by the government is inefficient and doesn't allow the free market to correct its mistakes.

The free market cant correct its mistakes here.

MARKET FAILURE

When the market itself does no allocate resources efficiently due to: market power, externalities, public goods, and assymetric information.

http://www.economist.com/research/economics/alphabetic.cfm?letter=M#marketfailure



a system like ours cant fix itself b/c no a single part of it is looking out for the whole

but rather you have tons of little parts trying to get the best deal for themselves and not caring if it can hurt the other

until you have a system that feed from each other and not off you wont be able to count on it to fix its self



 

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Public opinion is running anywhere from 100:1 to 300:1 against passing this bill, according to sources on Capitol Hill. You must return home after you pass this package to ANGRY constituents with an election less than a month away. Given the massive size of this package, the fact that it rewards the guilty on Wall Street and does nothing to address the cause that anger is fully justified.
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Non-financial private debt is $32.4 trillion dollars1 as of 2Q 2008. Household debt is $14.0 trillion. Households lost 400 billion dollars last quarter. You wish to add $700 billion more in losses (via government obligations that taxpayers must cover) this quarter; this package is insignificant against the total bad credit outstanding. Federal capacity to “bail the system out” is insufficient.
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It will not and cannot work because the issue is trust, not money. There is lots of money (and credit) but it is being hoarded throughout the system. Consumer savings have gone from nothing to the highest rate ever in American history – in the space of a few months. Money is flying into Treasuries because of lack of trust, not lack of money. You must fix the cause of the problem, not apply band-aids.
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Commercial paper is being cited as the “lockup” that threatens an imminent financial train wreck. The truth is that commercial paper rates for “AA” rated non-financial firms is placing at a rate half that of a year ago as the Fed Funds target has been dropped from 5.25 to 2%2. With risk having increased the rate of return offered is lower? This is where the stress is coming from; at last summer’s rates this paper would roll. You are being gamed by Paulson and Bernanke; look at the table in the reference and you will see that even for “threatened sectors” rates are not materially higher than last year.
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If you pass this bill and the market implodes you will be held directly responsible. There are records of thousands of signatures across seven petitions faxed to you (at my expense) dating back to October of 2007 on this topic. Many experts, including Nouriel Roubini, “Mish” Shedlock, Dr. Faber, The Weiss Institute and over 160 economists have warned Congress that this proposed plan will not work. Are you prepared to face a full-page ad in the Wall Street Journal and/or USA Today exposing these facts?

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We only get one more shot at this; we have spent over $1.6 trillion thus far (by some estimates; $500 billion by others) attempting the same thing over and over again and it has not worked.



Soleron said:
It'll be passed very soon though. They'll take out or put in a few provisions to satisfy 12 or so borderline voters and it'll pass.

Not that I want it to. Economic intervention by the government is inefficient and doesn't allow the free market to correct its mistakes.

A financial market collapse would cause a domino effect onto other markets who would no longer have access to money. Fixing this is important but fixing it right is even more important.

 



Rath said:
Soleron said:
It'll be passed very soon though. They'll take out or put in a few provisions to satisfy 12 or so borderline voters and it'll pass.

Not that I want it to. Economic intervention by the government is inefficient and doesn't allow the free market to correct its mistakes.

A financial market collapse would cause a domino effect onto other markets who would no longer have access to money. Fixing this is important but fixing it right is even more important.

 

You say that like it's a bad thing.  Maybe if people lived within their means and stopped relying on lines of credits, this would have been averted decades ago.