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Forums - Nintendo Discussion - Astral Chain Debuts at No.1 in the UK

abronn627 said:

The easy answer to your comment is because they can and the others can’t.

They build their business model on the value of their games and their IPs, lowering the value because you need to sell something is good when you need to do it. I used the comparaison to show that even a second hand version, which is not influenced by the publishers anymore, can keep a high value for a long time, it’s not at the expense of the customers if they’re willing to pay said price. If it doesn’t fit with your value, there’s nothing I can say to make you accept to pay higher for a game you don’t think it’s worth the price asked and that’s you right.

But it’s easy to look at Nintendo the bad way now for it’s pricing policy, you also have to remember that before gen 7, this was normal practice. It’s not that I praise Nintendo for this, but I prefer when a game company can only depend on the sales of the game to be profitable and not fall in a full DLC and microtransactions pattern.

To be clear I'm not saying this game or that game isn't worth the price. I don't value a game by its price because if I did then that would imply I'm calling The Last of us a bad game cause you can find it for less than 20 euros/dollars nowadays. Is God of War a bad game cause it's not sold at a full 60 dollars right now? Nope, it used to sell at full price and now most people who will ever buy it already bought it so it makes sense to lower the price so that people that may not think of buying it now could be tempted into getting it. It's business as business should be. Something is very attractive on day one, the price is high, after a while sales come down as they are expected to eventually, the price goes down too.

But Nintendo would rather lose some "end of life" sales than to lower the price over time and that strikes me as anti-consumer. By that logic, food and water should be super expensive cause people can never stop getting those, the way housing and health care keep going higher and higher in price. How is that good for people?

But I digress. So how is Nintendo not going the way of DLC's and micro-transactions? Isn't BOTW containing not only DLC's that you must pay extra for but also hiding a hard game mode for that game behind a paywall? Doesn't seem like keeping their games' prices high stops them from making DLC's and making you pay extra to access the hard mode.

Like I said before, If I end up getting a Switch, either games end up coming down in price, even a very long time after, I don't mind that, or I will only buy a very limited amount of games, only the top ones (BOTW, Super Mario Odyssey, Metroid Prime 4, maybe that 2D Zelda recently released whose name I don't remember right now and that's it) and I will be fine with that. Not sure how it wouldn't be better for both Nintendo and I, that I buy a ton of games rather than just a few or even risk not getting a Switch at all which is still an option.

I think Nintendo's philosophy on pricing is similar to the one of luxury cars. Those companies know very well they'll never sell billions of cars but at the same time they never meant to, they're fine selling to a small elite minority who can afford to pay full price.



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Mar1217 said:
CrazyGamer2017 said:

Again their prices are good for THEM, and NOT for the consumer, and I'm not sure why some people almost religiously defend any brand and cheer for said brand in such a way that comes into contradiction with his/her own interests?

Regardless, I don't fully get this as it being the explanation for Nintendo's games prices holding in value over time the way they do. I mean your example of Horizon Zero Dawn and Zelda Breath of the Wild is a relevant one.

BOTH games have sold past 10 millions copies, both games are tremendous successes and both games are NATURALLY right now NOT selling much. Unless you want to argue that BOTW is number one in sales right now, I don't see why it holds in value. GTA5 which is completely crushing both BOTW and HZD put together in terms of sales can be found at a very low price so success has obviously nothing to do with how much a game is priced years after release.

There is something else going on here, I don't know what but Nintendo is not a good choice when it comes to consumer's best interest. Sure Nintendo much prefers to sell BOTW at full price even almost 3 years after release but I'm much happier with Sony selling their games at a very small price after that much time their games are released, it's much more interesting for me, the consumer and it's what the consumer should be looking into.

I don't know what the deal is so I cannot say for sure but I suspect Nintendo doing something to keep prices artificially high. Why else EVERY single other games publishers get their games selling at a very good price sometimes months only after release but not Nintendo?

You guys shouldn't be happy about this price issue, you shouldn't be applauding Nintendo for this cause it's NOT in your interest.

Given people just talked about the high resell value of those games on the second hand market, this actually become a good incentive for the consummer, since they can just trade it for a high price to fetch more games which mean they don't have to pay that much to begin with.

"Unless you want to argue that BOTW is number one in sales right now, I don't see why it holds in value."

No, it is not, yet it still charts high in most retailers list or even the eshop and just like GTAV, sells better than some new games coming out during the year. Note that BOTW 2 announcement also pushed renewed interest in the title, interest which doesn't falter in any way by the asking price.

It seems that the conflict in this situation comes from the fact that you just can't understand or are willing to understand the perspective of those who don't share your perspective.

You could also add that in the case of GTA, Rockstar is smart to sell it a lower price than it’s original RSP since they get more revenue from the Online component than the initial sale of the game. Growing the userbase is more profitable for them. I’m also pretty sure the game would still chart high at it’s full price, but that’s the best strategy for them.

And for Zelda, if your game doesn’t depend on DLC or mtx for it’s revenue and it can still sell 1m per quarter, you'd be stupid to drop the price.

On topic: I’m sure Astral Chain will have some decent legs over the next few weeks, not the evergreen level, but still decent.



Mar1217 said:
Given people just talked about the high resell value of those games on the second hand market, this actually become a good incentive for the consummer, since they can just trade it for a high price to fetch more games which mean they don't have to pay that much to begin with."Unless you want to argue that BOTW is number one in sales right now, I don't see why it holds in value."No, it is not, yet it still charts high in most retailers list or even the eshop and just like GTAV, sells better than some new games coming out during the year. Note that BOTW 2 announcement also pushed renewed interest in the title, interest which doesn't falter in any way by the asking price.It seems that the conflict in this situation comes from the fact that you just can't understand or are willing to understand the perspective of those who don't share your perspective.

A good incentive for the consumer (high prices) Not really. You seem to forget that if you pay a low price and re-sell it at a low price you ALSO end up not paying much, therefore rendering your argument for a high price moot. This not mentioning people who buy those Nintendo games as digital downloads which pay the high price and have no re-selling options at all. At least when I buy a Sony game at a low price as a download, I don't re-sell it but it's ok cause I paid almost nothing for it to begin with.

Also it's funny that you accuse me of not understanding others' perspective when in fact it's actually the other way around. Others' perspective seem to be the main perspective thus making MY perspective the one that guys like you don't seem to understand...

And all that without even adding the fact that MY perspective is pro-consumer which you seem to be viewing as a heresy. How dare I not want to throw my cash at Nintendo, no questions asked, no limits in quantity asked, what's wrong with me, right?



CrazyGamer2017 said:

One thing that bothers me with Nintendo games is (and correct me if this has changed) that their games don't come down in price over time.

Take Zelda BOTW for instance, it's been two years and a half since that game's release and if I wanted to buy it now I'd still pay full price which is a problem cause it means playing Nintendo games is very expensive.

Which means that if I ever decided to get a Switch I'd have to either spend a lot of money in games or only play a very limited amount of games, just the big names like Zelda, Super Mario Odyssey and Metroid Prime 4.

I don't mean to sound harsh on this one, but as a person who is considering getting a Switch pro (which hasn't been announced) and someone who is doubting buying a Switch pro based on joy con drift which will almost certainly be a non issue by the time that hardware revision comes out.... you are not exactly Nintendos key demographic, it will be around 4 years of the systems life before you make a move towards buying it, in that time Breath of the Wild has remained in and around the top 30 charts for the Switch for 1,460 days or so for the majority of the time it has been $60 (there was a sale where all major Nintendo games were $40 for a few weeks.) but I'm just saying Nintendo do pretty damn well with their business model of making software which holds its value for a long period of time by creating games which consumers are happy to pay 60 bucks for when they get the system because they know there's good times to be had with them. Heck I've played botw for nearly 500 hours now, buying the game and dlc for 80 in total that steal means per euro spent on the title I've gotten around 6 hours of play, there are some AAA titles I've bought for the same cost and played for less than 6 hours total.

But aye, as someone who isn't buying Nintendo games / systems your feelings on how they should price their hardware/software really isn't a key concern to them I would have to imagine.



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Shiken said:
Stefan.De.Machtige said:
Good news, because this more or less flopped in Japan as i gather.

No it didn't.  They just did not buy the collector's edition.  It is number 1 on the Japanese eshop as we speak.  The game seems to be selling well in all regions.

That is excellent news. Glad i was wrong then . Go Astral Chain trilogy!



In the wilderness we go alone with our new knowledge and strength.

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$60 is a fair price for a game, I don't find the cost of entry off putting.



Ganoncrotch said:

I don't mean to sound harsh on this one, but as a person who is considering getting a Switch pro (which hasn't been announced) and someone who is doubting buying a Switch pro based on joy con drift which will almost certainly be a non issue by the time that hardware revision comes out.... you are not exactly Nintendos key demographic, it will be around 4 years of the systems life before you make a move towards buying it, in that time Breath of the Wild has remained in and around the top 30 charts for the Switch for 1,460 days or so for the majority of the time it has been $60 (there was a sale where all major Nintendo games were $40 for a few weeks.) but I'm just saying Nintendo do pretty damn well with their business model of making software which holds its value for a long period of time by creating games which consumers are happy to pay 60 bucks for when they get the system because they know there's good times to be had with them. Heck I've played botw for nearly 500 hours now, buying the game and dlc for 80 in total that steal means per euro spent on the title I've gotten around 6 hours of play, there are some AAA titles I've bought for the same cost and played for less than 6 hours total.

But aye, as someone who isn't buying Nintendo games / systems your feelings on how they should price their hardware/software really isn't a key concern to them I would have to imagine.

True, I'm most likely not within Nintendo's key demographic. But that does not mean I am not entitled to an opinion or to disagree with their pricing, right?

Also what is it that you call their key demographic type of person? Someone who is ready to pay any price, no questions asked? Cause then I am most definitely not within their key demographic.

And yes I might get a Switch Pro should it ever release and be an actual improvement over the current model. Or I may not purchase it, all is possible at this point.

Oh and you got 500 hours out of BOTW? Impressive, I guess that makes every hour you spent on that game, rather cheap in price. Can't argue with that, but there's this game called EDF 4.1 on which I have spent close to 700 hours  (and still plan to spend some time on it cause there are some trophies that I believe I still can unlock) and I got that game in a sale for 10 euros so I won't even bother to do the math, few games can beat the price I paid per hour on that game if any.

You know you guys strike me as owning a Switch not because of the games but because of the price. It feels to me like you like those games specifically because they are expensive and remain expensive. I almost feel like should those games come down in price, that you wouldn't be interested in them anymore. And to be clear I'm not saying it's exactly what you are thinking, I'm just saying it's the impression you guys are giving me, based on your arguments in defense of those games prices over your personal financial interests.



Chrkeller said:
$60 is a fair price for a game, I don't find the cost of entry off putting.

To be clear, the pricing of any video game is in the absolute neither too high, nor too low. The perception of a price being too high or too low is purely subjective.

10 years ago I would have agreed with you as back then I used to pay my games at full price.

But now since video games prices come down by a huge margin, should you simply wait (the more you wait the better the price) I got used to paying low prices which are amazing deals when you think about it. As an example I paid 16 euros for Rise of the Tomb Raider, 20th Anniversary Edition. For those who don't know, that edition includes everything that came as an extra (DLC's, Extra Packs of stuff etc) Someone getting that game on day one would have paid not too far from 100 euros for the full base game plus the extra stuff and DLC's.

As a rule to myself, I don't pay more than 20 euros for a AAA game INCLUDING DLC's so what I do is wait for a "Complete Edition" on sale which on day 1 would have cost me past 80 euros, sometimes close to 100 and that I get for 20 euros or less.

So while you may not agree with me (I think we got that loud and clear) at least understand my perspective. I pay 20 bucks or less for FULL games, including DLC's and if I get a Switch I might have to pay 60 or even 80 euros for the complete version of the game. That's a shocker from my perspective. And I am interested in a future Switch Pro but I cannot in any sensible way ignore the pricing of games because they are radically different from Nintendo's competitors.

And while BOTW and Mario games and others are absolutely excellent games, they are by no means the only ones. It's not like I play crappy games on PS4 which would justify expensive games on Switch cause I'd be for the first time experiencing good games. I'd be going from great games (The Last of Us, God of War, Horizon Zero Dawn etc...) to other great games on Switch. Hence my balking at such a difference in Nintendo's pricing philosophy.



CrazyGamer2017 said:
Chrkeller said:
$60 is a fair price for a game, I don't find the cost of entry off putting.

To be clear, the pricing of any video game is in the absolute neither too high, nor too low. The perception of a price being too high or too low is purely subjective.

10 years ago I would have agreed with you as back then I used to pay my games at full price.

But now since video games prices come down by a huge margin, should you simply wait (the more you wait the better the price) I got used to paying low prices which are amazing deals when you think about it. As an example I paid 16 euros for Rise of the Tomb Raider, 20th Anniversary Edition. For those who don't know, that edition includes everything that came as an extra (DLC's, Extra Packs of stuff etc) Someone getting that game on day one would have paid not too far from 100 euros for the full base game plus the extra stuff and DLC's.

As a rule to myself, I don't pay more than 20 euros for a AAA game INCLUDING DLC's so what I do is wait for a "Complete Edition" on sale which on day 1 would have cost me past 80 euros, sometimes close to 100 and that I get for 20 euros or less.

So while you may not agree with me (I think we got that loud and clear) at least understand my perspective. I pay 20 bucks or less for FULL games, including DLC's and if I get a Switch I might have to pay 60 or even 80 euros for the complete version of the game. That's a shocker from my perspective. And I am interested in a future Switch Pro but I cannot in any sensible way ignore the pricing of games because they are radically different from Nintendo's competitors.

And while BOTW and Mario games and others are absolutely excellent games, they are by no means the only ones. It's not like I play crappy games on PS4 which would justify expensive games on Switch cause I'd be for the first time experiencing good games. I'd be going from great games (The Last of Us, God of War, Horizon Zero Dawn etc...) to other great games on Switch. Hence my balking at such a difference in Nintendo's pricing philosophy.

Here's the issue with your stance you paid that price for rise of the tomb raider but the game by SE'S own admission made back below what was expected. Now games series like those and others such as Deus Ex are in trouble as a result of people doing the same as despite the games having good sales they don't make back enough to cover what went into them.

This is why Nintendo has such a pricing approach as the legs in sales eventually adds up and covers costs hence why sales numbers for them have more significance per unit sold over time than a game selling in a bargain bin. You have your stance but so do others who are willing to put their money were their mouth is when it comes to games that appeal to them.

Your stance is understandable but accept it's why companies like EA and Activision now heavily focus on their current business practices with gaas and Mt. They push these to the point their games are built around them.



CrazyGamer2017 said:
Chrkeller said:
Nintendo eventually releases their games as greatest hits for $20 USD, but that takes a very long time.

If confirmed, the chances of me eventually getting a Switch just went much higher...

Thank you for the info.

I'll wait for that Switch Pro that might come up next year. No hurry, Nintendo, take your time!

The Switch Pro is the new WiiHD.

If I were you I wouldn't wait that long. We barely know about tomorrow in terms of our lives. The Switch is good enough right now. And when it's time to change, they will probably go full nex gen. The Switch already has two major modes, making a third one is a little overkill. I don't know about the future as I said, but I highly doubt there will be such a thing as "Switch Pro".

It's your life, it's your money. You decide.