By using this site, you agree to our Privacy Policy and our Terms of Use. Close

Forums - Sales Discussion - Is this a fair prediction?

So we're talking the 5 year mark for the PS3/Wii... and the 6 year mark for the 360? That's tough.

Ok.. so NOVEMBER 20th, 2011

I'll give it a shot:

Hmm...

First... expected retail price:

Wii - $129 (us)
360 - $99 (us) - cheapest sku
PS3 - $199 (us) - cheapest sku

 

Wii - 89 million
360 - 43 million
PS3 - 94 million

 

(By this time there will already have been an announcement of the Microsoft NeXtBox)

And honestly, I feel more secure about the PS3 and 360 prediction than the Wii... There's no way to tell how long that juggernaut will last. But we're talking 2011, and it is not HD capable... I have to think it has already made more impact than Nintendo could have ever hoped. All three of these companies probably have very different lifespan goals.

I think Nintendo and MS are not looking at the same 10 year lifespan that Sony has continually dedicated themselves to....

It will be interesting... I'll have to remember to come back to this thread in Nov. 2011 ... lol



PSN ID: free
Gamertag: X freestyle X
Around the Network

Blykmik, I respect your predictions but I think you're putting way too much stock in the whole HD thing. Most Wii gamers don't really care. It's impact on sales have proven this so why suppose it will later?



The rEVOLution is not being televised

I see a angry kid looking for attention here^^ In fact, he always seem so angry, poor boy.

As for my prediction:

Wii - 95 millions
360 - 36 millions
PS3 - 45 millions

Difficult to guess, but I think the final order is good at least



If we are starting from the start of this year, this is what I predict

Start Y1 Y2 Y3 Total
Wii 20m 18m 16m 16m 70m
PS3 8m 12m 15m 17m 52m
360 16m 8m 8m 8m 40m



Viper1 said:
Blykmik, I respect your predictions but I think you're putting way too much stock in the whole HD thing. Most Wii gamers don't really care. It's impact on sales have proven this so why suppose it will later?

Viper1,

You're right, but the HD thing was not my only basis in thinking that the Wii sales will eventually slow to "normal" growth. I'll get to that in a sec, but 89 million at the 5 year mark is huge... and only 11 million off from your prediction of 100 mill. No other Nintendo home console has gotten anywhere near that.

And like I said... the Wii prediction is a tough one. The supply constraints are obviously making it difficult to tell how high the demand is. Any way you look at it, the Wii is a huge sucess. It is just hard to predict for how long it will last because of a number of factors... High Def only being one of them. There is also the fact that a large amount of Wii owners are not necessarily Wii gamers (I'm one of those by the way... and I'm definitely a gamer). But we all know how mainstream the Wii has become... It is just that this type of energy doesn't keep up for ever. I would predict that *eventually* the Wii phenomenon will settle down and it will be back to gamers getting Wii (probably still in very respectible numbers).

But it took the PS2 5 years, 9 months to hit 100 million. And that is a crazy feat... If you look at the chart I linked above, the Wii is trending stronger than the PS2 and the PS3 is tracking pretty much identically (the 360 is tracking short). I'm a big believer that Sony has based everything they've done with the PS3 on a long term model with the specific intent to increase / improve lifetime sales the same way they did from PS1 to PS2. Sony was forced into the market earlier than they were ready (price wise) mainly because 1.) 360 beat them to next-gen by a year and 2.) they *needed*/wanted to assure Blu-ray mass adoption and "victory".

So this thread is asking about what will this gen's war look like at the end of 2011.

Besides the difficulting of guessing at the retail prices at that time (which has as much to do with sales as just about anything), you also have to project where the companies will be in terms of their 8th generation consoles. I think Nintendo is going to ride the Wii and do everything they can to keep it as sucessfull as possible for as long as possible... they've been making money since day one... and they have a hit. So they may be really able to set themselves up better than they imagined for whatever comes next... and they may have bought themselves quite a few more years than originally intended before they need to come out with something new.

For the 360, I'm pretty certain that IF Microsoft is going to stay in the hardware side of the gaming business, we'll already know about the NeXtBox by the end of 2011. Knowing Microsoft, it will likely be a kind of "mandatory" upgrade. They'll make Live better and more functional, they'll have a bigger optical disc (or a huge mandatory HDD... or both) and they'll take their 30-50 million existing customers and tell them you have to upgrade.

Sony has been clear that they're playing it out for 10 years... they've already got the large optical, they've already got the mandatory HDD, any conceivable peripheral can be added... the GUI firmware is extremely updateable, and they haven't even rolled out their friggin online service yet in Home. So even in 2011, we will NOT be hearing about the PS4. They're going to stick with the PS3 and rely on the fact that they don't think anyone will come out with something more "next-gen" than that... Kinda like how it is hard to see (for some people) the difference between SD and HD... How much better can the next Xbox be in 2011? And what will the price of it be? When the price of the PS3 at that time might be $199.

I don't think the Wii will be at 120mill in 2011 because I think the "innovation" of the control will wear off (and you may even see that type of control on the other consoles)... But they'll have all this money to come up with the next truly innovative thing... And they'll probably start of the next generation of consoles by themselves.. .and on their own. But I think with the Wii, Nintendo has distiguished themselves as something different than the PS3/360 home console. And I think they'll go with that because it obviously works for Nintendo.

Disclaimer: I own all three systems... And I have stock in MSFT and SNE.



PSN ID: free
Gamertag: X freestyle X
Around the Network

The chart you linked to has been repeated many times and refuted just as many. The problem with the chart is the staggered launches of the PS2 and PS3. You cannot compare them across all territories this way. Instead you have to look at each territory individually. I'll show you.

Japan:
http://vgchartz.com/hwlaunch.php?cons1=Wii&reg1=Japan&cons2=PS2&reg2=Japan&cons3=PS3&reg3=Japan&weeks=400


America:
http://vgchartz.com/hwlaunch.php?cons1=Wii&reg1=America&cons2=PS2&reg2=America&cons3=PS3&reg3=America&weeks=400

Total other:
http://vgchartz.com/hwlaunch.php?cons1=Wii&reg1=Total+Other&cons2=PS2&reg2=Total+Other&cons3=PS3&reg3=Total+Other&weeks=400

As you can see, the PS3 is not tracking evenly with the PS2 at all. In fact, if you replace PS2 with GC in those charts, you'll see that Europe aside the PS3 has been tracking closer to GC than PS2. Obviously it won't stay that way but it shows you how it's begun vs PS2.



The rEVOLution is not being televised

Viper1 said:
The chart you linked to has been repeated many times and refuted just as many. The problem with the chart is the staggered launches of the PS2 and PS3. You cannot compare them across all territories this way. Instead you have to look at each territory individually. I'll show you.

Japan:
http://vgchartz.com/hwlaunch.php?cons1=Wii&reg1=Japan&cons2=PS2&reg2=Japan&cons3=PS3&reg3=Japan&weeks=400


America:
http://vgchartz.com/hwlaunch.php?cons1=Wii&reg1=America&cons2=PS2&reg2=America&cons3=PS3&reg3=America&weeks=400

Total other:
http://vgchartz.com/hwlaunch.php?cons1=Wii&reg1=Total+Other&cons2=PS2&reg2=Total+Other&cons3=PS3&reg3=Total+Other&weeks=400

As you can see, the PS3 is not tracking evenly with the PS2 at all. In fact, if you replace PS2 with GC in those charts, you'll see that Europe aside the PS3 has been tracking closer to GC than PS2. Obviously it won't stay that way but it shows you how it's begun vs PS2.

I do understand the issue with tracking them from a single point because of the stagger in PS2 release dates, but at the same time you are looking at the total progress to date (or endpoint of the line). But looking at territories it makes it appear that the Wii is tracking at PS2 rates (or even less at some poitns) whereas looking at the full data seems to reflect the reality of the Wii success a bit more.

So you have to take into account a lot of things when making predictions for 5 or 6 years after a console launch. If I were only to look at the charts you link here, I'd be inclined to think the Wii totals will be less than when looking at the chart I linked. Since I believe the mainstream excitement over the innovation of the Wii will settle at one point and the trend will show it, you'd be led to belive that Wii sales will flatten at a lower number.

Only in Japan is there really some discrepency on the charts that you show with the PS3 and PS2 tracking. That's the one that looks pretty bad for the PS3 compared to the PS2. The other two charts show the trends a bit more parallel. And remember... I'm not only predicting based on these VGchartz. I'm taking into account a lot of other factors (in reality "guesses") about what will happen in the future.

I have a basic assumption that there is no way that the PS3 could ever have sold (in pure numbers) the same as the PS2 at launch (aligned or not) because the PS3 came in to the market at such a high price. So the growth and adoption I expected to track simillarly, but not the raw numbers. We know that price is such a huge issue here and the Playstation brand is strong (with 120mill units out there).  Price drops always see spikes and the PS3 has a lot more price drops coming then the PS2... over time.

I would dispute your assertion that the PS3 (in America) for instance is tracking with the Gamecube also. Give that chart a few more weeks and I think that will be more than clear (i.e.time to incorporate GTAIV, GT5P and even MGS4).

 

I'm not sure how to do it, but I'd love to see an aligned chart of worldwide sales for Wii/PS3/360/PS2 in the period from Dec. 1, 2007 to Today. I think that little "zoom in" of these sales might be of interest.



PSN ID: free
Gamertag: X freestyle X
blykmik said:


But it took the PS2 5 years, 9 months to hit 100 million. And that is a crazy feat... If you look at the chart I linked above, the Wii is trending stronger than the PS2 and the PS3 is tracking pretty much identically (the 360 is tracking short).


Your prediction isn't one I agree with but its a prediction so I don't see a lot of point in arguing about it since you've explained your reasoning.

However I've debunked this idea that the PS3 & Wii VS PS2 aligned launch graphs are directly indicative of future performance several times before. I'm going to copy and paste to save time:

 

Sqrl said:

WARNING: Critical thinking and the ability to read graphs required!

FACT: PS2 didn't start selling well until around week 40. Proof (this is due to a staggered launch FYI)

FACT: PS3 started to lag behind the aligned launches at around week 40. Proof

FACT: PS3 cought back up due to hitting the holidays which started to kick in around week 50 until around week 60. Proof

FACT: PS2 will pull away from the PS3 in 12 weeks when it hits it's holidays. Which is at week ~88 through ~98 in the aligned comparison you're using. Proof

FACT: PS2 was only on sale in Japan for the first 34 Weeks which is what caused this discrepency. Proof

Again if you don't account for offset launches things can be missleading, one console can surge while another idles. All you are seeing is a holiday sales spike lifting the PS3 up to the level of the PS2 temporarily, the only reason it did catch up is because as I said the PS2 didn't have a stellar first year. Take a look at this graph to see what I mean about the PS2's slow start. If you're going to use the PS2 as a barometer you need to understand the structure of its life. A console being on par with the PS2's early life is not unprecedented by any means. The GC, 360, Xbox, and PS3 all kept up for the first 40 weeks before falling behind.

By your logic the fact that at week 45 the Wii was more than double the PS2 in the aligned launches means that the Wii is destined to sell at least double the PS2. The Wii even managed to hold that pace all the way out to week 69 (the most recent week). But as this graph shows, the Wii isn't likely to maintain that ratio.

You know what...if you still don't believe me then I invite you to create a thread about it. I'm tired of explaining things to people too dedicated to the result they want to see anything else. I'll let everyone else explain why you're wrong since you don't want to believe me.

 



Note that this thread had gone on for a bit and I was a little frustrated with the person at the time =P In conclusion be careful when using this example that you know what you're talking about and you're using it properly...or someone who does know what they're talking about will probably make you look ridiculous.

 



To Each Man, Responsibility

wii will never get there

ps3 maybe

360 big no no

and your banned again? your my hero. a sony fanboy, i want to become just like you and get banned, seriously.



@Blykmik

I did state that American trends of PS3 selling like GC won't stay that way and you're correct that the line up this year will see to that. But up to that point, it was closer to GC than PS2 if you check the charts. Europe is by far the closest PS3/PS2 relationship but I think that was to be expected....PS2 had 80% of the market there.

This is as close to the charts you requested that I can get.

PS3/X360/Wii Dec 1, 2007 to today.
http://vgchartz.com/hwcomps.php?cons1=Wii&reg1=All&cons2=PS3&reg2=All&cons3=X360&reg3=All&start=39418&end=39565&weekly=1

I tried to do PS3/X360/PS2 Dec 1, 2007 to today but it just looks like 3 lines running from left to right...2 at the bottom and one at the top.


If you're wanting actual units between those dates, I can get that for you.



The rEVOLution is not being televised