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Forums - Microsoft Discussion - Rumor: Xbox Scarlet Devkit is late behind the schedule to surprise Sony

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What do you think

To surprise Sony 10 20.00%
 
It's late because Sony ar... 9 18.00%
 
It's just showed Microsof... 7 14.00%
 
They probably just rebuil... 5 10.00%
 
Who knows 19 38.00%
 
Total:50
setsunatenshi on 04 December 2019
Azzanation said:
setsunatenshi said:

1- That makes no sense. You say that a game not ending up in a goty discussion has "nothing" to do with it's quality? I would assume it's a metric, not a perfect one of course, but a metric to literally assess quality of a game compared with the competition. It doesn't mean that due to personal preference I wouldn't prefer game X over game Y, even if game Y had more critical acclaim. I'm not even talking about winning goty awards, just be in the contenders for most of the people that played them. My challenge was to go back through the generation and look for a 1st party MS studio games that were in that conversation. It's ok, I'll wait.

2- You understand my point very well, that's why you rebutted it predicting it somehow will change in the future. You go on about rumors of rumors, but the fact is, you tacitly took the point. 

3- Yep, they bought a couple studios in the last few years, that's true. So we'll see how they stack quality wise. This goes again to back up the point that quantity does not equate to quality, but I hope they do well. Like I said before, I'm really excited for Wasteland 3.

On the games comparison, I don't understand what you have against GT Sport, it's a pretty great racing sim. If something Polyphony should be releasing a lot more games. They take way too long to move from project to project, but usually the quality is top notch.

Regardless, it's absolutely obvious where the top quality first party games were this entire generation, but we don't need to discuss personal preferences.

1) There are plenty of games that don't end up in discussions for GOTY and are top quality. GOTY is dependant on a persons opinion/opinions. What I rate will be different to what you rate so that's no difference to how critics rate there GOTY. Hmm to name some games that would be GOTY discussions.. whatever you refer to discussion, but ill answer that anyway.. lets see, Ori and the Blind Forest, Forza Horizon 3 and 4, Gears 5 and I haven't even been home from work yet to look at my library of games, I am still at work writing this. (Ori isn't made by a 1st party studio however its a 1st party IP so lets not excuse that from this discussion of yours)

2) Well if I answered correctly with your point than great, you are agreeing that Xbox focus on different type of genres than Sony. Let me put it out to you that there are many type of game styles that aren't just Story Telling, Openworld 3rd person games. But lets digress.

3) A couple Studios? More like half a dozen studios. A bit of a understatement on your behalf. That's a huge difference in output, its pretty logically and obvious that 15 Studios will deliver more 1st party content than 6 Studios. If you think otherwise than I wont convince you, ill let you wait and see.

4) A very double standard post. You are trying to defend a game like GTS which was heavily criticized at launch just like the games you tend to nit-pick on, like Sea of thieves, State of Decay 2 and Crackdown 3. For the record I have nothing against GTS, I was doing what you are doing and picking games that got criticized and used them the exact same way you are with the Xbox titles. What's wrong with those Xbox games and why does GTS get a pass?

1- It should tell you a lot if the general consensus in videogame media is one of not including a single Xbox 1st party studio game in any of the Goty discussions for the entire generation. I try to stay away from my personal views on it, but it's pretty clear to anyone being honest with themselves that Xbox shat the bed this entire gen in their first party output, especially when compared to Sony WWS. I mean, come on...

2- You didn't present any correct rebuttal to my point, you moved the goalposts. Your rebuttal was "maybe they'll do better in the future". Great, so my point stands then.

3- Again, quantity does not equate to quality, and this was the crux of the entire argument. Obviously with more studios they will deliver more content, not necessarily better content. What's there to argue here? And they definitely haven't delivered great quality during this entire gen, when compared to their main competitors.

4- I don't really see any double standard. You're trying to compare absolute crap games with GTS? There's plenty of reasons to be disappointed with Polyphony in the last gens, but quality is not it. We're talking about 3 first party Xbox games with plenty of development time (at 2 of those being AAA titles), all of them scoring on the 60's on metacritic. Not to mention the huge support that has been given to GT Sport since deployment, the game is gigantic by now. So yeah, better think again.



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exclusive_console on 04 December 2019

I do not think power is going to matter. They both are going to have pretty much same or similar specs. Sony simply seems ahead. In fact if they undercut PS5 in price even having slightly lower performance it might probably help them. But they need to release on schedule. Even a month delay is going to cost them dearly.



 

Trumpstyle on 05 December 2019

Guys the old leak of Lockhart with 4TF, disc-less is back into the game. The Verge now saying Xbox anaconda is over 10TF, the old leak said Anaconda was 12TF with 16GB of VRAM. It's indeed possible to do 384-bit memory bus with 16GB Vram, you have 12GB running full speed and 4GB running at slow speed, so 12GB Vram for games (672GB/s bandwidth) and 4GB for the OS.

This might be the surprise Tom Warren is talking about, maybe Microsoft told game developers they were targeting 10TF to fool Sony but their plan was 12TF all along?

Lockhart 4TF, 12GB Vram, disc-less, $250

PS5 10,1-10,6TF, 16GB Vram + 4-6GB DDR4, $400

Anaconda 12TF?, 16GB Vram, $500

All will have 1TB SSD, the prices are just guesses, I still think there's a small chance Anaconda is 10,01TF as we have 3 people saying PS5 is stronger than Anaconda, but what are the odds of a leak in January this year nailing the 4TF lockhart, 10+ TF Anaconda and that both of them would have 1TB NVMe drive? Although the leak got PS5 wrong, thought it would be 8TF.

https://www.theverge.com/2019/12/4/20995436/microsoft-next-xbox-new-project-scarlett-lockhart-anaconda-launch-details

https://kotaku.com/sources-microsoft-is-still-planning-a-cheaper-disc-le-1840203823

Last edited by Trumpstyle - on 05 December 2019

6x master league achiever in starcraft2

Beaten Sigrun on God of war mode

Beaten DOOM ultra-nightmare with NO endless ammo-rune, 2x super shotgun and no decoys on ps4 pro.

1-0 against Grubby in Wc3 frozen throne ladder!!

Azzanation on 05 December 2019
setsunatenshi said:

1- It should tell you a lot if the general consensus in videogame media is one of not including a single Xbox 1st party studio game in any of the Goty discussions for the entire generation. I try to stay away from my personal views on it, but it's pretty clear to anyone being honest with themselves that Xbox shat the bed this entire gen in their first party output, especially when compared to Sony WWS. I mean, come on...

2- You didn't present any correct rebuttal to my point, you moved the goalposts. Your rebuttal was "maybe they'll do better in the future". Great, so my point stands then.

3- Again, quantity does not equate to quality, and this was the crux of the entire argument. Obviously with more studios they will deliver more content, not necessarily better content. What's there to argue here? And they definitely haven't delivered great quality during this entire gen, when compared to their main competitors.

4- I don't really see any double standard. You're trying to compare absolute crap games with GTS? There's plenty of reasons to be disappointed with Polyphony in the last gens, but quality is not it. We're talking about 3 first party Xbox games with plenty of development time (at 2 of those being AAA titles), all of them scoring on the 60's on metacritic. Not to mention the huge support that has been given to GT Sport since deployment, the game is gigantic by now. So yeah, better think again.

Views are views, depending what site you are on or where you live etc, they will offer different opinions for GOTY. Anyway I don't follow GOTY and could care less which games win GOTY because what I like doesn't need to win awards or have others like it. Maybe you need games to be in these so called categories to justify your purchases, but not for me.

You cannot claim what's quality on projects you know nothing about. You have no idea what quality these new studios will bring. We definitely know that quantity has been increase which was the main issue this gen for Xbox not quality apart from you nit-picking the mid ranged critic games.. funny story is all companies have them like I mentioned above.

Quote - "You're trying to compare absolute crap games with GTS?"

^ Is that right? And how is GTS a quality game while Sea of Thieves is a crap game? Are you basing this off Metacritic? Please explain the quality difference between GTS and SOTs? I am very curious to know how you rate this. Heck if you are basing this off Metacritic than I wouldn't be hanging your hat on a 75/100 score. Would you like me to mention all the Xbox games that received a higher score than GTS? Are you going to say those games are light years ahead of GTS in quality which will than put you in a spot of claiming Xbox has quality games because you believe GTS is. 

You are the one picking and choosing games like a Indy made Zombie game or a game that had a development disaster but for you to say these are absolute crap games is a poor argument. Want to explain to me why they are crap? Have you played them to make that call? No Man Sky was critically attacked at a 71 at launch and now sits on a 83 with its latest patches and expansion pacs etc. GTS and SOTs and State of Decay 2 are not the same games at launch. 



HollyGamer on 05 December 2019
Trumpstyle said:

Guys the old leak of Lockhart with 4TF, disc-less is back into the game. The Verge now saying Xbox anaconda is over 10TF, the old leak said Anaconda was 12TF with 16GB of VRAM. It's indeed possible to do 384-bit memory bus with 16GB Vram, you have 12GB running full speed and 4GB running at slow speed, so 12GB Vram for games (672GB/s bandwidth) and 4GB for the OS.

This might be the surprise Tom Warren is talking about, maybe Microsoft told game developers they were targeting 10TF to fool Sony but their plan was 12TF all along?

Lockhart 4TF, 12GB Vram, disc-less, $250

PS5 10,1-10-6TF, 16GB Vram + 4-6GB DDR4, $400

Anaconda 12TF?, 16GB Vram, $500

All will have 1TB SSD, the prices are just guesses, I still think there's a small chance Anaconda is 10,01TF as we have 3 people saying PS5 is stronger than Anaconda, but what are the odds of a leak in January this year nailing the 4TF lockhart, 10+ TF Anaconda and that both of them would have 1TB NVMe drive? Although the leak got PS5 wrong, thought it would be 8TF.

https://www.theverge.com/2019/12/4/20995436/microsoft-next-xbox-new-project-scarlett-lockhart-anaconda-launch-details

https://kotaku.com/sources-microsoft-is-still-planning-a-cheaper-disc-le-1840203823

You got wrong, the only correct one is Lockhart is being resurrected, it was canceled but then it resurrected again.

For the spec no one said it's 12 TF , it's just a speculation part from Tom Warren,  Both consoles will be equal probably both will be 12 teraflop or both 11 teraflop . And For the price Sony can just make the price close to Lockhart while still equal to Anaconda. 



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goopy20 on 05 December 2019

I think MS really needs a more powerful console at the exact same price point to be competitive. But even if they do manage to launch something more powerful, people will still flock to the ps5 because of it's proven track record of having the much better exclusives.



Trumpstyle on 05 December 2019
twintail said:
Trumpstyle said:


This might be the surprise Tom Warren is talking about, maybe Microsoft told game developers they were targeting 10TF to fool Sony but their plan was 12TF all along?

no

Indeed

HollyGamer said:
Trumpstyle said:

Guys the old leak of Lockhart with 4TF, disc-less is back into the game. The Verge now saying Xbox anaconda is over 10TF, the old leak said Anaconda was 12TF with 16GB of VRAM. It's indeed possible to do 384-bit memory bus with 16GB Vram, you have 12GB running full speed and 4GB running at slow speed, so 12GB Vram for games (672GB/s bandwidth) and 4GB for the OS.

This might be the surprise Tom Warren is talking about, maybe Microsoft told game developers they were targeting 10TF to fool Sony but their plan was 12TF all along?

Lockhart 4TF, 12GB Vram, disc-less, $250

PS5 10,1-10-6TF, 16GB Vram + 4-6GB DDR4, $400

Anaconda 12TF?, 16GB Vram, $500

All will have 1TB SSD, the prices are just guesses, I still think there's a small chance Anaconda is 10,01TF as we have 3 people saying PS5 is stronger than Anaconda, but what are the odds of a leak in January this year nailing the 4TF lockhart, 10+ TF Anaconda and that both of them would have 1TB NVMe drive? Although the leak got PS5 wrong, thought it would be 8TF.

https://www.theverge.com/2019/12/4/20995436/microsoft-next-xbox-new-project-scarlett-lockhart-anaconda-launch-details

https://kotaku.com/sources-microsoft-is-still-planning-a-cheaper-disc-le-1840203823

You got wrong, the only correct one is Lockhart is being resurrected, it was canceled but then it resurrected again.

For the spec no one said it's 12 TF , it's just a speculation part from Tom Warren,  Both consoles will be equal probably both will be 12 teraflop or both 11 teraflop . And For the price Sony can just make the price close to Lockhart while still equal to Anaconda. 

"Plans for Lockhart may change, but currently this console will debut with around 4 teraflops of graphical power." - The Verge

"one game developer briefed on Lockhart analogized it to the PlayStation 4 Pro in terms of raw graphical power" - Kotaku

"Microsoft is targeting more than 10 teraflops of graphical power on this particular console." - The Verge on Anaconda

What I'm pointing out there's a old leak saying that Lockhart was 4TF with 12GB Vram and Anaconda is 12TF with 16GB Vram, it looks like it nailed lockhart, maybe it will nail Anaconda too? But the same leak said PS5 was 8TF, so we might be looking at:

Lockhart 4TF, 12GB Vram, disc-less, $250

PS5 10,1-10,6TF, 16GB Vram + 4-6GB ddr4, $400

Anaconda 10,01TF, 14GB Vram, $500 OR 12TF, 16GB Vram, $500.

Seeing the specs and price, PS5 looks either to powerful or to cheap, I don't know where you getting your random TF numbers from.



6x master league achiever in starcraft2

Beaten Sigrun on God of war mode

Beaten DOOM ultra-nightmare with NO endless ammo-rune, 2x super shotgun and no decoys on ps4 pro.

1-0 against Grubby in Wc3 frozen throne ladder!!

HollyGamer on 05 December 2019
Trumpstyle said:
twintail said:

no

Indeed

HollyGamer said:

You got wrong, the only correct one is Lockhart is being resurrected, it was canceled but then it resurrected again.

For the spec no one said it's 12 TF , it's just a speculation part from Tom Warren,  Both consoles will be equal probably both will be 12 teraflop or both 11 teraflop . And For the price Sony can just make the price close to Lockhart while still equal to Anaconda. 

"Plans for Lockhart may change, but currently this console will debut with around 4 teraflops of graphical power." - The Verge

"one game developer briefed on Lockhart analogized it to the PlayStation 4 Pro in terms of raw graphical power" - Kotaku

"Microsoft is targeting more than 10 teraflops of graphical power on this particular console." - The Verge on Anaconda

What I'm pointing out there's a old leak saying that Lockhart was 4TF with 12GB Vram and Anaconda is 12TF with 16GB Vram, it looks like it nailed lockhart, maybe it will nail Anaconda too? But the same leak said PS5 was 8TF, so we might be looking at:

Lockhart 4TF, 12GB Vram, disc-less, $250

PS5 10,1-10,6TF, 16GB Vram + 4-6GB ddr4, $400

Anaconda 10,01TF, 14GB Vram, $500 OR 12TF, 16GB Vram, $500.

Seeing the specs and price, PS5 looks either to powerful or to cheap, I don't know where you getting your random TF numbers from.

New insider leaked said PS5 and Xbox Anaconda will be above 10 teraflop (kleegamer fan from Reset Era)  neither confirmed the number, Jason from Kotaku who  confirmed Lockhart resurrection also said PS5 and Xbox are on the same spec and power and both are very powerful. If Xbox Anaconda is 12 then PS5 will be 12 teraflop as well logically. But we still don't have the exact number for both, but both will be above 10 teraflop . The verge (Tomwaren) said Xbox will be targeting more than 10 teraflop and match the other insider above.

Tom warren once said "probably 12 teraflop, probably 12 probably 14 teraflop" That was he is speculation 

8 teraflop PS5 was probably the old number when PS5 were targeted at 2019 release date, They have change the plan in 2017 to release in 2020 . So the spec also have changed . Also remember it was also GCN number not Navi teraflop number. Old Spec number are bogus and already debunked because they said Xbox Anaconda are using arcturus which is stupid because arcturus is a server GPU that don't have capability of rendering graphic LOL. 



Pemalite on 05 December 2019

Flops are irrelevant.



--::{PC Gaming Master Race}::--

Technarchy on 05 December 2019
goopy20 said:
I think MS really needs a more powerful console at the exact same price point to be competitive. But even if they do manage to launch something more powerful, people will still flock to the ps5 because of it's proven track record of having the much better exclusives.

If Scarlett is incapable of matching or exceeding PS5 performance, it's a repeat of X1 vs PS4, which won't be good for MSFT. The only prayer Scarlett would have in that situation is a slew of exclusive, fully optimized AAA titles that look and run ridiculously well, and can't be had anywhere else, including PC.