Quantcast
The NFL Thread 2019, Week 10: Saints, Colts get Upset, Packers Hold On

Forums - Sports Discussion - The NFL Thread 2019, Week 10: Saints, Colts get Upset, Packers Hold On

Shaunodon said:
MTZehvor said:

This has...a lot of different problems with it and lacks a lot of the context that informed those decisions.

First, there's a substantial difference between just "spending money" on players. They opted to move on from Trent Brown because he was offered a (quite frankly absurd) $66 million contract from the Raiders (highest ever for an offensive lineman), with a whopping $36.75 million of that guaranteed. That comes out to a $15 million cap hit and an insane $36.5 million in dead cap year. Not only is Brown probably not worth that money, that kind of a hit is just blatantly unfeasible for a team that has $2 million in cap space atm. Brown is also scheduled to have a $21.5 million cap hit next season, which would knock out half of NE's cap space next year. Not only is this expensive, but it's a major risk, because if Brown gets injured, you've still got to pay $36.75 million to him (or whatever his hypothetical contract would be with NE), which destroys your ability to find a replacement. And let's not forget that Trent Brown has his own history with missing extended time due to injury.

(Also Trent Brown is being accused of domestic violence himself now)

Antonio Brown, conversely, is a much lower risk option. Not only is it a $10 million hit assuming he plays the entire season, but the entire thing contains no guaranteed money outside of a signing bonus which can be voided at the first sign of detrimental conduct. And, no, there has been nothing to suggest they still have to pay Brown. The grievance Brown filed is still underway, and Brown has been too busy getting kicked out of courthouses in Miami for unruly conduct to have any serious hope of winning that.

Finally, I'm not sure if you've been living under a rock or something, but AB's situation hasn't changed substantially since he was cut. No "charges" against him were dropped (technically there were no charges against him at all, since there aren't any criminal cases involving him), but every civil case that I'm aware of is still being pursued. The only one I'm aware of that's changed notably is the Britney Taylor case, which was dropped in order to be refiled at the state level. Brown is also still being sued by a condominium for "trashing" it, and throwing items off the rooftop of a building, one of which almost hit a toddler on the street below. And we haven't even mentioned him sending texts actively threatening one of his alleged victims.

If you think this is just some hit job by the media to sabotage the Patriots then idk what to tell you. You're either paranoid or you've spent too much time browsing Barstool Sports.

Charges dropped to be refiled in a different state, which I'm sure was just part of the plan all along, just like firing and hiring a different team of attorneys was also part of their plan all along. Meanwhile AB's agent is actively trying to get the NFL to hasten their investigation so that he can have his name cleared.
The whole throwing furniture off a building was something known about for a long time, and if you actually watch the video you'd know the couch was thrown into a pool, and the only way that toddler could've been hit is if he was actually in the pool, which would've made being hit by a couch a secondary problem to the fact he'd be drowning.

And no, I don't follow Barstool Sports at all. It's just not difficult to notice that this is the umpteenth time the media has started a witch-hunt against the Patriots or one of it's members. Much like now with them just recently trying to frame Brady as taking shots at his owner with a cameo on a netflix show, and then spending a whole interview session harrassing him with questions about it rather than checking the facts, which reveal the whole cameo was shot in front of a green screen, and that it was the producer who decided to change the backdrop to a massage parlour.


I'm not even gonna dig up past bullshit offenses like deflate gate either.
If you actually believe the media (especially their local Boston media) have any integrity to report the news as it actually happens, I can only feel sorry for you.

Sure, I agree, it probably was the plan all along. But don't come in here and claim that the case being refiled somehow constitutes that the "charges" (and incidentally there still aren't any charges filed in this case) are being dropped. None of the civil suits or allegations that were filed against him while he was in New England (or before) have been dropped. Claiming otherwise is just factually incorrect.

As for the furniture, he threw it into a pool area, and you'll note that quite a few pieces of debris wound up not in the water. The toddler wouldn't have to be in the pool for it to hit them. Not that that's an especially convincing defense: If the best thing you can think up is "Well it couldn't have hit a toddler, but any adults in the pool are fair game," then there might be something wrong with the guy...as if tossing furniture out of a sixth story floor isn't evidence enough of that already.

I won't sit here and pretend that there haven't been any times where I've been frustrated with how the media has handled reporting on New England, but you have to really, REALLY reach to argue that they've somehow been unfair to AB here. As you noted, the hotel charges were brought up and reported on heavily before his time with the Patriots. The only case that started during his time with New England was the Taylor allegations, which were filed long in advance before he joined the Patriots. AB already brought plenty of negative media attention with him long before he was in New England, predominantly at the end of his stay in Pittsburgh, and then in Oakland by, among other things, shouting racist insults and threatening to attack the Raiders' GM. There is quite literally proof that he texted an alleged sexual assault victim threatening to physically abuse them. This guy isn't some victim of a biased media here: He has done all of this to himself, and there (should) be no place in the league for the kind of conduct he's been involved with.

And, before anyone says it, yes, there are plenty of people who should not be in the league as well for the shit they've pulled. But the fact that there are other terrible human beings employed by the NFL doesn't give AB a pass. 



Around the Network
MTZehvor said:
Shaunodon said:

Charges dropped to be refiled in a different state, which I'm sure was just part of the plan all along, just like firing and hiring a different team of attorneys was also part of their plan all along. Meanwhile AB's agent is actively trying to get the NFL to hasten their investigation so that he can have his name cleared.
The whole throwing furniture off a building was something known about for a long time, and if you actually watch the video you'd know the couch was thrown into a pool, and the only way that toddler could've been hit is if he was actually in the pool, which would've made being hit by a couch a secondary problem to the fact he'd be drowning.

And no, I don't follow Barstool Sports at all. It's just not difficult to notice that this is the umpteenth time the media has started a witch-hunt against the Patriots or one of it's members. Much like now with them just recently trying to frame Brady as taking shots at his owner with a cameo on a netflix show, and then spending a whole interview session harrassing him with questions about it rather than checking the facts, which reveal the whole cameo was shot in front of a green screen, and that it was the producer who decided to change the backdrop to a massage parlour.


I'm not even gonna dig up past bullshit offenses like deflate gate either.
If you actually believe the media (especially their local Boston media) have any integrity to report the news as it actually happens, I can only feel sorry for you.

Sure, I agree, it probably was the plan all along. But don't come in here and claim that the case being refiled somehow constitutes that the "charges" (and incidentally there still aren't any charges filed in this case) are being dropped. None of the civil suits or allegations that were filed against him while he was in New England (or before) have been dropped. Claiming otherwise is just factually incorrect.

As for the furniture, he threw it into a pool area, and you'll note that quite a few pieces of debris wound up not in the water. The toddler wouldn't have to be in the pool for it to hit them. Not that that's an especially convincing defense: If the best thing you can think up is "Well it couldn't have hit a toddler, but any adults in the pool are fair game," then there might be something wrong with the guy...as if tossing furniture out of a sixth story floor isn't evidence enough of that already.

I won't sit here and pretend that there haven't been any times where I've been frustrated with how the media has handled reporting on New England, but you have to really, REALLY reach to argue that they've somehow been unfair to AB here. As you noted, the hotel charges were brought up and reported on heavily before his time with the Patriots. The only case that started during his time with New England was the Taylor allegations, which were filed long in advance before he joined the Patriots. AB already brought plenty of negative media attention with him long before he was in New England, predominantly at the end of his stay in Pittsburgh, and then in Oakland by, among other things, shouting racist insults and threatening to attack the Raiders' GM. There is quite literally proof that he texted an alleged sexual assault victim threatening to physically abuse them. This guy isn't some victim of a biased media here: He has done all of this to himself, and there (should) be no place in the league for the kind of conduct he's been involved with.

And, before anyone says it, yes, there are plenty of people who should not be in the league as well for the shit they've pulled. But the fact that there are other terrible human beings employed by the NFL doesn't give AB a pass. 

"There is quite literally proof that he texted an alleged sexual assault victim threatening to physically abuse them."
Before I have to continue going back and forth with you on this, how many of the pieces of evidence that you're discussing have you actually looked into? Because I can tell you right now there was nothing even close to him threatening to 'physically abuse' anyone, and that is quite a strong calim.

And for clarity, I'm not even here trying defend AB on any level as being some innocent figure, and when the Patriots first signed him I wasn't sure why they'd even want to bring that kind of problematic attention on themselves. But after doing it, then going on to cut him after 11 days when your team was clearly focused on trying to integrate him into the offense, and the reasons had nothing to do with what he'd done on the team or anything he'd even done in his duration with the team, just made them look totally clueless. And it's left the Patriots offense and several of the players looking frustrated every game, even though they're winning comfortably.
And what did it get them? Are the media going to forgive them now? https://www.sbnation.com/nfl/2019/9/23/20876383/new-england-patriots-antonio-brown-signed-released-bill-belichick

I figured if they were gonna sign AB they should at least stick with it and try to go the distance until there was a real sold reason giving them no choice but to cut him. Instead they totally caved within a matter of days and nothing but hearsay and media bombardment, which they should be used to anyway.



MTZehvor said:
Shaunodon said:

Sure, I agree, it probably was the plan all along. But don't come in here and claim that the case being refiled somehow constitutes that the "charges" (and incidentally there still aren't any charges filed in this case) are being dropped. None of the civil suits or allegations that were filed against him while he was in New England (or before) have been dropped. Claiming otherwise is just factually incorrect.

https://celebrityinsider.org/britney-taylor-drops-sex-abuse-lawsuit-against-wide-receiver-antonio-brown-329040/

"According to a report from CBS Sports, Britney Taylor, the woman who was suing the wide receiver, Antonio Brown, has dropped her civil suit against the football player. However, she reportedly intends to refile her suit at some point in the future."

"Furthermore, the latest documents show that Taylor’s legal team has changed since the original filing, including the addition of a new Florida-based lawyer, Andrew Knopf. Previously, Jonathan S. Abady was in the suit however, his name wasn’t included in the new filings."

Sounds like it's all on solid ground to you huh?



AB, guilty or not, is a piece of ****. I'm glad he is gone.



Where is the next week predictions? See this is why miss some Thursday games. If I have to wait till freaking Thursday to post I might get to work and forget about it before too late since I work second shift.



Around the Network
Shaunodon said:
MTZehvor said:

Sure, I agree, it probably was the plan all along. But don't come in here and claim that the case being refiled somehow constitutes that the "charges" (and incidentally there still aren't any charges filed in this case) are being dropped. None of the civil suits or allegations that were filed against him while he was in New England (or before) have been dropped. Claiming otherwise is just factually incorrect.

https://celebrityinsider.org/britney-taylor-drops-sex-abuse-lawsuit-against-wide-receiver-antonio-brown-329040/

"According to a report from CBS Sports, Britney Taylor, the woman who was suing the wide receiver, Antonio Brown, has dropped her civil suit against the football player. However, she reportedly intends to refile her suit at some point in the future."

"Furthermore, the latest documents show that Taylor’s legal team has changed since the original filing, including the addition of a new Florida-based lawyer, Andrew Knopf. Previously, Jonathan S. Abady was in the suit however, his name wasn’t included in the new filings."

Sounds like it's all on solid ground to you huh?

I mean, you're the one who claimed that her plan was to refile in FL from the start, so I'm not sure how this would change anything. It's rare to file a civil case in federal court anyway, so this may just be venue shopping.

But sure, let's assume, for the sake of argument, that all of this is fake. Taylor is just making all of this up as a cash grab. At the very least, AB has still thrown furniture out of a six story window (which came perilously close to hitting individuals), and sent intimidating text messages to an accuser. Both a doctor and a chef have accused him of skipping out on paying bills long before he joined the Patriots. He was both late and disruptive in the court case he was required to show up for. Unless you think the entire world, our judicial system included, is out to get AB, I don't really see an argument for how he isn't a terrible human.

sethnintendo said:
Where is the next week predictions? See this is why miss some Thursday games. If I have to wait till freaking Thursday to post I might get to work and forget about it before too late since I work second shift.

They're up Wednesday evenings. Set an alarm for Thursday mornings, if you forget that consistently.



MTZehvor said:
Shaunodon said:

https://celebrityinsider.org/britney-taylor-drops-sex-abuse-lawsuit-against-wide-receiver-antonio-brown-329040/

"According to a report from CBS Sports, Britney Taylor, the woman who was suing the wide receiver, Antonio Brown, has dropped her civil suit against the football player. However, she reportedly intends to refile her suit at some point in the future."

"Furthermore, the latest documents show that Taylor’s legal team has changed since the original filing, including the addition of a new Florida-based lawyer, Andrew Knopf. Previously, Jonathan S. Abady was in the suit however, his name wasn’t included in the new filings."

Sounds like it's all on solid ground to you huh?

I mean, you're the one who claimed that her plan was to refile in FL from the start, so I'm not sure how this would change anything. It's rare to file a civil case in federal court anyway, so this may just be venue shopping.

But sure, let's assume, for the sake of argument, that all of this is fake. Taylor is just making all of this up as a cash grab. At the very least, AB has still thrown furniture out of a six story window (which came perilously close to hitting individuals), and sent intimidating text messages to an accuser. Both a doctor and a chef have accused him of skipping out on paying bills long before he joined the Patriots. He was both late and disruptive in the court case he was required to show up for. Unless you think the entire world, our judicial system included, is out to get AB, I don't really see an argument for how he isn't a terrible human.

I thought I made this clear enough already, but I guess I'll state it outright: my argument is not that AB isn't a shitty human being, it's that the Patriots management knew what he was to begin with, signed him anyway wasting resources and time on him, then cut him after getting cold feet from the amount of media attention.

The whole situation has made them look totally silly, and I didn't even mention perhaps the most important aspect of the saga-- that they had traded Demaryius Thomas immediately after signing AB --who at the very least would have saved them trading away a 2nd round pick now for Sanu, and would've got them by until N'Keal Harry returned and got initiated in the offense.



So where are this week's predication? Am I being dense?



MTZehvor said:
Shaunodon said:

https://celebrityinsider.org/britney-taylor-drops-sex-abuse-lawsuit-against-wide-receiver-antonio-brown-329040/

"According to a report from CBS Sports, Britney Taylor, the woman who was suing the wide receiver, Antonio Brown, has dropped her civil suit against the football player. However, she reportedly intends to refile her suit at some point in the future."

"Furthermore, the latest documents show that Taylor’s legal team has changed since the original filing, including the addition of a new Florida-based lawyer, Andrew Knopf. Previously, Jonathan S. Abady was in the suit however, his name wasn’t included in the new filings."

Sounds like it's all on solid ground to you huh?

I mean, you're the one who claimed that her plan was to refile in FL from the start, so I'm not sure how this would change anything. It's rare to file a civil case in federal court anyway, so this may just be venue shopping.

But sure, let's assume, for the sake of argument, that all of this is fake. Taylor is just making all of this up as a cash grab. At the very least, AB has still thrown furniture out of a six story window (which came perilously close to hitting individuals), and sent intimidating text messages to an accuser. Both a doctor and a chef have accused him of skipping out on paying bills long before he joined the Patriots. He was both late and disruptive in the court case he was required to show up for. Unless you think the entire world, our judicial system included, is out to get AB, I don't really see an argument for how he isn't a terrible human.

sethnintendo said:
Where is the next week predictions? See this is why miss some Thursday games. If I have to wait till freaking Thursday to post I might get to work and forget about it before too late since I work second shift.

They're up Wednesday evenings. Set an alarm for Thursday mornings, if you forget that consistently.

Okay got it seemed some weeks up sooner.  I'll just do it every Wednesday night/Thursday morning when I get off work that way never miss another Thursday game.  I appreciate you filling in for rol this year and taking time to host league.



Chrkeller said:
So where are this week's predication? Am I being dense?

Right here. They go up on Wednesday nights (at the latest, sometimes earlier if I think I'll be busy on Wednesdays).

Standings are not up tonight, however, because I think I've figured out what's been causing the Thursday night prediction issues (more on that soon).

Shaunodon said:
MTZehvor said:

I mean, you're the one who claimed that her plan was to refile in FL from the start, so I'm not sure how this would change anything. It's rare to file a civil case in federal court anyway, so this may just be venue shopping.

But sure, let's assume, for the sake of argument, that all of this is fake. Taylor is just making all of this up as a cash grab. At the very least, AB has still thrown furniture out of a six story window (which came perilously close to hitting individuals), and sent intimidating text messages to an accuser. Both a doctor and a chef have accused him of skipping out on paying bills long before he joined the Patriots. He was both late and disruptive in the court case he was required to show up for. Unless you think the entire world, our judicial system included, is out to get AB, I don't really see an argument for how he isn't a terrible human.

I thought I made this clear enough already, but I guess I'll state it outright: my argument is not that AB isn't a shitty human being, it's that the Patriots management knew what he was to begin with, signed him anyway wasting resources and time on him, then cut him after getting cold feet from the amount of media attention.

The whole situation has made them look totally silly, and I didn't even mention perhaps the most important aspect of the saga-- that they had traded Demaryius Thomas immediately after signing AB --who at the very least would have saved them trading away a 2nd round pick now for Sanu, and would've got them by until N'Keal Harry returned and got initiated in the offense.

That's only part of your original argument, and not the piece I've been taking issue with. Your original argument was, and I quote: "I don't care what you think about how AB handled the allegations. They never existed until he joined the Pats, and as soon as he was cut and the media conveniently decided those allegation weren't news-worthy anymore, the charges against him were all dropped."

Claim whatever you want about the Patriots' management supposedly being "duped," or giving into pressure, or whatever, but there were plenty of allegations against him before he signed with the Patriots. Using a racial slur against a GM, the furniture incident, stiffing payments from people, etc. These were all widely reported when the stories initially broke. Again, I'm not a fan of the way the media has handled certain incidents involving the Patriots in the past, but this one was absolutely not some "clear job by the media," as you claim.

If you want to argue that the Patriots just buckled under pressure (personally I think it's just Belichick giving a troubled player a chance and seeing if he can get his shit in order, then as soon as the text happened he was out the door), we can have that discussion, but that's an entirely separate issue from arguing the whole thing is just some media scheme to get AB off the Patriots.