dib8rman - You only bolded part of my sentence and you took it out of context to make your point.

How do you know this? Have you asked them all? Games are what have gameplay, not consoles, so unless you have played every game on those systems - including the huge library of downloadable titles, many of which are casual friendly - then you cannot possibly come to that conclusion.

You are misusing the word "core" too. Nintendo apologised to the core gamers after E3 for showing nothing that interests them. Nintendo's established fanbase are the ones that are gonna be the most disappointed unless they pull their fingers out and start making some new titles that appeal to them.

Liar said: This Wii isnt the much more powerful than the Gamecube. The Wii games will only look 1.5 better than GC games. Its nothing impressive compared to the 360. This is the year 2008, not 2001. Motion sensing has been done on the PC before. The wiimote ruins games. Hell Resident Evil 4 Okami and Zelda are better on the Gamecube or PS2.

 

So... You're either a troll or you take your screen name too seriously.

 

I find motion controls fun. If you don't, then I feel sorry for you, because they're gonna be the new control style for gaming.

Hehe. GameCube was standing next to XBox in certain strides, sometimes better, sometimes worse, but by tech experts they were seriously in a dead heat and tie for actual performance on screen.


I'll bet it's the name issue. If we were discussing XBox graphics power we wouldn't be using a 1.5x as powerful analogy. Instead, we're using some sort of GameCube1.5 analogy.


Let's realistically assume:
GameCube = XBox potential.

Therefore, Wii = 1.5 XBox's.

That said, even though probably more like 3 XBox's, the entire tone of the conversation would change. All one with the attempt to belittle "Wii power" is to mention GameCube, and they feel so good about it. But, read up any real graphics reports, and GameCube wasn't exactly behind.... if not ahead in a few key areas, but lacking a few others.

So, while looking back on GameCube as the Wii, it's easy to dismiss the fact that Wii blows the snot out of PS2's power and blows XBox pretty well out of the ballpark. But, you can just ignore that, and, ya know, troll.

horriblebastard said: dib8rman - You only bolded part of my sentence and you took it out of context to make your point. to core Wii owners PS360 doesn't have great gameplay. How do you know this? Have you asked them all? Games are what have gameplay, not consoles, so unless you have played every game on those systems - including the huge library of downloadable titles, many of which are casual friendly - then you cannot possibly come to that conclusion. You are misusing the word "core" too. Nintendo apologised to the core gamers after E3 for showing nothing that interests them. Nintendo's established fanbase are the ones that are gonna be the most disappointed unless they pull their fingers out and start making some new titles that appeal to them.

 

oh...trust me...we know...any Wii gamer doesn't like the gameplay of the other games..PD will always have a place in my heart...but I'm not gonna play with a crappy N64 controller again...any new shooter HAS to use IR aiming...the Wiimote owns all

 

I don't give a damn if LBP is awesome...but after playing it for a while..the first question will be 'what if ....with wiimote...'

it's a logical question...the Wiimote in itself brings so many possibilities...there's no need for buttons anymore...or hardly...just A and B...all the rest of the interfeca can be on the screen..

 

you truly sound like a fanboy ^_^

Simple I don't have to ask them all, 30 million Wii's tell me that 30 million people bought Wii's, regardless of what they think of the console that's 30 million people with Wii's.

Now who's throwing statements out of context? I'm speaking about the ones who buy software not the ones who don't which by the way in a string of articles today, (which was common knowledge to anyone on this site) NPD disclosed that the Wii sells nearly double (it's getting there even faster with every console sold.) the software of PS3 and a little less than double to the Xbox360. That means you'd have to add up the HD install base total software sold from 07-08 fiscal years to say what I said above, which is that for now, your correct in saying, more gamers preffer HD console values over Wii's values.

Probably before you were born people have been considering "what is game play." the software can be played sure, but (let's pull a Bill Clinton) what is play? The game is nothing more than electronic information on some medium, in the past consoles used to in your hands, then the controler become part of the player while the console was it's own entity. In fact the name controller means it is what controls or is used to control, Wii-mote is changing that to (slowly) motion control, in other words your body does the controling, combine that with the balance board and now 1:1 and maybe depending on it's usage the wii speak and you have yourself control using your body.

Sony hit this on the head with Eye toy, but the software or the game did not incorperate it well and the play sucked, thus the games sucked.
(The games had very bad tracking. This by the way is the same arguement used for Wiimote, but Wiimote isn't a peripheral and Eye Toy is.)

I paraphrased Nintendo when I used the word Core, they use the word core from a sales perspective, and I am speaking from a sales perspective, not from internet forum slang perspective. Nintendo apologized for what they did wrong at E3? Time will tell if they did something wrong, and I read that statement by Iwata and it was what it was, he stated that they had no intention of showing games that weren't ready to be shown, and that he's sorry for that. The narrative of the author is what claimed hardcore as being the ones he's apologizing to - the author wanted to feel like Iwata was apologizing to him, that's all.

So in short if your saying I'm using the word core incorrectly, then your saying Nintendo used the word wrong, I'd reccomend you call them up, just be polite and I'm sure they will refference you to wikipedia or something.

Anyway back to the second paragraph; the only legitimate and the only way that matters that consumers express that they like something is if they purchase that something, ("show me the money.") That's the point of business, 30 million Wii's sold, more software sales on Wii versus either the PS3 or 360, but of course you could argue: "Wii's install base is almost 50% it should be equal to both Ps3 and 360 for the fiscal year 08-09." I'd say that the Wii wasn't anywhere near 50% for the duration of that year, it's got a very short shelf life and thats all.

Remember consumers express their values by purchasing product. So, since the Wii sells faster and the software sells more (the Wii's core or in terms of sales the ones who appreciate the value of that product or in gaming that platform) it's very safe to say; not everyone needs the values of the HDTwins.

horriblebastard said: What games could only be possible this gen due to graphical advances? Oblvion? GTA4? GTA3 and Morrowind worked fine. The only game I can think of is dead rising, and that works on the Wii, so... Huh? You can't compare games with previous ones from a series like that! GTAIV is part of a series, but as a stand-alone game it would not have been possible without the power of the PS3/360/PC - at least not without being seriously gimped. It's funny how the only example you can think of is also being released on the Wii. lol. You guys are too much. Anyway, enough with this. I'm gonna bookmark this thread so I can dig it up in 5 years or so when you're all praising the Wii2's graphics so I can shout "hypocrite!" at each and every one of you. :P

 

Please do.  I stand by my argument.  I play roguelikes and love them.  Sometimes I even play games without graphics at all, like chess or dominoes!  Oh my!

 

I'll be on record to say that RE4 appeals to me due to the game-nature, mini games, puzzles, story.

I also like GTA4, if you take out the excessive racial stereotyping and gang-related bloatedness, and ditch the ghetto... I certainly like free roaming, but really, I play games to get away from life, not create a new one to hide in my bedroom with.

I loved Halo 1. Didn't care about the graphics. Sure, they were a plus. I also loved GoldenEye. Same story. Halo 2 was pretty good because of the increased school network playing... Halo 3? Same old game. Whoopie. Why do I want to pay $60 for a game I already have on Halo 2, let alone 1? I don't know...

I loved Mario Kart. I liked it better than N64. Better than DD. I liked DS and Wii even better. Why? Online. Not because the tracks were more cool, not because the graphics are so much fancier, but online play. I can play my old room mate in England. I can't do that with SNES. Don't care about the graphics. I'd just as soon play SNES instead of N64 mario karts.

I love Sim City 4. I played SNES SimCity, and still pick it up off of nostalgia once in a while. I'll play SNES City over SimCity 3000 any day... because I'd rather play SC4. Why? The regions allow some serious gameplay grand-ness. Not because of the graphics, but the options. Where SC3k lacks and SC4 picks up, SNES Sim City is more-game-like and is fun to sit down and beat a few levels on... it's more artful and enjoyable.

I've been playing Supreme Commander for a few days now, and to be honest, I'm not impressed. I could just play Total Annihilation instead, which I'm very familiar with. There's not much new. Shield generators, sure, but really? It's the same game... I'm not even thrilled to play it anymore. Hence, I am here typing now. Graphics didn't do it for me. I've played almost the SAME game before, and ten years earlier.

I don't need Halo 3. I don't need Square's latest cookie-cut-RPG. I -do- need intriguing, new games and gameplay, and NOT graphics... the MLB Power Pros that I'm addicted to. The infinite SimCity4 in building a 12 million population region. The X-Men Legends 1 and 2 where a hack-slash RPG turns into a party machine. I need the Wii Bowling, to play with relatives and drink until I can't find anything but the gutter.

One of the key weaknesses of the PS2, as opined by many, is its graphical capabilities. I believe this may be true. Setting aside the issue of gameplay vs. graphics I believe that if the PS2 is graphically underpowered this is having an effect on the sale of games for the system. Why? Because I believe it's easier to sell a game with new graphics than it is to make a unique game offering created by talented people.

The graphic capabilities of the PS2i have probably not been fully tapped but they are most likely fairly close to being fully realized. On an even more important note the graphics that the mainstream game buying public is demanding seem to have been satisfied on many fronts. Without the lure of new graphics, or indeed, even the need to produce them, the developer is faced with the dilemma of having to rely on the creation of engaging gameplay and talented execution.

For these reasons I believe the PS2 presents a challenge to developers that only the first and foremost of developers will be able to tackle successfully in a way that is popularly and critically pleasing.

 

Man that was more fun and satisfying than I would have thought. Yeah I'm late to posting.

Nicely put, .jayderyu. Man, nail on the head, thread should be dead. lol.

HappySqurriel said: RolStoppable said: horriblebastard said: I personally believe that Nintendo had lots of reasons to not go forward with HD on the Wii I think they didn't add HD because last generation they didn't do so well, so they needed to make a console that could be sold at a reasonable price and still make a profit, and because they were taking a risk with a new approach to controllers which may well have failed. Nintendo didn't add HD and more processing power because they believed that customers aren't interested in cutting edge technology. The sales of the Wii prove them right. I think there is a unstated qualifier that is missing from that statement though ... "Consumers aren't interested in cutting edge technology at the price" Realistically, if you gave a consumer the option to play two identical games one that is on the Wii and the other that takes full advantage of bleeding edge PC and (odds are) that they would favour the PC game; at the same time, you offer them the option to pay $10 more for a game, $200 more for a system, and tell them that the games will be shorter and released less often and they would probably think twice about the high-end graphics.

 

I don't agree, many people don't own an HD TV, don't know what all this HD talk is all about, and can't tell the difference.

People, in general, are (a) pretty stupid, (b) not very perceptive, and ( c) don't care.

They buy a Wii because they can handle it.  Yeah, there's someone in the family (teen, gamer, etc) that pushes to have a console in the house but the Wii is an easy sale.

Al Roker likes it, all their favorite TV and movie personalities like it, their kid/husband wants a game console.

Besides the Xbox 360 isn't significantly higher priced, in Europe it's cheaper.

Wii sells to the masses for the same reason PS2, PS1, and NES did, because it was the system to own.  People used Playstation and Nintendo interchangably with video games... so when the next person went to the store to buy one, they said "Let me get one of'em PStoos."  Just change it with Wii for the current gen.

Nintendo got it with the Marketing.  They put a Wii in every celebrities hand and got them on tape.

Sony did it 13 years ago with CG saying look at our games.... ooh... you can have games that look like this.  Now games look better than that CG, but the luster has worn off for the public.

More people own HDTV's today then 5 years ago, but I bet not that many more %-wise have them hooked up to anything that evan output HD.  Because people are stupid.

Edit:

In technical terms, yes, it is a weakness.

But Nintendo has used it's strengths to beat the competition.  While Sony and Microsoft were building up all of their weaknesses and not focusing on what people buy a console for.

(They buy it to get their kids to shut up)